Saturday, December 15, 2018

Comments by Jolly Roger

Showing 38 of 41 comments. Show all.

  • These doctors must be held accountable, and the survivors should be entitled to financial redress. Lets move from justified anger to action. Stop these guys from passing out drugs in the present.

  • Adolescents and young adults are placed under immense pressures to conform to societal norms in their aspirations. So this of course is when those things seen as disorders emerge, like “mental illness” and “eating disorders”.

    It is also because the middle-class family exists for no other reason except to psychically main and scar children. The adults live in bad-faith, and they do this by having children and exploiting them.

    Never solve any of this in a psychotherapists office, as the therapist is themselves part of the problem. To deal with it, need to go into the court room, and into the political realm.

    Book Recommendation:
    https://www.amazon.com/Somebody-Elses-Children-Struggle-Americas/dp/0517599414/ref=sr_1_5?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1503432049&sr=1-5&keywords=john+hubner

  • Lynne, let me try to understand you better. So you are actually giving people psychiatric medications in order to study their spiritual effects?

    Who is prescribing these medicines? Are you doing this? Is someone else doing this?

    You must realize that so long as people think they need chemicals to reach altered states of consciousness, then we are going to have a nation of children and adults addicted to prescription and street drugs, plus alcohol. And as long as people believe that seeking altered states of consciousness is the best way to deal with their experiences of injustice, then we will forever be a nation of tuned out zombies, unable to organize and fight for justice.

  • Lynne, if you are giving prescription medications to people in order to conduct experiments in ‘spirituality’, this may be unlawful.

    I am looking into this.

    Though I am not a big fan of any kind of licensing shrinks, if you are giving out prescription medications unlawfully, then I will press until federal law enforcement arrests you. I will go after your licensing, insurance, and your consulting office landlord, and your book publisher too.

    I have already put a group of 4 brothers pushing street drugs into our state prison, so I am not new to this kind of territory.

    Even if it cannot be established that you are now breaking any law, I will continue to monitor the situation.

  • No one can have power over the parents except a court. And the only way the court can serve the child is if the child is being represented by an attorney.

    Without this, then any kind of a therapist is simply a hired accomplice abuser for the parents.

    Mandatory Reporting is indeed our most important legal advance. It seems like many in public practice do at least try to live up to it.

    But in private practice, not at all. The implicit understanding is that since the parents contacted the therapist, and such a good therapist at that, that therefore they are always to be held blameless. Most middle-class child abuse seems to involve doctors of one sort or another, otherwise it would be illegal.

    As I see it, the middle-class family is an extremely dicey institution at best. It only even exists because it is charged with exploiting and abusing children.

    The best alternative example which I have ever heard of are the Israeli Kibbutzes. They work because they take the 24 hour a day pressure off of parents, and they largely stop parents from using the child to give themselves social status.

    So there is always some mix of the child staying with the parents, and staying in the children’s home under assigned adult caretakers.

    This way you have back up. If there is a problem at one end, the child has refuge in the other place, until the problem is resolved.

    Reading:
    https://www.amazon.com/Somebody-Elses-Children-Struggle-Americas/dp/0517599414/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1502829199&sr=1-1&keywords=john+hubner%2C+somebody+elses

    This is about the Juvenile Dependency Court and Social Services, and the extremely difficult situations they have to deal with day in and day out.

    I am convinced that only with something like Kibbutzes, is this every going to change.

    You can’t just tell people not to have children, because the vast majority will never listen.

    So as it is now, people are told, you gain adult status by having children.

    If there are then problems, all you have to do is start reading some medical books and driving the child to doctors and getting them to do as many tests as possible, and you will gain the upper hand in dealing with the child, and you will be looked at as a saint and a martyr.

    And then you can also start driving the child to psychotherapists and disabilities doctors. Thus again you will get a lever over the child, and you may even be able to get them drugged.

    And then, even if you child does not end up seeing doctors as a juvenile, if you can make them believe they have something wrong with them, they will probably be seeing doctors as an adult, and so you the parent will be made to look right.

    And if there are still problems, you can always say that the child has a moral defect, and this is just about the only industrialized country in the world which will let you disinherit them.

  • The issue is not what letters they have after their name. Lots of good people have curious histories.

    Jeffrey Masson is fully trained and certified as a Psychoanalyst, and until he published his book, he was curator of the Sigmund Freud Archives.

    https://www.amazon.com/Against-Therapy-Emotional-Tyranny-Psychological-ebook/dp/B008KPZRDW/ref=sr_1_2/136-3019966-6573558?ie=UTF8&qid=1502828232&sr=8-2&keywords=Jeffrey+Moussaieff+Masson

    The issue is, are they practicing or advocating any of the following: Psychiatry, Psychotherapy, Recovery, Religion, or Mood Altering Medications of the Street or Prescription type.

