Saturday, April 4, 2020

Thank you, MIA Community

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Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 18 total)
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  • #32829
    uprising
    Participant

    Hello everyone,

    I am new to commenting here, but have been reading this site thoroughly since late winter of this year. Not long before that, I was completely unaware that there was any kind of c/s/x movement, any objective critiques of biomedical psychiatry, or any viable alternatives to the current dominant system of “care.” I had for years been almost completely ignorant of the context in which so many important decisions in my life had been made. I had not yet read Mad In America or Anatomy of an Epidemic. Actually, from 2010 to late 2012, I was incapable of reading much of anything, due to severe, debilitating withdrawal symptoms from Remeron and Paxil, not to mention withdrawal from alcohol, which had become a euphoric in combination with Paxil. Earlier, in 2010, I had come to the conclusion on my own, and with minimal support, that I had to get off of the psych drugs I had been prescribed in various combinations since 1998. By listening to my body, rather than the “experts,” I had finally figured out that they had made me sick, were keeping me sick, and would eventually kill me.

    From that point on, I have not wavered, but for a long while, I thought I was alone. A great number of the posts and comments on this site have since made me see how very mistaken I was in that regard. So, I would just like to thank everyone involved in this site for the added validation and hope you have given me. As of May, I have been free of yet another prescription drug, and I am finally in the process of tapering off the last one. My physical health and mental well-being improve with every change. It is a challenge, but I am glad to be so close to the end of this rather harrowing, yet crucial journey. I would also like to thank everyone for the ongoing education I continue to receive every time I visit here. I am gradually “recovering” (in the only meaningful sense of the word) my Self. Every person who has contributed here has helped me in some way to do that, even if only by adding to the ongoing conversation. There are so many truly inspirational figures here, for whose existence I am whole-heartedly grateful. Thanks to you all!

    In solidarity,
    For human rights without exceptions,
    For effective, informed care for those in distress who seek it,
    up

    #32910
    -Anonymous
    Member

    Awesome to hear! Thanks for telling everyone.

    Another story of self help, self education and personal responsibility. It’s not a ‘nice’ thing that we have to clean up the horrific mess made by psychiatric ideology in our lives, but nobody else is going to do it.

    You sound like an inspirational person. Be sure to stick around, there is always more to contribute and more to read and learn in this complicated issue of psychiatry’s impact on society and the people in it.

    #32911
    -Anonymous
    Member

    “For human rights without exceptions,”

    and yes, I did notice this, that’s what we want.

    #32922
    uprising
    Participant

    Thank you so much for the kind words. I have been greatly admiring your writing for some time.

    And I am glad that you venture into the MIA catacombs sometimes! Seriously, I wonder why the forums don’t get used more here. It seems like there is so much potential…

    #32926
    -Anonymous
    Member

    Maybe we should bring the forums back into vogue up-rising.

    So what are your favorite books in the critical psychiatry realm?

    #32942
    uprising
    Participant

    It definitely seems worth a try!

    I am really just getting started, and so far I have only read Whitaker’s two critical psychiatry books. I am glad you asked though, because it allows me to ask you in turn for your own recommendations. What would you read next?

    It is off-topic, but I really have to express my appreciation for your two comments yesterday on <ahref=”https://www.madinamerica.com/2013/08/long-term-antipsychotics-making-sense-of-the-evidence-in-the-light-of-the-dutch-follow-up-study/&#8221; title=”Joanna Moncrieff’s “Long-Term Antipsychotics” post” target=”_blank”>. I thought the 5:52pm comment was an artistic achievement that should be posted on the door of every locked ward and similar outpost of inhumanity in every place in which people claim to value human rights. So many things you have written on this website have been truly excellent, and I thought that this comment was among the most powerful that I have read. The 6:40 post, while equally impactful, was also hilarious (vending machines and psychiatric nurses and “psychiatry’s goon squad”!). I very much hope that when my abilities of concentration, self-expression, etc., have returned to normal (as I know they eventually will), that I will be capable of writing something half as inspiring as you have done.

    #32943
    uprising
    Participant

    Sorry. Messed up the link somehow, I think. I’ll try it again:

    #32944
    uprising
    Participant

    Ha, ha! Never mind. I’m obviously going to have to figure out later how to do that.

    #32947
    -Anonymous
    Member

    It definitely seems worth a try!

    I am really just getting started, and so far I have only read Whitaker’s two critical psychiatry books. I am glad you asked though, because it allows me to ask you in turn for your own recommendations. What would you read next?

