Thursday, September 21, 2017

Do most people on MIA believe all therapy and psych meds are bad?

Home Forums Community Do most people on MIA believe all therapy and psych meds are bad?

This topic contains 75 replies, has 14 voices, and was last updated by  The_cat 7 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 46 through 60 (of 76 total)
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  • #87520

    Selena Bertino
    Participant

    And about therapists: some are good and some are bad. And some are very, very bad. Most of the therapists at Western State Hospital aren’t really therapists at all, they are jail guards ready to bust any patient who steps out of line. And they like to tell the patients to trust them, like patients are that stupid. One of Reid’s past therapists used to use the word ‘arrogant’ to describe Reid all the time when she was documenting her encounter with him.
    I’m lucky to have a good therapist. She charges me the same fee I would have had to pay with a co-pay and nothing else. I don’t go through my insurance, and she doesn’t take notes…so everything really is just between me and her. I really hate the idea of having such personal stuff wind up in a medical record. People don’t realize that your records can be subpoenaed…I’m not very trusting of what the courts would do when it concerns my son.
    But mostly, I just like being able to say anything without worrying it’s going to go anywhere else.

    #87523

    oldhead
    Participant

    I’m glad to say I don’t feel attacked at all

    Whew!

    And now I have a lot of information/opinions to sift through!

    This all is the tip of the iceberg, believe me.

    I’m a registered nurse and I’ve always been pretty pro-medicine

    Humanbeing I think is/was a RN too…the thing is, psychiatry is NOT medicine, it is a system of control which uses the trappings of medicine to legitimize itself in the public mind.

    I was able to see maybe psych drugs might not be the best and only answer. But what was the answer then??

    What was the question?

    #87524

    oldhead
    Participant

    I don’t go through my insurance, and she doesn’t take notes…so everything really is just between me and her.

    Assuming she’s helpful, that’s one sign (two signs actually) of a decent “therapist.” And yes I acknowledge the existence of such, just have issues with the term “therapy.” At its best it can be a way of sorting things out and gaining insight. Though I still think it’s Russian roulette to a large degree.

    “Therapy” is way too general a term to have any real meaning; it encompasses many philosophies and techniques. Beyond that, it always depends on the individual practitioner and not whatever they call their particular brand of “therapy.” And more often than not “therapists” consider it their job to help you adjust to the system rather than recognize the system as the cause of your problems and resist it.

    #87525

    Selena Bertino
    Participant

    Selena Bertino wrote:
    I was able to see maybe psych drugs might not be the best and only answer. But what was the answer then??

    What was the question?

    I suppose I could’ve been a bit more clear. 🙂 I was asking a generic question about what to do when people have horrible symptoms of whatever kind…Reid really did have problems with depression and so did I. We both took about every med in the book, they not only didn’t work, they had nasty side effects. So, I guess that has an easy answer for us…we don’t take them. But neither of us have problems with depression anymore, what if we did? What are our options?
    And what about people who routinely live in a decompensated/psychotic/unlivable state? Reid says there’s an elderly man on his ward who doesn’t take any meds (he’s too weak to be a danger to himself or others), but he screams garbled words all day and most of the night. Reid says this man lives in hell, he looks so very unhappy. I can tell you that some of the ideas staff came up with made things even worse (putting him in a very dark quiet room…this really freaked him out). How do we help people like this man? Reid says it just seems so inhumane to let his man scream and scream.

    #87527

    oldhead
    Participant

    Selena before I get to that, do you know about Cindi Fisher and her son who was in WSH — if not please check this out immediately — maybe you could share notes: https://www.madinamerica.com/2014/03/mother-banned-treatment-team/

    #87611

    Selena Bertino
    Participant

    do you know about Cindi Fisher and her son who was in WSH

    I’ve known Cindi for quite a while and we talk frequently. She and I don’t agree on everything, but we’ve both experienced what Western State Hospital does to our loved ones. Whatever our beliefs, we do agree that the outcome is the same…WSH is one of the most dishonest, arrogant, broken, violent places in America. It’s a place to warehouse humans, it’s not a place to get better. It’s terrifying how powerful WSH is, it’s owned and operated by the state and it has enormous resources and the law behind it.
    Anyway, Siddharta is home with his mother now and she’s not having an easy time of it at all. So I go back to my question; such as how do we help people in need, especially those who can’t live on their own and are difficult to live with? Our society doesn’t offer much in the way of support, especially drug free support. But what would support even look like and not still be coercive in anyway? I can tell you that getting funds is like pulling teeth and I bet it only gets harder with the new administration. And it doesn’t help at all how ignorant the average person is…it’s amazing how many posts we get on our MentalRights facebook page from people who just don’t have a clue what they’re talking about. I’ve starting deleting the more rabid posts, but it’s pretty disheartening.