    If the answer is YES, then if we allow it, survivors are always going to be told that their experiences of distress are things which they need to solve inside of themselves, instead of by legal and political action.

    If the answer is YES, and we allow it, then survivors are going to be abused. Its what anti-rape advocates have long identified as 2nd Rape. Its not that the survivors are necessarily not believed, its just that what they say is going to be treated as their own problem, not “just getting over it” soon enough, or for making too big a deal of it.

    Woman comes to a police station to report that she was raped. At the counter she hears, “Well have you looked at what you can do to help you get over it sooner? Have you looked at how you might have caused this? You know, you have to forgive, you have to. We have therapists available, we have recovery programs, and we even have eclectic therapies. And then we have prescription drugs. Unlike street drugs, these are not illegal, and the quality control is extremely high. Insurance covers them. And then we have bio-feedback, and dance therapy, and transcendental meditation. The most important thing you have to learn is that you can’t go thru life carrying stuff around with you. You can’t blame other people for your problems. We have many therapy and recovery resources available to you. But it is you alone who is responsible for your own recovery.

  • “I don’t know why we are bashing Dr. K here”

    The reason is very simple. Unless you refute and stand up to psychiatry and psychotherapy, then these will always be offered as the way to turn any problem back onto the victim. We need to adopt a zero tolerance position.

  • While I would never try to outlaw the practice of psychotherapy between consenting adults, I do not think that we should be allowing our government to license it.

    And psychotherapy is a societal menace. People who have lived in the harshest of situations, are being convinced that their problem and its solution lie within themselves.

    If you live in an unjust world, you don’t heal from it, and you don’t recover from it. You either find ways to fight back, or you follow psychotherapy and the recovery movement, and become an Uncle Tom.

    And then as it stands now, all the licensing really does is allow parents to be taking their children to these doctors, with a large degree of impunity and absolution of responsibility.

  • Dr. Kelmenson, It sounds like you are trying to make the case that people who are sad, or angry, need some kind of treatment. I would of course disagree with this. I say that the most important first step is to teach them how to tell off doctors.

  • Ron, medical doctors do indeed help in the healing of broken bones. And that is my point about why psychotherapy is wrong. You folks are taking people’s experience of distress, their experience of injustice, and making it into something like a broken bone, something which needs to be fixed.

    So you are taking those who are marginalized, like the poor and children, and saying that their own experience of distress is an injury. Not the cause of the distress, but their experience of the distress.

    So if we can help build on the court cases which make this tortious, we can then start contacting your clients and opening their eyes and helping them to see what you do to them. We should be able to get them to sue you.

    And if we can follow up using sidewalk protests to put you out of business, then that will mean that many less parents driving their child to a therapist because that is how they manage their relationship with the child. Sure people fool medical doctors, MSBP. But with doctors who already want to turn the experience of distress in a victim into an injury or illness, and so they don’t need to be fooled, that is far worse. So the sooner you are out of business, the less familial child abuse.

    Mandatory reporting was supposed to solve this problem. Sounds like most in public practice do report. But with those in private practice its a pact between the therapist and the parents that there will not be any reporting. After all what could possibly be wrong when a child is delivered to the office of a therapist believing that they have something wrong with them, and so that the therapist can exploit this vulnerability and break them?

    I’m not suggesting that the practice of psychotherapy between consenting adults should be criminalized, I’m only saying that the government should not be issuing licenses. This does nothing to protect the public, it only means that our most vulnerable are being made subject to abuse without the recourse of legal redress.

    So if we can revoke the licensing, and then start suing more and more psychotherapists and then follow up by running them clean out of business, then that will be that many less people being abused.

    And then if we can go to the next step and show specifically how therapists are targeting children and marketing to their parents, for the treatment of non-existent illnesses, and in order to help the parents break the child’s spirit, then we should be able to get that prosecuted in International Court as Crimes Against Humanity.

    “Crimes against humanity are certain acts that are deliberately committed as part of a widespread or systematic attack or individual attack directed against any civilian or an identifiable part of a civilian population.”

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimes_against_humanity

  • Why does anyone go along with the idea that ANY mood altering chemicals are good for them, street, prescription, alcohol, drug tests and placebos?

    We should be educating people to reject all of it, and taking the prescription psych meds off the market, and getting the white coats who give it to children prosecuted in the international court for Crimes Against Humanity.

  • Ron, I live in the same world as you and everybody else do. One of the MO’s of psychotherapy is to show pity. This is what you are trying to do now.

    It is not going to work, because I know that the only way to deal with a psychotherapist is to defend myself.

    I know that many people believe that psychotherapy has really helped them. Many people feel the same way about psychiatric medication, and about alcohol, cocaine, and heroin too. I’m not actually suggesting prohibiting the practice of psychotherapy between consenting adults. No, I just want to de-license it and educate people against it. And children must be protected from it, except when they are being represented by an attorney in court.

