Showing 589 of 592 comments.
Something something *trauma*? mebbe?
How freaking *civilized*!
Instead of years of ineffective ‘help’ offered to those in distress, the sense espoused here is most welcome.
Thanks for posting this…slowly, slowly, the narrative is being eroded.
Maybe it’s time you educated yourself about our current political climate, and I don’t mean MSNBC.
As I get older, I’m less concerned about what other (talking strangers) think of me…I DO try to maintain my mostly good reputation, practice listening skills, and aim for kindness as a lodestone. But in my advanced age, I know a lot about myself, my strengths and weaknesses, my intuition tells me when to let loose and when to hold back. Yeah, honestly, I haven’t got to a place where (for example) I feel comfortable not wearing a bra I HATE WEARING A BRA! in certain situations…and while self-reflection is important, this obsessing about how one is perceived seems to me a part of this hyper-individualized atomization that is encouraged in this culture.
The fact is: nobody really thinks that hard about YOU! Having an opportunity to get to know someone who looks or acts different makes one realize we all have our burdens. Everyone is doing the best they can.
In the scheme of things, you really aren’t that important.
Just my take…
I just ran into the Zizek quote randomlly…and it seemed relavent to this ‘discussion’. I don’t know jack about philosophy…
All this self-absorption seems narcissistic to me…in a perfect world we all would be judged (ha, here’s another one from the ol’ jumbled brain vaults:) by the content of our character. Unfortunately, we live in this society where cultural norms have been established by Bernaisian advertising schemes. Brought to you by…capitalism. Our common enemy.
The first thing a human notices when encountering another human is what sex they are…I wished for years that I could just be seen as another ‘humanbeing’ and not just a meatsock. Now that I’m old, I’m just invisible. (Hey, maybe I should write an article about how unfair THAT is…)
Self acceptance, imnsho, comes from spending time *outside oneself*, involved with the world, where eventually you DO learn not to give a shit what other people think.
‘scuse the incoherence and clumsiness…my ‘device’ is a pos added to the fact my Internet connection unreliable. No sleep for several days inhibits good communication.
But yeah, Identity Politics keeps our eyes (& hearts and minds) off the ball…
Slavoj Zizek makes this point as well:
If I were to engage in paranoiac speculations, I would be much more inclined to say that the Politically Correct obsessive regulations (like the obligatory naming of different sexual identities, with legal measures taken if one violates them) are rather a Left-liberal plot to destroy any actual radical Left movement. Suffice it to recall the animosity against Bernie Sanders among some LGBT+ and feminist circles, whose members have no problems with big corporate bosses supporting them. The “cultural” focus of PC and #MeToo is, to put it in a simplified way, a desperate attempt to avoid the confrontation with actual economic and political problems, i.e., to locate women’s oppression and racism in their socio-economic context…Liberals will have to take note that there is a growing radical Left critique of PC, identity politics and #MeToo…
What next on MiA? An article describing the oppression of cigarette smokers?
Same arguments apply…
Where is Dr K?
Autoimmune Hashimoto’s disease. An epidemic of it’s own.
No lithium taken: offered at one point while trying to find “the right combination” but I declined.
Stayed on the lowest possible dose, thinking what a good patient I was, and every time I brought up my concerns about Klonopin being ‘addictive’ I was told (over and over by different ‘providers’ over a ten year period that “it’s such a small dose and you don’t have an addictive…”yadayadayada”). And then there’s the part where none of my ‘health care providers’ knew what tolerance withdrawal was/akathisia when I was crawling out of my skin during one rather stressful Thanksgiving.
I’d like to thank Rebecca for her contribution. I’m copying this blog post and handing it to my nurse practitioner next time (the last time?) I see her. I’m dealing right now, at the moment, with a health care ‘provider’ who is NOT LISTENING to what my concerns are regarding my ongoing PAWS/ID symptoms and instead, lowered my thyroid supplement (Armour) by 30% because she seems to think that’s the source of all my discomfort. (Those TSH test results are so damn accurate /s)…and the whole HPA axis dysfunction that plays into all that. Yes, Dr. K, I’m reveling in my Hashimoto’s autoimmune issue and becoming ‘dependent’ on my Armour…I need MORE…cuz I’m an addict. O! And she recommended via the lab tech who called with the happy news, over the counter lithium!!!
What I would love to find is a functional medicine doc *that I can AFFORD* who could help me figure out what is going on with my adrenals…even the drug insert for Armour mentions fixing adrenal deficiency before addressing the Hashis. But straight medicine doesn’t “believe” in adrenal insufficiency. I know; huh??
I tell ya, ya get a real education sleuthing this shit out. And *everyone* needs to do it when dealing with ‘modern medicine.’
Yeah, WHY don’t the doctors know??? Hard for me to believe that doctors DO know…but then they go to great lengths to distance themselves from the damages they cause, cognitive dissonance and all.
In nursing school we had exactly one semester of pharmacology. So many drugs…so much ignorance.
Here we go with the victim blaming theme; and total ignorance regarding thyroid issues.
I’m not sure I have the energy to attemp a coherent rebuttal to “Dr.” K’s assertions here and my Internet device/connection tenuous…but a rebuttal is surely needed to this guy’s drivel.
Yes, thank you Sarah, very timely for me as well.
I hate it when I get out of ‘control’ with anxiety/fear. Your links are useful, and reinforce what I know to be true intellectually; emotionally I still have a ton of work to do.
Can anyone here tell me anything about “Brain Gym”? It’s incorporated into my local (free!) yoga class, and recently been introduced into the school system. I suspect it could be another tool in the ol’ chest.
Thanks again. Bookmarking this one!
Ding ding ding!
Perhaps he doesn’t want to acknowledge the damage he’s done prescribing those poisons calling themselves ‘medication’…
Just like all the other health care ‘professionals’ I’ve talked to regarding my iatrogenic damage…going on post all meds for 51 months now. Tell me, “Dr” , what do you know about gaba receptors, about their being ‘reabsorbed’ with the ongoing ‘therapy’ with the benzodiazepines, the assault from years of ‘trying to find the right combination’ for my alleged ‘bipolar’ (diagnosed at 46 years old…after antidepressants)…I’m wondering just how up on brain physiology the good doctor is…and all this ‘brain plasticity’ promotion…is that a REAL thing, or is it a trendy, pseudoscientific ‘ catch phrase…and then there’s KINDLING. Look it up, Lawrence…it’s happening to millions of us. Sorry I didn’t have a better option than to turn to psychiatry and drugs…with no counseling available to me at any time for my distress, unless of course I could pay the big bucks.
A lot of folks on the support websites say, “i wouldn’t wish this on my worst enemy”…but I tell ya, when I’m not sleeping (again) night after night, year after year, I DO WISH it upon certain, select, “DOCTORS” who prescribed that shit to me, all the while telling me how I NEED it…for years at a time.
Lack of insight? Criminal damages? The loss of my once ‘gifted’ brain?
And then to have the denial about it all here on the pages of MiA…
Done with this guy.
This piece is perfect, Sera.
You know ‘us’ so well, Dr. K./s
Walk a mile in my shoes, and then tell me to what *I* should be doing with my life, eh?
How does this ‘conversation’ help anyone who found themselves in the MH system?
A good portion of the Israeli population has access to no such thing!
O, yes, there’s shame involved, but not (in this case) oldhead’s.
Long live BDS….Palestine endures.
Imperialism is ugly, wherever it manifests itself.
If “we” can keep people out of the system, GREAT,
but I don’t see where this mean-spirited Disability ShamingTM that goes on here is either productive or inspiring to those of us who ARE stuck in the system. What do you propose to do with those of us already harmed by psychiatry?