    #87617

    humanbeing
    Participant

    Yup, Selena, that is the question.

    In a perfect world there would be the resources to support troubled/drugged/in-the-midst of withdrawal persons.

    I have 2 friends who are in that situation, and they *aren’t* equipped to deal, so they grudgingly go along with the program and do the best they can.

    The economic system is to blame, maybe?

    #87620

    Selena Bertino
    Participant

    And yes I acknowledge the existence of such, just have issues with the term “therapy.”

    I didn’t have a problem at all with the term ‘therapy’ until I started to hear it all the time at Western State Hospital. They’ve poisoned the word in my opinion, because therapy is supposed to help, not harm. They use the term ‘therapy’ to mean ‘getting the patient to conform and behave in a passive manner’. Reid says that’s the sole goal of therapy there, getting the patient to be as little of a problem as possible. If the patient acts like he’s brain dead, staff has succeeded.

    #87622

    oldhead
    Participant

    All I can say is there are people around and at MIA working on alternatives support systems. But of course nothing much will change until the systemic problems which make people need such support are dealt with. These are primarily economic and political.

    #87648

    Matt Stevenson
    Participant

    Selena

    Regarding this, “no one in the hospital seems to even agree what his diagnosis is”; this is unfortunately all too common as you are now probably quite aware… since psychiatric diagnosis has no validity and poor reliability.

    For more see here – https://www.madinamerica.com/2014/09/how-reliable-is-the-dsm-5/

    And also here – http://1boringoldman.com/index.php/2012/10/31/but-this-is-ridiculous/

    I hope Reid can get out of the hospital someway, somehow, relatively soon…

    #87726

    Reid Bertino
    Participant

    These are primarily economic and political.

    And ignorance and bigotry. And laziness and hatred. These are the other reasons for the lack of support.
    Reid told me last night when I talked to him about this thread, that it’s easier and cheaper to throw drugs at the problem than to offer the kind of extensive support some people need.

    #87746

    humanbeing
    Participant

    It occurs to me that the lack of resources to support those who have become ‘psychiatrized’ is also an issue for a plethora of other social ills:

    Benny King and the Criminalization of Addiction in America

    note the claim that addiction is a ‘brain disease’ and their solution to the mass incarceration of addicts is proper ‘treatment’

    huh

    Maybe that’s a place to start as far as ‘organizing’?

    • This reply was modified 8 months, 1 week ago by  humanbeing.
    #87769

    oldhead
    Participant

    Reid told me last night when I talked to him about this thread, that it’s easier and cheaper to throw drugs at the problem than to offer the kind of extensive support some people need.

    Which is economic and political in essence. Of course ignorance and bigotry are tools used to perpetuate this.

    #88262

    Explorer86
    Participant

    I can’t speak for anyone else, but I don’t essentialize drugs in terms of “angels” and “demons”. I think this is one of the biggest mistakes our materialist culture has made.

    To completely ignore personal set, social setting, context, intention, dose, method of ingestion, mood before ingestion, polypharmacy and a plethora of different factors that lead to one person experimenting with heroin for a while and not having any problems and another person becoming a stereotypical “junkie” completely immersed in a certain type of (self)-destructive culture for years and years and overdosing several times, committing crimes against others persons and property and then dying from a mixture of 5 different drugs is to make a fatal mistake that completely misses the point.

    I recommend Norman Zinberg’s Drug, Set and Setting. It’s a classic and a good starting point to the topic of drugs in society.

    #88266

    oldhead
    Participant

    “Set and setting” I believe were first used by Timothy Leary in reference to the LSD experience, though maybe he got it from somewhere else.

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