    It is all just abusing the survivors of abuse, trying to make them believe that their desire to fight back is an illness. It is not that they have endured hardship, it is that they want to fight back which the therapist finds so alarming. If the therapist opened themselves to that, then they would have to face their own pain. The reason the therapist is a therapist is that they have found a way to rationalize not facing their own pain.

    Its like Jeffrey Masson writes about both conventional and eclectic psychotherapies, “The practice of psychotherapy is wrong because it is profiting from another person’s misery.”

    Fortunately some are starting to get wise to this:

    http://website.lineone.net/~vex/How%20Therapists%20Abuse.htm

    http://www.wmlawyers.com/firm-highlights/publications/therapist-abuse-and-therapist-malpractice-cases/

    And they have recognized that ‘transference’ is the key juncture when the therapist has the most power to do harm.

    http://www.wmlawyers.com/firm-highlights/publications/a-comprehensive-overview-of-therapist-abuse-litigation-in-california/

    Now, admittedly, these lawyers are still saying, Good Therapist – Bad Therapist. I don’t go along with any of that. But at least these lawyers are suing some of them.

    So about transference, Freud saw that at some point in the psychoanalysis, most of his clients became extremely angry with him. And of course, because they have talked themselves out only to find that their analyst does not stand with them, he offers pity, but he stands with the parents and with existing authority.

    So Jeffrey Masson, former curator of the Sigmund Freud Archives writes about this:
    https://www.amazon.com/Against-Therapy-Jeffrey-Moussaieff-Masson/dp/1567510221

    At some point, the therapist will have let the client talk themselves out and then start making excuses for violators and just telling the client that no matter what, they just have to live with it and there is nothing which can be done.

    And Ron, you are doing this already. No one should ever put up with that. I certainly don’t. I mean, this is the sort of thing anti-rape activists have always called second rape.

    But therapists try to do it with every client. Once you make the issue be about trauma and bad feelings and memories, you are making it about the client, instead of about the abusers and societal injustice. You are saying that their non-denial is a moral and medical problem.

    And then when this therapy is being done on a minor, when they are not being represented in court by an attorney, but it is just being done at the behest of the parents, there are not words to describe what an outrage that is, or why the law must act.

  • Some people are teaching children how to refuse to submit to corporal punishment, in the schools. They are teaching them who to call, and just how to refuse. And they seem to be trying to have people ready to appear on site to intercede. And this is often being done when the parents have signed a consent to corporal punishment form.

    I can provide more info about this.

    Well we need to be doing the same thing about psychotherapy, teaching children how to resist it, no matter how they ended up in the therapists office. First we need to do role playing showing them what the therapist is and what they do, and how they will groom clients to gain their confidence, and then how they use that against them ( what they call ‘transference’). And then we need to be teaching children how to resist, how to get out of the office, or how to stand their ground and make sure that the therapist knows that they are not afraid of them, but that they detest them, and we need to have people ready to intercede on site, and who are not afraid exercise the power of Citizen’s Arrest, and then have lawyers on standby. And we need to make sure that children know about all of this.

  • By talking about these things as ‘Recovery’, like say recovering one’s sanity, or recovering from alcoholism, or recovering from child abuse, or recovering one’s balance or one’s momentum or social standing, we are still turning it back on the survivor, making like it is their problem and they that need to recover.

    This is the problem with the concept, because it turns the experience of injustice into a self improvement project.

    People who drink, drink for reasons, mostly because their feelings of injustice are not affirmed.

    People who have survived the abuses of the family, suffer everyday because they are always being told that they are deprived and that they have to deny their feelings and to stop telling the truth.

    People who have had their social identities shattered are told to deny and to try to fit in.

    The concept of recovery, just like the concept of psychotherapy, is completely bogus. And so if one wants to be able to live, they need to instead learn how to politically organize and fight. And the first place to start is to cut off all therapists, and to make it known that their actions are not welcomed, and to find ways of talking political actions against therapists.

    And any therapy performed on a dependent child has to be considered forced. And if the child is not being represented by an attorney in court, then that therapy is an extreme form of criminal child abuse. If it is not being punished under US law, then it should be prosecuted under international law. Just as a minor cannot consent to sex, a minor cannot consent to the mind fucking known as psychotherapy.

  • Julie wrote: “I personally got better because I realized that going to any sort of shrink, healer, doctor, etc, was verifying the disease state and sustaining me as an ill, disabled person.”

    Yes, going to any kind of a healer, even an ‘alternative healer’ is sustaining you as an ill person.

    But so to is saying things like, “I personally got better…”

    If two parents took their child to a psychic, it is not impossible that both those parents and the psychic could eventually get hauled into court, and it might not go well for them. They could all be held accountable.