My BRAIN has been damaged by the “treatment” I received during a time of turmoil and loss…with NOWHERE else to turn. Fix THAT, and offer options for those in despair, or, as we see from this report from RW (whose book clued me in to why I received a bipolar diagnosis…it’s the drugs, stupid), a diagnosis that I can’t really escape from…impacting employment possibilities (my age doesn’t help, either) plus the litany of symptoms/impacts wrought by PAWS. Have any of you gone days and days without sleep, suffered from metabolic changes, cognitive deficits (some days I can’t understand a bloody thing I read), the depersonalisation, derealisation etc. for more than 4 years after d/c-ing the poisons (to fix my “brain chemistry”)? Huh? I am doing all I can in my small, threatened world to keep people I find myself around from falling into the “mental health” system…by being *available* to my friends, neighbors and family when distressed and vulnerable. Most people don’t even have time for a cup of tea with a friend anymore just trying to keep the bills paid. I have the luxury of my own TIME, which often feels a lot like hell…
Not sure why I now feel the need to justify myself to you bootstrap lovers out there (think structural poverty)…many people, especially trauma survivors, are finding it nigh impossible to survive in this poor-shaming, dog eat dog culture we find ourselves in. Keep watching MSM to reinforce you prejudices and the stories *you all* tell yourselves about poverty and psychiatric disability.
PSYCHIATRY disabled me with their drugs after I stumbled into it after a personal trauma.
Since I can’t afford a lawyer to sue the bastards, I can only hunker down with my paltry disability payment while clinging to the brain plasticity theory. After 50 months of hell, permanent damage is seeming likely…
As usual, all you opposed to anyone diagnosed SMI collecting SSDI/SSI really don’t have a clue.
And I’m more convinced than ever that people suck.
Pull up on yer bootstraps, slackers!
Thank you for bringing this to our, and to the world’s, attention.
We’re all capitalism’s guinea pigs.
It’s not just about the brain, either; the prevailing wisdom on the support sites (BenzoBuddies, Surviving Antidepressants) talk about changes also occurring in the HPA axis…I know I have adrenal issues/thyroid issues…
gaba receptors have been ‘reabsorbed’; gaba is used all over the human body
There’s some pretty technical stuff talked about over at BB, unfortunately, my comprehension levels keep me from grok-ing it fully.
It’s beyond ‘clearing’…it’s about the changes to structures in the brain, which for me, 48 months later, still have me severely impaired.
It’s a topsy-turvy world we live in, eh?
The meaning of ‘good’ and ‘evil’ have absolutely switched places…
“psychiatrists could also address the current drug epidemic.”
you mean the one they started?
It appears to me that psychiatrists have no clue about the drugs they prescribe to those who end up in the ‘MH’ system; they have no clue about the long term damages caused by their drugs, or any knowledge about how to safely wean people off them.
I guess in the end it comes down to this: Are you an ally? Or are you part of the problem?
I’m sorry you feel as if your concerns are not being heard, and I empathize with what sounds like ‘burnout’…the nuclear family seems to isolate people when it (sorry) “takes a village”.
I used to think my autistic brother was faking it.
He certainly never had to be responsible for much of anything when I was growing up, and the burden of his care fell disproportionately on me, the eldest daughter.
A thoughtful person would course-correct with feedback from the environment, but how often do ‘normal’ people do that?
It’s up to us to decide what we can deal with and what we can’t…the older I get the better I am at setting boundaries.
Many of us ended up in the MH system *because* of our SO/family members.
Why is THAT so hard to understand?
I know I wouldn’t want to be in a relationship with someone if there was a marked lack of reciprocity…not beneficial for either of us ultimately, eh?
“normal adult burden”
Who gets to define this? What gifts might a person possess that aren’t valued in this society and are discounted (don’t make money)?
If no gifts are perceived (by the deciders), is that person then useless and thus, a burden?
And things are different now, how?
Thank you for taking these issues on, professionally, RightsRNotWrong.
And thank you for the clarification regarding what does and does not occur via AOT/Laura’s Law in California.
Pretty scary stuff coming at all of us from many different angles. Good work, also, Michael, for bringing this issue up–saw it in the news days ago and knew it had to get some air time here.
Yeah, just imagine what losing your kids to your abusive ex in a dirty, corrupt custody fight does.
And nope, still not ‘over’ it all these years later.
Justice is a lie, karma is a lie…and life isn’t fair. Get used to it.
Can we extrapolate then that Sylvain is swimming in ‘water’ he is oblivious to?
Thanks, uprising, for trying.
Working at Planned Parenthood for years taught me just how common molestation and rape were…and my own personal experiences (my mother was raped, my sister was raped, I’ve damn near been raped TOO MANY times), my circumscribed ambitions and activities…no, I would never want to be a man, but when I read essays like I did last week at another site basically saying that the way teenage girls dress ‘these days’ they are asking to be raped, it’s obvious how steeped in the patriarchy we all are. Rape isn’t about sex, it’s about *power over*. Power is a drug…
I *do* blame the doctors.
The “doctors” should KNOW about the drugs they prescribe, including how to quit them safely.
How were we, the patients, suppose to ‘research’ the possible consequences of benzodiazepines? Pre-internet, there was only the PDR, which was a big blank as far as PAWS/ID is concerned, only mentioning ‘addiction’ as a possible down side. All I knew was that I was a ‘good little patient’ and always took the same low dosage for *years* (wanting desperately to avoid the dreaded ‘addict’ label), and when tolerance withdrawal reared it’s ugly head, my ‘health care’ provider had no clue and just prescribed *more* drugs…
No residual symptoms? Really?
Ah, saw you post above.
Good news, T, Thanks!!!
No Pets allowed. I haven’t seen a rental for years that allowed pets.
I only wish I could afford a dog and a yard and a garden of my own and enough money for groceries and the electric bill. If only.
The neighbor dog has been barking *all day* (great for my nervous system) for many days now; my plan is to go over there, knock on the door, and offer myself as a dog-walker while this person is at work. Obviously the dog is bored. Just so you don’t think I’m not trying…
What she said^^^
Me, too, Meghan. EXACTLY as you describe.
Thanks AA, that’s very kind. But I don’t *do* facebook. I realize I’m missing out on some things but knowing what I know about data mining and co-opting by…well, not for this thread. I’m glad there’s that option for others~
And I married my abusive mother…not literally, but yes, once abused, always abused? I’m the family scapegoat..always the ‘identified patient’ and always wondered when I was a child, and my mother kept dragging me to counselors, why it was that they never talked to *her* about what was going on at home.
I don’t think it’s a shock that those of us who end up in the ‘Mental Health’ system have trauma backgrounds…only to be re-traumatized.
Magnesium didn’t hurt…but never really saw any benefit. Being hell broke, I haven’t have the options of ‘alternative’ therapies (unless donated), and have mostly focused on cleaning up my diet, cutting out grains, sugar, caffeine, chocolate, alcohol (forever; interacts with gaba) and *all* other pharma/supplements, with the exception of the Imitrex I take for the migraines…a frequent issue for me and Vit. D.
Try to maintain some physical activity, recently began going to a (free) yoga class and have a friend who is using me as a case study for her biodynamic cranial sacral massage training. Acupuncture helped a bit during acute, for the inner vibrations and the weeks of insomnia.
I use distraction as best I can…which just leads me to feel like I’m wasting time as as time passes one wonders “is this how it is for the rest of my life?”
There are periods of time when the symptoms recede, the usual waves and windows pattern has been true for my experience…but at this time, it’s been months of slogging thru a litany of issues and I’m tired and discouraged. Permanent damage is a forbidden subject on the support boards, and the constant admonishments to ‘think positive’ just makes me feel that much more alone.
*don’t watch this if you’re in a fragile condition
No, I didn’t misunderstand at all.
What do you know about PAWS/ID? Have you any idea of the duration? Why would I want to take another drug, for whatever length of time, altering the neurochemical soup in my brain (again) after suffering the trauma from PAWS/ID?
I want my brain back. After 46 months *after* a slow taper (the Ashton Manual recommendations are too fast!) my impairments are not recognized by ANYONE in the medical ‘community’ or (as the author states) by friends/family/employers etc.
The isolation and the shifting deficits have made my life not really worth living as it passes me by, void of meaning or enthusiasm for *anything*.
WOW just what I want to do; take *another* drug, this time a ‘new’ one to counteract the adverse effects of the *first* drug. I’m trying to get off the merry-go-round, not sustain the ride.
In *YOUR* opinion.
And it’s worked so well in the past…for accomplishing nothing. O wait; the rich still manage to hold the reins. Huh.