    It is off-topic, but I really have to express my appreciation for your two comments yesterday on <ahref=”https://www.madinamerica.com/2013/08/long-term-antipsychotics-making-sense-of-the-evidence-in-the-light-of-the-dutch-follow-up-study/” title=”Joanna Moncrieff’s “Long-Term Antipsychotics” post” target=”_blank”>. I thought the 5:52pm comment was an artistic achievement that should be posted on the door of every locked ward and similar outpost of inhumanity in every place in which people claim to value human rights. So many things you have written on this website have been truly excellent, and I thought that this comment was among the most powerful that I have read. The 6:40 post, while equally impactful, was also hilarious (vending machines and psychiatric nurses and “psychiatry’s goon squad”!). I very much hope that when my abilities of concentration, self-expression, etc., have returned to normal (as I know they eventually will), that I will be capable of writing something half as inspiring as you have done.

    Uh oh… you made my face sink when I heard that ‘I very much hope that when my abilities return’ comment. I have things I wrote during my years in psychiatry, and things I wrote even 2.5 years off psychiatric drugs, that sound like absolute garbled non-mastery of the English language.

    I don’t know your approximate age, but so called ‘cognitive function’ does improve with years off psych drugs. It’s not easy to tell you where to read first, I’d say read the entirety of the following websites and watch all the videos and listen to all the audio at the following places:

    https://www.szasz.com/

    The Thomas Szasz cybercenter for liberty and responsibility

    http://openparadigmproject.com/

    Also this one above, the Open Paradigm Project, has some great videos from real people who’ve survived it all, the system, the labels, the drugs, etc. Great to watch.

    http://www.madnessradio.net/

    Madness Radio is the best alternatives to psychiatry radio show in the world, with over 150 hours of podcasts to listen to, this radio show is awesome with hundreds of interesting guests, journey into critiques of neuroscience, stories of survival, the history of psychiatry and much more.

    http://www.blogtalkradio.com/davidwoaks

    Above is a link to MindFreedom’s own radio show, there are many hours of informative listening about the issues that matter to you in human rights and mental health. Get to know who we are.

    http://psychrights.org/index.htm

    Psychrights.org, the Law Project For Psychiartric Rights, is an extensive and comprehensive resource about all legal aspects of forced psychiatry.

    And then books…. you see I think i’ll wait, I’ll prepare a list.

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 7 months ago by -Anonymous.
    #32968
    uprising
    Participant

    Hey anonymous, thanks for taking the time to bring these websites to my attention. They seem like excellent places to start and should keep me busy for a little while!

    I also appreciate your remarks regarding your own writing and “so called ‘cognitive function.'” I’ve had little moments of long missing clarity and creativity springing up here and there since I started tapering the second to last drug, so I know that improvement is possible for me too, and I’m hopeful for the future. If there wasn’t a seizure risk, I would be quite tempted to c/t this last one. It’s difficult to be patient because I want my brain back, but I’m tapering it as quickly as I feel is safe right now. In any event, it’s nice to at least (and at last) have a finish line in sight.

    #32969
    -Anonymous
    Member

    Good for you. My controversial no doubt, advice, would be to avoid like the plague, any of the internet forums collectively known as the ‘drug withdrawal community’. Floating around these forums are holders of some very inflexible ideas who brook no criticism in their zeal to enforce ‘their way’, which they’ve decided is ‘the right way’, of withdrawing from drugs. I know that if I’d frequented these scaremongering, biased sites, I could well have failed instead of succeeded at getting off psych drugs. If you’ve found a pace that feels safe for you, go for it, the number one thing about escaping from psychiatry is taking the plunge and believing in your own truth. It’s courageous for anyone to stop taking drugs they were led to believe were the only thing standing between them and bad things. The drugs are toxic, for sure, but have faith in your body’s ultimate ability to clean house. The human body is more intelligent than we know. As the months and years drag on you’ll get sharper and sharper and have nature’s bounty at your disposal, as was your birthright all along.

    Negative voices that try and tell you the drug withdrawal is gonna do this, gonna do that, try and keep them out.

    Far far far more important than the mere clearing out of some chemicals from your body, is clearing out those horrible ideas that psychiatry puts into a person’s mind. Ideas of learned helplessness, self defeat, dependency.

    #32987
    uprising
    Participant

    I am very grateful for all your encouragement, anonymous. I must admit that I don’t understand the controversy at all regarding the “drug withdrawal community.” That is, I don’t understand why it is controversial for you to say that – for you – cold-turkey was the way to go, nor do I see why it is controversial for other people to say the opposite about their own experiences. Perhaps I have missed something?

    I have never participated in any of those websites, but I have been aware of several of them for some time, and have found their information to be very useful. I found them particularly useful in terms of validating my own experience of prolonged (perhaps even still continuing) SSRI withdrawal (or whatever one wishes to call it), when I couldn’t get anyone in the world to admit that what I was going through was anything other than “proof” that I needed to be on some “meds” or other. That validation was important to me when I was literally bent in half for months.

    Having said that, I do agree with you completely that one should listen to one’s own body. But then, that also seems to be what the slow-taper folks are saying. I suppose this is where it gets confusing for me. I suppose it is not clear to me how anyone is trying to “enforce ‘their way.’” I haven’t seen it here. I do realize that you were commenting specifically on other sites, but I have visited some of them, as I said, and I didn’t detect any of that. But, again, perhaps I have missed something.