    But if the parents take their child to a government licensed therapist, like our Michael, then as he is state approved and authorized, it is very unlikely that any allegations could ever get made against any of them.

    And of course Michael’s business model depends upon holding the parents blameless. After all, how could there be anything wrong with them if they are picking such an enlightened therapist as Michael, to help them solve the problems going on between they and their child.

    This is the main difference between the middle class and the working class. The middle class hires its own private practice doctors, where as the working class has to accept what public services are offered.

    I learned this from the Milan School.

    It is actually far easier to protect the children of poor parents, because they are always having contact with social services of one sort or another.

    For the well off, it is like Michel Foucault being sent in the 1930’s to a psychoanalyst, mostly because he did not seem to fit in, and because his homosexuality was starting to develop.

    When a parent insists on finding a doctor who will affirm their view, “There is something wrong with this kid”, we call that Muchausen’s Syndrome by Proxy, or just Medical Child Abuse.

    https://www.amazon.com/Sickened-Memoir-Munchausen-Proxy-Childhood/dp/0553803077/ref=pd_lpo_sbs_14_t_0?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=820JEZX3RTDRXV1CV0KK

    But when it is not only the parent causing it, but there is also now a brand of doctor who have built their business on catering to parents who want confirmation that there is something wrong with their child, and when the private practice version of these doctors will never report the parents to authorities, that is a much more serious problem.

    The main problem with ALL FORMS OF PSYCHTHERAPY AND RECOVERY is simply that they are committed to the premise that the issues and the solutions exist inside of your own head, instead of in learning how to organize and fight back.

    So for example, say someone is a slave. The therapist will try to show them that as long as they don’t actually feel their feelings, they can become a happy slave. But the therapist is never going to help them learn to be John Brown, and try to start an armed slave revolt.

  • All a therapy license does is say that people can take their children to such a therapist, and they won’t face legal challenges over it. Whereas if they were taking their children to a channeler or faith healer, they could maybe face legal challenges.

    So the therapy license is a license to abuse.

    This is indeed a serious matter.

    Like it says here, “Therapy and recovery are simply the turning of your experience of injustice into a medical problem and a self-improvement project.”

    https://www.amazon.com/Anti-Social-Family-Radical-Thinkers/dp/1781687595/ref=sr_1_1/133-7844907-9115968?ie=UTF8&qid=1502060959&sr=8-1&keywords=the+anti-social+family

    Therapy is always abuse, usually self-abuse, because it does nothing whatsoever to redress the original injustices. It just turns it against the patient. It breaks down people’s defenses until they can be made to live as Uncle Tom’s.

    https://www.amazon.com/Against-Therapy-Jeffrey-Moussaieff-Masson/dp/1567510221/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1502061393&sr=1-1&keywords=against+therapy

    Therapy destroys political consciousness, makes people compliant.

  • As explained, “Psychotherapy and Recovery turn your experience of injustice into a medical problem and a self-improvement project.”

    https://www.amazon.com/Anti-Social-Family-Radical-Thinkers/dp/1781687595/ref=sr_1_1/133-7844907-9115968?ie=UTF8&qid=1502060959&sr=8-1&keywords=the+anti-social+family

    Remember the experience of emotional distress is simply the personalization of the experience of injustice. Therapy and recovery are simply the turning of this back on yourself.

    When you encounter therapist and people talking about “recovery” remember this.

  • People may indeed experience altered states, even psychosis. And sometimes people even seek this and take steps to encourage it.

    But the last thing they need is any therapist in the loop. If one is experiencing altered states or psychosis, or if they are even seeking such, the first step has to be definite actions to protect against the intrusion of therapists.

  • These labels, diagnoses, accessments, like Autism, Aspergers, ADHD, and most anything else, all they do is excuse abusers.

    They may give one a temporary sense of relief, as they seem to explain all which has been difficult. But the labels don’t really improve anything, they just legitimate a very negative and harsh world. In accepting any such labels we de-legitimate ourselves.

    Accepting the label is like negotiating with hostage takers. Shouldn’t do it.

  • Right here, epthe wrote,
    “I’ve been banned from the schizophrenia forum which is ran by mostly mothers of schizophrenics and they sure want keep their offspring on anti-psychotic meds.”

    https://www.madinamerica.com/forums/topic/do-people-think-mia-is-going-downhill/page/3/#post-104014

    Our society creates the fallacy of mental illness, and it does it to reinforce existing power relations and conditions for legitimacy. And so long as we cooperate with it, it is just going to get worse.

  • Good questions David, and good points oldhead.

    What is the current high water mark in anti-psychiatry, like going after psychotherapy and recovery, besides just psychiatry, like protecting children from being told they need therapy and recovery, as well as psychiatry, and like telling people to reject all aspects of the system, like therapy and recovery, and like calling for the prosecution of doctors who are aiding in child abuse?