Lessig’s thesis: Trump is removed because he was helped by “Mother Russia” (!), Pence “should” resign since he got the same help, Ryan steps in. “If Ryan becomes president, he should do the right thing and choose Clinton for vice president. Then he should resign.” This is where we are. Poor Larry. Such a shame.
Lifted from the links portion of Naked Capitalism today.^^^
Why is that?
Maybe it’s the system they operate in?
I’m losing my wifi signal
but here take a gander
Look like the usual bunch of Goldman Sacks/Exxon/corporate slime bags as ever to me.
Doesn’t keep us from being part of the economic system tho, does it? Still have to pay the rent and buy groceries…
This whole discussion is discouraging.
Eric Coates had some good ideas in comments from another blog post but can’t remember (thanks, psychiatry) which one.
My comment has been removed for not being helpful.
Can’t really see anything in this discussion that is.
Commodifying ‘caring’ is not the answer. Rebuilding relationships in one’s community, workplace, sharing burdens and tasks, sharing childcare/eldercare, having tea with your neighbor…being HUMAN with one another without selling pieces of ourselves off as ‘consumers’ is what is needed, imnsho. They mine our data, they use our bodies so we can house, clothe and feed ourselves, they dangles shiny toys incessantly in front of us so we always feel less than complete, they divide us by creating controversy (life is life and the rankings of who or what is important is imposed on us by hubristic humans and their flawed economic systems), our recreations are other directed and costly etc etc etc. The set-up of our lives is fraudulent. I am not an economic unit. Reciprocity and the reverence of sanctity of life in all it’s forms are what I try to strive for, admittedly not always successfully. Power-over structures are to be avoided…there are cultures who have practiced these ( e.g. the Zapatistias) living arrangements. You don’t hear about them largely due to their smallness in their ecological niches. What’s coming up for all of us in the coming years will teach the lesson (again) on how to live simply…if humans survive at all. Certainly we are losing much of the diversity of life on the planet as the steamroller of capitalism grinds everything in it’s path into dust.
Commodifying caring is creepy. Making money off someone else’s misery is wrong.
Caring for money; that’ll fix it.
Capitalism *is* the elephant in the room.
Not ‘crony’ capitalism.
The whole premise is not sustainable, and we’re living at the end of the road. The ‘resources’ are played out, more growth (capitalism) is killing us all.
Good essay, Will, but I don’t’ think Lessig has any answers. He’s a player, too.
Great essay, Kalina.
Shared it with a local paper in a community that is hellbent on opening an inpatient psych facility to spare them the taxpayer expense of shipping folks in distress outta there. O, and to relieve law enforcement from having to deal with ‘those people’. It’s frightening for me to see that folks really don’t want a ‘solution’–they just want to not have to deal with the ‘homeless’ and the marginalized who act out.
Moar grof~~until we kill everything on the planet…for money.
Capitalism. On a finite planet. With finite ‘resources’.
Nice, insightful discussion.
Thanks for posting!
Lots of good stuff here, Eric.
I agree with John.
Enjoy your legal cocaine.
I’m GLAD GLAD GLAD they’re talking about pills pills pills!
Blah blah blah blah….
My concern with this article, Monica, is that it seems to support what the federal government has been claiming for decades.
I’m with you about legalization of all drugs…and I never meant to imply that pot cannot be a ‘bad trip’ for some folks. The comments inspired by this article are frightening to me…and seem to have an agenda other than just ‘warning’ folks of the possible dangers from using cannabis products. I also think psych/pharma drugs, which are legal, cause way more damage to unsuspecting and trusting ‘consumers’ than pot ever did.
I’m also reacting to my one experience in the county ‘crisis’ unit after a brutal separation from my abusive husband. I was monitored closely for ‘marijuana’ use when out in the world fulfilling my only part-time job at the time. The staff couldn’t understand why I would drive a half hour to do this job if it didn’t involve my injesting marijuana somehow. Except I wasn’t. I was keeping with a routine that gave me a modicum of meaning while in a state of chaos.
Guess that’s why the federal government keeps it listed as a class one drug.
Guess all those people serving time in for profit prisons for marijuana offenses is justified. It’s a dangerous drug.
I see the light now.
I call bullshit.
I have been around pot smokers my entire adult life. Some people react badly, sure. I know people who don’t do marijuana because they have had negative experiences (mostly anxiety/paranoia). But ‘mania/psychosis’? I suggest there were additional drugs in play.
Again, as I stated above, I lived in an area whose economy revolved around marijuana. In my non-scientific, personal opinion, I saw FAR MORE damage from alcohol and methamphetamine than I ever did pot.
Pot is smoked by *all kinds* of people, not just bums and deadbeats. Humans have been altering their consciousness for millennia! Herbs and plants have been used in rituals and ceremony for eons! Pharmaceuticals cause far more damage than pot, imo.
Those who go on to other recreational drugs and become addicted have more going on in their social milieu that predisposes them to escape their pain with drugs. *gateway drug* HOW QUAINT!
Who funds this author? Who funds these naysayers? Who is threatened by legalization? Cui bono?
The history of the criminalization of marijuana is an interesting one; it has everything to do with threatened industries and not much to do with ‘protecting’ the public.
If I wasn’t feeling so impaired after my years of psych meds, I’d give out some links, but in my world all this is common knowledge.
You new commenters; where did you come from and who do you work for???
It’s Reefer Madness all over again!
“Sadly, the cannabidiol (CBD) concentrations in currently available marijuana have remained the same or decreased.”
Maybe in *your* neighborhood, but as someone who has lived in an area almost wholly supported by the pot industry, this statement is bunk. Lots of growers are specializing in CBD strains; it’s all the rage.
This author needs to get out more.
I wish I could recall where I found the link, somewhere on this site tho. It was an article by a fellow ‘mental health’ professional, and you stated in the comments something to the effect that forced treatment was sometimes necessary.
Have you revised your views?
My brain is still not up to par after a slow taper from long term prescribed Klonopin, but I’m pretty sure I read that comment/sentiment by you somewhere. I’m interested in getting to know you, and your views on forced treatment would be welcome as part of my personal evaluation. I’m sure many of us who populate the MiA site would be interested as well.
Dr. K support forced treatment; maybe you could talk about *that*.
Heartbreaking, with echoes of my own experience but somehow managing to escape the suicide. The doubling down on the ‘medication’ bit seems to be the protocol–where do they get such outlandish advice? The drug reps?
My mission in life at this point is to educate as many as possible about these horrible drugs. I grieve for all the losses incurred as a result of the profit motive. Isn’t it funny what is considered to be ‘normal’ (profits more important than life)?
http://www.benzobuddies.org has lots of information about the process…mostly adhering to the Ashton Manual.
and I personally prefer http://survivingantidepressants.org…there's a benzo section and sensible advice about micro-tapers.
But it’s not the CORRECT term for what’s happened to us! If there’s ever to be any sort of support from ‘the medical community’, it needs to be recognized and not blurred with a whole ‘nother phenomena. ‘Detox’ clinics do not work for those of us who have become dependent on psych meds, and that is generally all that’s available to us when we decide to get off our prescribed ‘medications’.
I can tell you’re trying and I appreciate that about you.
Sorry if I was abrupt. For kicks sometime, you should take a gander at BenzoBuddies or Surviving Antidepressants.
I have never, ever, had the urge to take any benzo after finally ending my taper. I don’t think many of us with PAWS do. I tried NA for support earlier in my process and I found it to be not helpful: I am not an addict, and I won’t ever confess to being one. It isn’t about stigma, it’s about the language we use, and the terms are important when it comes to helping those with ID from benzo use.
Eat your GMO/Round-upTM factory farmed watered with fracking well water food, and shaddup! It’s GOOD for ya!
Did you know that commercial wheat is sprayed after harvest with Round-up as a desiccant? Yummmmm! Did you know that the wheat commercially grown these days has 4x the number of genes than what our ancestors cultivated? Gluten sensitivity and celiac disease are two different things…
Look it up.
I went thru it and lived.