    Sometimes the comment threads can get confusing to read when they become very long and tangled, but it seemed to me that, in comments on a recent post, you asked some important questions that deserved to be answered but were not. There were also important questions asked by that person that went unanswered, although they were not explicitly directed at you. They did at least seem to be directed at those participants with a similar viewpoint as your own. It seemed like things became very stand-offish very quickly. I think it is unfortunate that no one’s questions were answered. I wish that no one had been treated dismissively. It seems like there could definitely still be a dialogue there. I think it’s understandable that passions run high on certain issues, but it is sad to see things break down like that. I imagine it to be the kind of thing that those who think of us all as less than human must salivate at reading… You strike me as someone who can appreciate forthrightness in others. I hope you don’t mind my thoughts on this, and I would genuinely like to understand the situation better, if that is possible…

    With respect.

    #32991
    -Anonymous
    Member

    OK let’s take the following:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-acute-withdrawal_syndrome

    Common symptoms of post acute withdrawal syndrome are:[15][16][17][18]

    Psychosocial dysfunction
    Anhedonia[19]
    Depression
    Impaired interpersonal skills
    Obsessive-compulsive behaviour
    Feelings of guilt
    Autonomic disturbances
    Pessimistic thoughts
    Impaired concentration
    Lack of initiative
    Craving
    Inability to think clearly
    Memory problems
    Emotional overreactions or numbness
    Sleep disturbances
    Physical coordination problems
    Stress sensitivity
    Increased sensitivity to pain
    Panic disorder[14]
    Generalized anxiety disorder[14]
    Sleep disturbance (dreams of using, behaviors associated with the life style)

    ___________________________

    With drug withdrawal and drug damage, things like TD, permanent movement disorders etc, are very evidenced to have been caused by drug damage.

    There is a BIG difference between feeling anxious and your facial muscle movement being disfigured.

    I have no quibble with these autonomic things like blood pressure problems upon standing up, that’s clearly biological….

    But for someone to tell me that they can ‘prove’ that they are now checking if the door is locked 10 times because they took an SSRI for ten years!??

    It’s just not proven. And when things aren’t proven, it’s unreasonable for people to expect blind deference and everyone to fall at their feet and say ‘yes, I accept that everything you say is caused by your drug withdrawal, is caused by your drug withdrawal’.

    Obviously taking psychiatric drugs is not a good idea… they are dangerous things, and people run into all sorts of problems. Research has not proven they ’cause’ complex behaviors such as suicide. I don’t accept these sorts of claims. These sorts of claims, are the mirror image of psychiatry saying some ‘brain disease’ causes suicide.

    People can have a best guess on what to blame, but we are talking about complex human lives here. Too often in the ‘drug withdrawal community’, a much greater emphasis is placed on pseudobiological speculation, and not enough on the complexity of human life.

    I am speaking in terms of demonstrable scientific facts. People’s subjective reality of their situation, where they blame drugs for all sorts of problems, is no doubt real for them. But they would do well to stop acting like the evidence that SSRIs ’cause’ the things they say they cause, (which seems to be absolutely any behavior, feeling or thought under the sun), is somehow comparable to the evidence for the theory of evolution.

    We’ve had people claiming down to the IQ point, what they’ve lost. All I say is, admit it’s a guess. Admit it’s your best guess! Be humble.

    #33001
    -Anonymous
    Member

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-15265317

    The above, is a radical reinterpretation of the assertion that alcohol causes violent behavior. I think it is brilliant.

    What I have to say about drugs and complex human behavior is not refined enough yet, I admit, for people to see where I’m coming from without them getting really angry with me.

    I just think we should have a more nuanced approach to drugs and behavior. A lot of people seem to think drugs have magical powers to take over free will.

    #33005
    uprising
    Participant

    Thanks for sharing the article. It was brilliant! I enjoyed it.

    “What I have to say about drugs and complex human behavior is not refined enough yet, I admit, for people to see where I’m coming from without them getting really angry with me.”
    That is a good insight to have, in my opinion, because most of the controversy in general on the topic in question seems to have been caused by (understandable) misunderstandings and emotional reactions.

    “A more nuanced approach to drugs and behavior” seems entirely reasonable to me, as did everything you had to say in the post above that one. Thanks for breaking it down a little bit for me. I was going to say that I wished anyone one with opposing views would find it down here in the tombs, but then I was glad to see that you had posted an expanded version of sorts in the relevant thread. I really hope people with differing views from your own will read it and respond to it. I may not agree with everything you said there, but I do think it’s all reasonable and worth considering – and responding to, if anyone feels strong enough disagreement with any of the points you made. That would be so much better than the silent treatment (which is dismissive) or a rhetorical circular firing squad (which is pointless).

    “Be humble” is good advice for everyone, in my opinion. I don’t think too many people would argue with that.

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