No drugs…I just white knuckled it. It does ease off after a period of time (for me about 3 months). I DID get some acupuncture done, and that seemed to help a bit with the sleep, but eventually I had to learn some self-soothing techniques: meditation, taking one moment at a time, distraction, exercise as tolerated-and getting outside. There’s lots of support online i.e. “Surviving Antidepressants” and “BenzoBuddies” and others. You are stronger than you think! It IS hell. And for me it continues to be hellish when waves of symptoms hit, but there have been windows of time when I almost feel normal, and that keeps me going. All of it unpredictable with no time-frame.
Coming off psych drugs is not for the faint of heart. It’s your choice, it’s your body. I just wanted my brain back and not be a slave to BigPharmaTM. You also might want to check out Robert Whitaker’s “Anatomy of an Epidemic”…I stumbled on a review of it in the NYRB, and the lightbulb went on; my whole experience with psychiatry there on the pages.
Good luck to you.
WTF *is* “Mental Health”??? Keeping the term around will always imply that there are “EXPERTS” who know what’s ‘healthy’ and what’s not.
What’s annoying about the ‘think positive’ thing is this: it DENIES the room for discussion about what’s going on with a person. It cuts off communication. The message really is, “SHUT UP ABOUT IT ALREADY”.
Bright Sided is very good, and gets to the political roots of when and where all this ‘think positive’ stuff seeped into the culture.
I’ve been seeing more and more push-back on the whole ‘think positive’ meme that is so pervasive in our ‘culture’…and this from Good Housekeeping? Bravo!
Riding it out. Knowing what is happening to you is helpful. I didn’t have a clue when the akathisia hit.
A good support system and true informed consent is required.
Finding BenzoBuddies saved my life.
That’s a bunch of pills….
It’s actually quite difficult to OD on just benzos.
The oral LD50 (lethal dose in 50% of the population) of diazepam is 720 mg/kg in mice and 1240 mg/kg in rats. D. J. Greenblatt and colleagues reported in 1978 on two patients who had taken 500 and 2000 mg of diazepam, respectively, went into moderately deep comas, and were discharged within 48 hours without having experienced any important complications, in spite of having high concentrations of diazepam and its metabolites desmethyldiazepam, oxazepam, and temazepam, according to samples taken in the hospital and as follow-up.
Overdoses of diazepam with alcohol, opiates and/or other depressants may be fatal.
They were considered to be much safer than barbiturates when they came out in the late 50s and early 60s…see “Mother’s Little Helper”
Thanks, Cole, for your refutation of Dr. Shipko’s benzo stance.
As another benzo/SSRI/SNRI/’mood stabilizer’ merry-go-round survivor, trading one evil for another should not be the protocol.
Benzos kill. As do SSRIs/all brain drugs. And kindling is a real thing…polypharmacy is rampant in our present system of ‘mental health’ care.
O for the ever elusive ‘right combination’ of meds to ‘fix’ our ‘chemical imbalances’…
Thank you, JanCarol, for all your wonderful, succinct, and on-point comments~
It’s thought by some of us ‘guinea pigs’ that a phenomenon call KINDLING happens when the brain gets jacked around by one too many drug changes/withdrawals. Antidepressants play a huge part of that. It would be great if the good doctor looked into that.
I give up
When that ‘opinion’ harms others, ummmm, no, it’s not OK to let it slide.
It’s a very big deal around here: iatrogenic damage.
And who the heck are YOU?
A Celebration of Ignorance
Carl Sagan: “I have a foreboding of an America in my children’s or grandchildren’s time–when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the key manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers are in the hands of a very few, and no representing the pubic interest can even grasp the issues; when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, unable to distinguish between what feels good and what’s true, we slide, almost without noticing back into superstition and darkness. The dumbing down of America is most evident in the slow decay of substantive content in the enormously influential media, the 30-second sound bites (now down to 10 seconds or less), lowest common denominator programming, credulous presentations on pseudoscience and superstition, but especially a kind of celebration of ignorance.” From The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark (1995)
and the cherry on top:
“How is the distortion of the notion of freedom by neoliberal beliefs related to political humiliation? The state, in serving the market, functions as a disciplinary regime, especially in relation to people who are working-class and poor. Sociologist Wacquant (2009) indicates that the state punishes the poor for their failure to be entrepreneurial-consumer subjects. The poor receive bare amounts of resources from the state, as a way of punishing them for not serving the state/market. From this perspective, humiliation involves communicating to people who are poor that they are economic failures (on the dole), and failed political subjects—hence disposable. Other sociologists dispute this idea of punishment and instead argue that the state disciplines the poor by devising ways to force poor people to live by market rules (Soss, Fording, & Schram, 2011). By receiving austere levels of resources, it is believed poor people will be motivated to work hard and improve their lot. Whether one sees this as discipline or punishment, each involves dependency on the state that is more concerned about the vitality of the market than it is about its poorer residents. The state, in other words, distorts political freedom by equating it with economic freedom and in the process disciplines or punishes poor persons who are constructed as failures. We might call “these people” economic-political losers who have demonstrated misuse of the “freedoms” the state provides. “They” are shamed in myriad ways in the media, which may function to incentivize some segments of the population to work harder. Shame, in this instance, becomes a tool of the market to produce and maintain entrepreneurial-consumer subjects who exercise their “freedoms” by obeying the imperatives of the market society. In short, the state is directly involved in humiliating poorer persons instead of working to facilitate parity of political participation and a just distribution of resources.”
Living wage jobs?
Minimum wage jobs?
What freaking jawbs?
Our standard of living has been eroded by the corporations who have bought our ‘government’ and shipped all decent jawbs overseas~
You’re right, there’s plenty of work to be done, unfortunately, it isn’t compensated for in a way that sustains a mere individual in our present economic system. How many gigs does it take to pay the rent, *and* the gas money to get there, let alone afford a vehicle?
I went without a car for 7 years cuz I COULDN’T afford one, let alone repairs, tires, insurance etc. and yet a vehicle is just about a requirement for employment. Public transit has been gutted–those of you preaching about JAWBs obviously are living in a fantasy world and I’ll BET you’re getting some sort of benefit your own selves.
No Social Security for you, huh, Frank? Just how did you accumulate all your worldly goods anyways?; are you getting paid to sit behind a keyboard and pick on those unfortunates on the bottom of the food chain and rail about anti-psychiatry? As I mentioned to another regular on these pages; I’d rather have a root canal than sit in a room with you and work on the ‘movement’. Maybe one of the reasons there *is* no movement.
Your rants against the disabled and the poor are scapegoating pure
Could you wait on customers with severe anxiety (or akathisia)? The jobs available out there are service jobs, dealing with *customers* for minimum wage. I know I still can’t deal with people on days/weeks when I’ve had zero sleep and my blood sugar drops out and when I freak out about every little thing–you all act as if iatrogenesis is just a little blip and we should just pull ourselves up by our bootstraps and get back onto the wheel even tho our gears are stripped.
How about we save a bunch of money by not subsidizing the medications that are damaging our brains, eh? Or put the MIC on a diet…that’ll save some dough. But no, people like Frank, and all you others behave like this psych drug thing is minor inconvenience.
Get real, and quit scapegoating those that suffer–believe me, living on disability is barely that. Why dontcha get pissed at some bankers or something? The mean spiritedness I’m seeing here is shocking; and yes, it’s SCAPEGOATING.
Deja vu all over again~
O and ps
Should we kick all those useless eaters on Social Security retirement off the ‘entitlements’ and make them bag groceries or work as greeters at Walmart? No man is an island. I’m guessing that not having any social supports is what brought a majority of us to the ‘mental health’ system in the first place.
pss to Frank’s reply below (no reply button)
I’m not claiming ‘mental illness’–but I am claiming IATROGENIC damage from involving myself in the ‘mental health’ system when I was distressed and had nowhere else to turn.
And I believe my own experience and those that I read about in online support groups–the folks *damaged* by your ‘placebo effect.
I believe that the damages caused by psych drugs in general, and SSRIs/SNRIs and tricyclics in particular, is a unacknowledged epidemic.
Please listen, Doctor. Your position of power over others I believe is impeding your ability to be an unbiased observer.
Thanks to Richard, Dan Smith, Slaying et al who are bringing this to your attention.
Good comment, Richard:)
Important, but still subscribes to the concept of ‘mental illness’ as being valid, and supports ‘treatment’, however benign.
As I said~
Of course it’s a slippery slope when it comes to a decision like that in regard to those who are labelled ‘mentally ill’…I didn’t mean to ignore the point of the article. It’s just that I’ve thought about it long enough, and many of my older friends have as well–I think we should all have the right to decide when to leave the planet, and not give Modern Medicine ™ another nickel on the backs of suffering elders. Modern Medicine ™ acts almost like it’s a personal affront to ‘lose’ a patient, even if they’ve already been coded 4 times…Death is part of life, and pretending it’s not part of the great circle of life is part of our problem as a society. IMNSHO.
I would love to have some Nembutol on hand–with the way the world is going *I* want to make the choice about how/when I want to die. When the shit hits the fan, just knowing that I have the option would give me a great deal of peace.
So glad there’s finally some organized movement behind the benzo holocaust.
Thanks for all your efforts; I do what I can here in my immediate environment given the limitations I presently live under.
The carnage needs to stop.
The toll is huge.
BenzoBuddies uses the Ashton Manual like a bible–from what I’ve seen online in my limited experience over the last 45 months, it seems to me a micro taper is the way to go.
Lots of information about that on Surviving Antidepressants~~~~
Why is it so hard for you to believe that *your* experience is not universal?
I discontinued Klonopin after a few months use cold turkey the first time I was prescribed them. It was a rough 2 weeks or so but I got past it. It’s the ‘kindling’ phenomenon you seem to be ignorant of. Again, everyone is different. I’m 45 months out from what I thought was a slow taper after a subsequent ‘script that I took *as directed* for almost 10 years. It has been hell on earth–no joke. How many commit suicide due to the myriad of horrific symptoms that occur after even a slow taper? It will never be known. Benzos are poison. I can see a use for them for only very short term, but brain changes happen as soon as 4 days. There is no true informed consent because practitioners are clueless when it comes to long-term damages caused by benzos.
You might look into the “Surviving Antidepressants” website. There’s extensive information and support about slow tapering Benzos. All those brain meds have similar PAWS profiles.
“Addiction Myth” is not good source for help with tapering.
You might also check out some of Robert Whitaker’s books, (the founder of this website) and youtube for videos regarding safely discontinuing benzos.
Benzos cause *brain changes*…even yours.
Some are lucky and escape the worst of the iatrogenic damage (did you know that benzos are derived from BENZENE, a well known carcinogen?) but piling on psych meds to mask the adverse effects of tolerance withdrawal helps ‘kindle’ the brain, making PAWS more likely.
But of course, *everyone* is just like you:)
Sorry for your situation, which is ALL TOO COMMON.
They call it “Benzo rage” on the support boards.
I, too, am ‘older’ and sometimes wonder what’s the point of the years of intense suffering.
I can honestly say that the iatrogenic damages have forced me to literally ‘live in the moment’ and find joy in the small. Getting thru yet another shitty day sometimes feels like climbing Mt. Everest. I *do* have periods of time when I feel ‘almost normal’ but they cannot be counted on to last…
Nobody gets it unless they’ve been thru it, and WE SHOULD BE COMPENSATED for the loss of our lives as we knew them…financially, physically, spiritually and interpersonally too; many of us have had our lives ruined without any sort of acknowledgement from the powers that be, which is just another insult to add to the myriad of crap we must contend with daily.
I hope you find someone who you can share your experience with who will listen and not judge. I had a good ‘friend’ dump me not long ago after supporting me for 3 years–I emailed a video made by a benzo victim that featured Dr. Heather Ashton and Dr. Malcolm Lader who speaks frankly about the brain damages and the duration of the suffering. I asked her to please just watch the first 10 mins. She came to visit a few weeks later and apologized; tears were shed and the friendship ‘patched’ up, but not really. I will never fully trust her again.
It’s such a long, hard, lonely road…and I’m still not sure I’m glad I’m ‘med free’ at this point~
You are not alone.
If you read to the end of the article, the writer is a proponent of the genetic theory of ‘mental illness’ which makes the rest of the article moot for this reader.
What your experience is/was does not necessarily translate into other’s.
I think there’s a lot to be said for micro tapers, which is discussed and supported at length on Surviving Antidepressants. I thought tapering over a year and a half was slow; 42 months later and still significantly impaired, I wish I would have known about *anything* at all regarding how to safely discontinue long term use of Klonopin.
There’s the social control issue, too.
I think benzos should be used only in very specific circumstances short term.
They are *dangerous* and TOXIC and are handed out like candy impacting a huge segment of society, many of whom are unseen and are unknowing as they get medicated with additional drugs for the adverse symptoms that the benzos themselves cause.
People need to be aware that 10-15+ percent of those prescribed benzodiazepines are at risk for a severe post withdrawal syndrome that can last for years/the rest of your life. It is a living hell.
True informed consent in regard all psych drugs/pharma drugs *rarely* happens.
Those that experience adverse effects can become a ‘burden’ on society…and you libertarians wouldn’t like that at all, would you, CAT?
What a hard job.
Thank you for being someone who *listens*~
It’s just all so sad…I’m not sure where you find the fortitude.
Ehrenreich, not Ehrlick
Thank you, Aaron, for sharing your story.
I think it’s somewhat remarkable that the psychiatrist at McLean wrote down ‘iatrogenic’–that’s HUGE.
“Our stories or personal narratives are constantly being misconstrued and misappropriated by mental health professionals in the form of pathologizing progress notes and other clinical documents.”
yep~and so it goes
I’d like to see a source for that information.
I don’t think that’s necessarily true.
Thank you, Steve.
Boo fucking hoo, cat.
Rape can happen to men, too. But the odds are that the perps are MEN.
25% of American women suffer from sexual violence…in my own life I have *very nearly* been raped numerous times. My mom was raped, my sister was raped and countless friends of mine have been raped. Sexual trauma is pivotal for those seeking mental health ‘services’ only to have the mental health ‘services’ inflict further damages.
pet peeve, sorry
otherwise great comment
Martha Rosenberg rips off another expose of big pHarma
the last sentence is gratifying…and pertinent to this blog.
I beg to differ in regards to the ‘war on pain patients’.
My neighbor, who passed a month ago (unrelated to story), went cold turkey off her Effexor and trazadone rather than submit to a pee-test that the clinic now requires for all patients receiving triplicate rxs.
I think people in pain should be able to access pain meds, but supervision and follow up are needed…and that rarely happens here. An accurate diagnosis would be good, too, but again…
BTW cat, I like your consent form above. That’s worth saving for future use.
The shear amount of damages caused by treatments? Surely that is worthy of consideration?
I thought you were sayin’ poverty was all a state of mind? (forum post on Ben Carson’s philosophy)
“Benzos are not dangerous drugs”
Watch even the first 10 minutes of the film linked to above. Dr. Heather Ashton (the only doc to have ever researched how to get off benzos safely and the fallout from their use) compares what’s happening to people all over the world as a result from iatrogenic damage taking benzos *as prescribed* comparable to the thalidomide scandal.
Addiction is the wrong word for most who get caught in the trap.
Benzos changes the brain. Iatrogenic damage from as little as a week of use can happen. It’s BRAIN DAMAGE.
The ADDICTION language is harmful to the millions of us who are going thru hell years later after we got off the ‘medication’ (AS PRESCRIBED!!!) .
Watch the film and educate yourself cuz otherwise you are not really grasping the issue here.
not at all against pain meds…true informed consent is rare when it comes to benzos and antidepressants, however
I would have never have taken either if I had known the rest of my life would be filled with so much impairment and loss…BRAIN DAMAGE!!!!
The full film
Sure would like some legislators to see it…
Thanks for this, Monica. Very timely considering the dynamics around here lately.
I face criticism occasionally. I have learned to consider what is being said, see where it might conceivably be warranted, and incorporate that insight into my behavior. If some criticism is not warranted after careful reflection, and I then discard it. If some of the bloggers are unable to do this, I have to wonder about their maturity level and abilities to self-reflect.
I pretty much in my life have honed down my friendship base to those who are able to do that.
I, too, am disheartened by Emmeline’s pronouncement. I consider MiA to be a sort of *home* for me after bumbling into Robert Whitaker’s work, which changed my life. A place where I can learn and be inspired and gain virtual support from others who have been ‘consumers’ in the system and from those who are practitioners and critical of that system.
To see what is happening here, and the changes *ever since the format change*…the lack of interactivity by staff and now what feels like just more of the same ol’ same ol’ corporate crapification and the knuckling under due to pressure from vested interests. Again, those who have no power are being disempowered by those that do.
Believe me, I wanted to say much more in my reply to this blog than I did.
MiA won’t miss me, since my financial contributions are minor. I hope they succeed with their mission without survivor’s voices. But I want to know, just how much are mh practitioners going to learn without hearing the voices of those affected by the system?
Pretty good article, scary comments.
The thing is, finding a psychiatrist or a health care professional who knows anything at all about withdrawal from psych meds is rare as hen’s teeth.
You might try looking into http://survivingantidepressants.org/
Monica Cassini’s site, “Beyond Meds” might be useful, too.
Good luck to you.
This is more what I had in mind
Do you even have to ask who?
Good job throughout this thread, kindred.
Thank you for saying so well what I’m thinking…
Benzos are not ‘harmless’…brain changes happen in as little as a week.
Again, on BenzoBuddies there are folks trying to get their brains back after just a few days on benzos.
That’s horseshit, cat.
There’s folks from *all over the world* who bought benzos over -the-counter who have difficulties getting off ’em.
It’s DEPENDENCE. They change your brain. Addiction is a whole other story.
What Vlad doesn’t seem to get it that his/most other Americans run to a pharmaceutical when having difficulty rather than just go thru it. The nature of the world is change. Nothing lasts forever.
Mania? Isn’t that just another word describing a piece of the range of human experience? I refuse to pathologize any response to our inner/outer ‘chemistries’ with our environments. It’s a slippery slope (as far too many of us already know) to give some ‘professional’ power over anyone with mere words.
I read this article in the middle of the night (yay insomnia) and it festered and gnawed and writhed and out popped this conclusion:
WTF are you thinking ???
WHO is *CRazy* here???
The same reason restraints are.
Medicine for profit$.
“If psychiatry was all-bad, why would it still be around in 2017?”
Because it is the perfect tool for social control???
I don’t believe in ‘mania’ or ‘depression’ or any other adjective in the DSM…there is only a range of human experience. And just because one is ‘stuck’ in a particular place of discomfort or distress does not disprove the law of flux–*everything* changes.
There’s so many other ways to address insomnia–but you had to have the quick fix, just like most populations with ‘advanced’ economies. Pharma loves that…
Good luck to you. I wonder what your attitude will be in years to come?
That’s great if you have enough money to *afford* a dog, or have housing that allows PETS.
Sounds like some people’s parenting style.
My poor 56 year old autistic brother. I’m almost positive he’s been thru something like this.
Power and control.
Yes–thank you, Michael.
Nope. For *me*, the PAWS/ID is much much much much much worse than the original distress that fed me into the “MH” system.
I went into the system believing that I was deviant, unnatural, inadequate thanks to my milieu growing up and the marriage I made with a so-called partner who just repeated my childhood messages.
Everyone is different, but I don’t think I’m the only one who has had things come down the way they have.
distress works for me
perfectly describes what led me into the system
The link is the wrong one–leads to the baby touching article.
Regarding your sleep issue
I worry about this too. It is my most persistent ‘symptom’ and leads to a cascade of all the other impairments. I don’t like reading about how it is permanent–altho I have those thoughts, too.
What ‘outside’ intervention are you referring to?
Supplements cost more than I can afford–really very simple. It’s all I can to do buy organic on my disability stipend. Fish oil–hah! right…pro-biotics, sure thing./s
(I’m) Dealing with iatrogenic damage from psych drugs. I cannot tolerate B vitamins, now, among other things. In fact, supplements are somewhat discouraged on the support boards due to the sensitivity of our nervous system. They seem to exacerbate symptoms for many of us.
Avoiding sugar, caffeine, chocolate, gluten is about all I can do right now, and otherwise eating well.
Thanks, erin, for the ‘spectrum’ statement.
I use that analogy all the time when trying to explain my opposition to labels and the ‘mh’ system.
As someone mentioned already, about the only way I will seek ‘medical care’ is if I’m bleeding profusely (or a similar scenario).
But as we’ve seen on these pages before, even Advance Directives can be overruled by the medicos.
Just give me the black pill, and I’ll take care if it myself.
As an ‘elder’ that does NOT MAKE ME FEEL better!
What are the chances of being ‘tortured’ as a younger person and then escaping further torture when I’m a doddering old fool?
“The alternative, it seems to me, is to allow any quack who can (figuratively) wave their arms or practice the laying on of hands, to victimize and defraud people who are hurting and their families who are at their wits end in dealing with bizarre behavior.”
isn’t that what’s happening already?
Good essay, Ronda. Thanks for your integrity and ‘insights’ (hah – little joke)…
I was prescribed Neurotin as part of the ‘cocktail’ of drugs my former shrink prescribed for my mythical ‘chemical imbalance’.
Might have something to do with the PAWS I’m dealing with now these last 3+ years.
But who knows? And who the F*** cares?
Don’t be Debbie Downer.
Nevermind that your brain is damaged, and you haven’t slept in weeks.
No, think about what is POSITIVE in your life as you lose your job, housing, family and friends.
It’s *all in your head*! Change your attitude as you’re dealing with the akathisia and the weakness and the apathy, the brain fog and nightmares and the thousands of additional physical and mental deficits. Pull yourself up by your BOOTSTRAPS, goddam it!
Plan for your awesome future, drug-free…if you ever recover from the iatrogenic damage that’s been wreaking havoc on your brain/body! There’s so much to look forward to…(!)
This all sounds like bullshit to me. It truly sounds like you all have NO IDEA what’s involved when attempting to get off the meds (easy part) and then deal with the aftermath and reality of iatrogenic damage.
Great comment, Tina, and thanks for all your work.
Thanks, of course, also to RW for this article and the hope it represents.
Gotta go along with oldhead, Richard and Bonnie tho. The beast cannot be ‘reformed’.
Did you ever see that Star Trek Next Gen episode, “The Game”?
I look around, and it is happening here and now! And the aliens are taking over the ship!!! Where is Wesley Crusher when you need him?
and it wouldn’t disappoint me at all if *someone* would finally acknowledge that long-term/permanent damage occurs after withdrawal…not just ‘2 years’.
I am so discouraged, my friends keep trying to ‘fix’ me by recommending this supplement, that mediation technique, to correct my ‘attitude’ (where have I heard *that* before??) and imply that I’m just not trying hard enough. I should be good to go after 39 months of this hell!…I must be ‘exaggerating’ or faking it!
It would be so much easier for me if this PAWS/ID thing was recognized. AND COMPENSATED for!! But there’s the catch, huh?
Again I ask, who the he** can afford these “supplements”?
Not me. Just another example of the partial cause of my *distress* — grinding, unrelenting POVERTY with no access to ‘alternatives’. Straight medicine is all I have access to, and all they have ever done is to drug the symptoms without addressing the causes.
If I had a spare $79 bucks, I might give it a shot. But then there’s the option of the methylated formula…I cannot afford a test to find out if that is an issue for me (is that an issue for those of us who are experiencing ID from psych meds???)…a blood tests for gluten intolerance is a hundred bucks!
Until this sort of ‘help’ is available to all of us, it remains all about money, and not at all about healing.
Another person dealing with ID, here.
Nevermind the advice that is offered if it doesn’t feel right.
I got sick of the ‘be positive’ crap long long ago.
Sometimes you just roll with it–and then there are days when you can do stuff like compose music, right? Thanks for including it here and for telling your story. It’s a crime that just keeps being repeated ad infinitum.
Maybe someday our collective suffering (not just us who have been damaged by psychiatry and/or psych meds, but the disenfranchised everywhere) will be in a place to rise up and throw the chains off before we kill ourselves and every other living being on this precious, irreplaceable planet.
A good place to go for information about tapering benzodiazepines is BenzoBuddies:
It is in English, but there are participants from all over the world.
Slow is the way to go when tapering benzos; even slower than what is recommended by “The Ashton Manual” – the method recommended by BenzoBuddies.
Let us know how it goes…
I just went on the Truehope site that sells the EMPowerPlus supplement and *crikey*! Some of us don’t have that kind of dough…guess only the strong (and rich) survive, huh??
“generational bipolar disorder”
Yes, they are very good.
Would love to see them made up as flyers.
The Phillip Hickey article, too. Only just posted today.
I agree with this comment.
I am dealing with a huge wave of PAWS symptoms, at 38 1/2 months out from a year and a half taper of a tiny bit of Klonopin that I was prescribed for 10ish years. My mind has been so fogged, my energy so zapped that it’s been difficult just dealing with my daily life, never mind feeling any joy or connection. My best friend just dumped me after supporting me thru this over the past 3 years…she thinks I’m ‘not trying hard enough’. I’m not *postive* enough. (and I’m sure whispering to mutual friends about my ‘underlying condition’) HAH
Yes, I try to engage when I can. I gave out yet another copy of “Anatomy…” last week, and I make arguments about the ‘mental health’ system in the comments section of a local paper (as able). But for me to make a verbal argument, or write something coherent at this point, or to handle the *STRESS* of organizing anything, or *travelling*…operating on no sleep for weeks, well. Tell ya what…right now, for me to hang onto the fact that I’ve had periods of time (windows) when all 4 cylinders were firing–a dim memory now cuz this wave (yep, waves and windows) has pulled me under for weeks now, is about all I can do. This is no way to live. My old age spent just trying to get my brain back only to die from lack of medical care thanks to our awesome for-profit system. Shoot me now.
Sorry for whining but I cannot cannot cannot believe this is still so bad this far out.
And ya’ll want me to be politically active, too.
I’m impressed. So far I’ve only followed your link to the piece about the election on your site, but I am blown away…
I wince at the word ‘spirituality’ (and ‘God’ o yeah) but that is only because I have seen it commodified and held up and pointed to by egocentric humans. For me, it’s deeply personal and not something I’m likely to discuss with just anyone.
I have so much more to say, but the brain fog is getting in the way.:( Will come back to your post here and explore your site via the links when I can comprehend things better…thanks for being out there.
Localize. Get to know your neighbor. Make time for your community. Learn how to deal with conflict in nonjudgmental and creative ways. Arrange your life so you’re not working so much and get off the internet!
I will have to get back to you *BUT*…I think there are more women on psych drugs (thus a diagnosis) than males mostly because men are reluctant to seek outside help when troubled/stressed.
That ol’ boy Freud was big on ‘hysteria’ and ‘neurosis’; just those words bring up, for me anyways, of troublesome women being committed to institutions waaaay more than males thanks partly to the power differential.
what I found on a cursory search:
I think re-localizing efforts and the transition community could be a way to help us reconnect. We’ve become atomized and alienated from ourselves, our neighbors, our families and the natural world.
We need imnsho, to dial it down, and live closer to what is authentic.
Or it may be that things have spun so far out of control with population/’resource’ pressures, that we might just have to make peace with this life and prioritize what’s important to us, then love it as if there’s no tomorrow.
Oh, hell…we’re doomed.
I call bullshit on more boys than girls get a psych diagnosis.
Communism, as I understand it, is an economic and political philosophy that has yet to implemented genuinely by any large, recognized, regional government.
The US is a “democracy”, right?
As oldhead pointed out to you above, the Soviet Union was never a true communist state. We’ve all grown up with and have become enculturated by the “communist” bogeyman via our capitalistic media.
(pressed ‘post’ the same time old head did, but it doesn’t hurt to reinforce the point)
Also I wonder about the evolutionary advantages of anxiety…surely our neolithic ancestors needed a little anxiety to spur them into action–us, too?
I’m quite sleep deprived, and I haven’t been able to think very deeply for some weeks now. It grieves me sorely. I used to be fairly ‘smart’. Maybe someday my head will clear and I’ll be able to read articles and understand them fully instead of this superficial skating I seem to be doing.:(
Waves and windows…waiting waiting waiting for that window~
This is a good article except for the plug for CBT and the watered down suggestion about possible drug therapy. Dovetails well with the main piece/review today about Marx regarding ‘mental illness’ as a tool for social control.
Thanks for this great review and critique.
Much to think about, more to do.
The propaganda machine dialed in on 11.
Pharma must be getting nervous.
There’s *hippy* people on this site who think they’re SHAMANs???
Guess I missed that. Or maybe the context is wrong. Or maybe they’re shamans…
*That* is good news.
Chilling story, tho.
Are you in Russia?
I thought the same thing…
Listening to this now–excellent!
Yep; it’s *important*.
Where is Matt coming from? (answer not necessary…pretty sure I’ve got the picture)
Yeah, I don’t see anything harsh in uprising’s response to you, Robert. Please do reconsider your decision about not commenting in the future…I don’t agree with some of your views, either, but your participation is most welcome.
Mountains can be made out of molehills thanks to super-sensitivity via iatrogenic damage? Only sayin’ that since I get that way, too.
Fellow Benzo-damaged person
Like *divorce*? Or loss of a home?
The ol’ UNDERLYING CONDITION bullshit again.
This is horrible. It is all so nightmarish.
I fear for us all.
I am associated with the local Hospice, and elders are *purposely* neglected or drugged for convenience. The quality of care for old people without family support or high-end insurance is dismal indeed — death panels by any other name.
Oldhead is the furthest thing from ‘right wing’.
Obamacare is a joke when your deductible is 5 grand and your co-pay is prohibitive.
Single payer NOW!
Everything goes downhill after the blood pressure medicine…that has been my observation and experience as a (former) RN. When I encounter folks who have just been prescribed, I do my best to educate them. Often I’m vilified.
“Modern Medicine ™” is barbaric and should only be engaged with eyes open.
I’m sorry for your loss, Suzanne, and thanks for writing down and submitting your story for others to consider.
Trump is grilling people’s brains and poisoning and electrocutes them?
Haven’t read *that* in the WaPo yet!/s
Then why are you fist bumping with the guy with the ex/ax to grind over there in the ‘BPD’ disorder article posted yesterday? You know, where you go on about your BPD diagnosed ex? Which is it cat? A DSM diagnosis is good for some but not for yourself?
Why are you participating on this site, cat?
What’s *your* diagnosis?
Again: it takes two to tango.
glad she got away…
I think you have an ex (hah typo, I meant *ax*) to grind, which is coloring your perceptions a wee tiny bit.
It takes two to tango, bro.
And if we had elected the D version of the corporate ruse that is called ‘democracy’, we’d be looking at war with Russia right now. The Ds are teaming up with the ‘intelligence community’ (you know, the folks who brought you ‘weapons of mass distraction’ and ‘gassing his own people’), the MSM, and the Military Industrial Complex to try to derail the current plutocrat in charge. What a joke; except it’s not.
Trump is a cartoon, but they’re all dangerous. It’s all about money, and the 99.9% are losing big time by not looking at the actual problem: the economic system.
CNN and MSNBC et al are foaming at the mouth hysterical, ranting about ‘fake news’–and the *irony* is that they’ve been onboard with that shit for a long, long long time.
You might learn a something by changing your sources for information. (And btw; who funds the MSM? Do you think those entities has your best interest at heart???)
Everyone who is flabbergasted by Trump’s election, and who can’t understand why *anyone* female or with a modicum of sense would have voted for him, you should check this essay out.
Trump sure doesn’t look ‘crazy’ in the embedded political ad.
Off topic but educational imnsho.
I will respond to Sera’s article, or to the comments here, in whatever way I feel is useful to the general readership.
Psychology is a tool of social control. Big picture.
You are not the editor here and it is not your place to limit the discussion to whatever *you* see as acceptable. Geez.
The larger picture impacts directly on the topic, and to deny that is (trying to be diplomatic, here), *silly*.
There’s big money in the “DSM and diagnosis (and such issues)”. It’s a *business*. It’s a *business* that makes money off people in distress. Marketing, capitalism…it’s all related, and to limit the discussion to just one part of the issue resolves nothing.
This ^^^. (In respond to uprising’s post) Until Democraps are able to do some serious self-reflection, nothing is going to change in the Democratic Party. It’s dead, kaput, over.
Hey, look! Over there! The russians the russians the russians o and those pesky deplorables…
What is a ‘liberal’ these days? Does it mean marching around in your pink pussy hat and then calling it good? How many *poor* people/poc were out there with you? Not many. They couldn’t take time off from McDonalds without losing needed income or getting canned.
Obama was horrible for those of us on the bottom of the economic pile (and for *lots* of ‘civilians’ in arabic countries); why can’t the ‘libruls’ see that? The terms ‘liberal’ and ‘progressive’ don’t mean much these days.
Trump being deemed ‘mentally ill’ is just another attempt to grasp at straws…I don’t think the hubbub has enhanced the current narrative much at all, imnsho.
Totally agree. Well stated.
MiA gets a LOT of Polish spam in the forums, and staff doesn’t deal with it in a timely matter for whatever reason. Sorry that puts you off; it’s a shame.
MiA is all ‘we’ got right now.
And Julie, the saying, “the personal is political” is thought by some to be just another device to keep us atomized and on our own as *individuals*; kinda like how the ‘think positive’ meme was introduced into public consciousness around the time of Ronny Rayguns.
This lack of access to the legal system for lack of money is NOTHING NEW.
It’s the *injustice* system and has been forever.
Thanks for the article, and *thanks* for all the great comments. So true, all of it.
Thanks for the heartfelt writing. You put words to my own ‘dark side’ and the conclusions I’ve come to about my own life. Yup. Shit happens. Our monkey brains seem to have a deep need to make sense of things–and that often leads to false narratives and spectacular cruelty.
I still have problems with the word ‘love’–that’s my own struggle. I *love* life and everything is alive but humans are still a dangerous and unpredictable challenge to me. I can give the people around me a break when I’m able to give myself one. Your essay helps me do that.
Thank you, Dr. Hickey, for this review. Additions to the arsenal are always welcome. How to break thru to to the mainstream like R. Whitaker managed to do with his book, “Anatomy of an Epidemic”?
Has anyone here ever communicated with Marcia Angell in regard to ‘anti-psychiatry’? I know she’s critical–it was her review of “Anatomy” in the NYRB that lead me to my present state of being med-free (but still suffering the iatrogenic damage). Would I have been better off still taking the drugs? Sometimes I wonder, but on the whole, glad and grateful to know the truth.
Even now, into my 36th month of significant impairment after quitting Klonopin? I’m sure the many other psych meds over the last 10 years didn’t help, either.
It would be *wonderful* for this iatrogenic damage to finally be acknowledged, at the very least, and compensated for. Really, I’d much rather have my life back…and with no end in sight, at times it’s hard to hang on.
Everyone on BenzoBuddies (<30,000 registrants) and Surviving Antidepressants would like some *proof*, I'm sure. Because right now, as it is, no one believes us.
Thanks for this very useful article.
I’ve had people online at other sites extoll “Dr.” Amen’s clinics and skills…and a close friend has had her son FUBAR (don’t know how to help that boy at this point) by a ‘diagnosis’ from one of “Dr.” Amen’s brainscans (only 3+grand) and given a fistful of prescriptions. Just last month he cold turkeyed his *whatever* and ended up in jail for running loose on the freeway.
Sad sad sad.
That’s so depressing. What’s more depressing is I’ve seen similar scenarios in my own neck of the woods.
No place to run, no place to hide.
CBT doesn’t work for everybody, but I think using mindfulness as a tool to get thru the muck, and otherwise, is extremely useful.
I don’t think anyone can “prove” anything from a brainscan.
I just need to ‘change my thoughts’…hmm. Sounds a lot like *positive thinking*, which is all the rage nowadays. Pull yourself up by your bootstraps; it’s your MIND keeping you back, and thus, your own fault.
Dr. Jeffery Schwartz…and his neuro-imaging? Sounds like more pseudoscience.
apples and oranges, Frank
Yeah, really sick of his rant/obsession about this.
The ‘taxpayers’ are paying for a lot of evil shit, but if even a crumb drops down to those whose lives have been ruined by psychiatry, he just can’t stand it.
If I wasn’t *disabled* before I met the shrink, I sure am now.
And yeah. I lost *EVERYTHING*.
What’s sad is the ‘med’ lines in *correctional facilities*. County jails have staff psychiatrists…
Folks in jail are almost as drugged, but it’s ‘voluntary’. Never let a good Klonopin go to waste.
I read your link; Robert Whitaker was never diagnosed with anything as far as I know. He came into this subject as a journalist/science writer.
For now, MiA is our ‘room’, or at least *I* consider it that way.
Glad you made it, aria.
Thanks for that ^ Subvet…a great tidbit of succinct information, there.
Wasn’t *insisting*, just defending oldhead in his actions.
Thanks for the link; lots to read there and I only skimmed it. We could use someone like you with your knowledge and skills here in the US…
That was the *other* Carrie Fisher article; shook did not comment in this one. And I agree with oldhead; this thread got hijacked by shaun and julie and was off topic.
Sure, she can believe and injest whatever she wants.
‘Cept she was snarky from the jump, too.
Guess you missed it.
Thing is, shaun, I don’t *believe* in ‘mental health’ care. ‘Mental Health’ care has harmed me, possibly irreparably.
But you keep on acting like it’s some kind of panacea for humanity’s ills.
O, right. Your income depends on it.
Replying to shaun @ 12:05 Jan 5
Whelp, shaun, I’ve been to a goodly number of counselors/therapists, some of which gave me bad advice, btw…and it all felt, I dunno, *icky*…like paying a whore. Inauthentic. Ya know?
As far as the ‘dysfunctionality’ of other cultures; how can you deny that we have become more isolated and cut off from family/friends/community with the advent of the *automobile*, the ‘mobil phone’ and the ‘internet’. How many hours do folks spend on Faceborg these days instead of interacting in their neighborhoods? We are being atomized and isolated, and then we are blamed as individuals for our misfortunes, the result of our ‘character flaws’ and our ‘broken brains’. Divide and conquer. A very old technique with a new, post-modern, twist.
Yup. I do think real community is possible, I have experienced it. But people must be given the space and time to create it and it’s nigh on impossible in these late days of capitalism. We just need to slow down and not have to work so hard to survive.
Oh, and ps: there’s, what, 7.4 humans on the planet? The petri dish is getting crowded and people need their ‘stuff’.
Therapy, in my nsho, is a substitute for the connects that have been severed by capitalism and industrialization.
It’s just a sad statement of our current dysfunction as a specie.
I would suggest that anyone experiencing distress stay far far away from psychiatry and therapists.
Cultivating friendships and community is the way to keep yourself connected and supported…while you also learn to support and nurture others.
Anyone who makes money off another person’s distress is messed up.
Lawyers, doctors, psychiatrists, counselors etc.
<3 to you, rebel.
in my comment on Jan 3 at 6:11 pm there is a typo
it is not ‘inject’ (lordy) but INGEST
lots of supplements, if not most, exacerbate the symptoms as many on BB find out
The ‘false narrative’ is called psychiatry.
“Humanbeing, so tell me this, didn’t you get meds from a pharmacist? When you pick up meds there is a sheet that goes with it which tells you more info about the med, including side effects to watch out for.” shaun f way upthread ^^^
As a *former* RN, I tell/told patients that the pharmacists were untapped treasures troves of real information about the drugs; unfortunately, their business is to (guess what?) sell drugs. My pharmacists actually gave me advice as to which of my cocktail of drugs to wean off of first. He did not, however, know *anything* about the nightmare that the benzo has been, and still is for me 36 months later, HELL ON EARTH. And on bad days, I wish that hell could be experienced by every prescriber who has told their patients that it’s ‘just their mental illness/anxiety’ coming back. When people get off the meds, very often too fast and with zip for guidance, they DON’T KNOW what’s happening to them…hell, I didn’t know what interdose withdrawal was until after my year and a half taper off of a 9 year 0.5 mg of Klonopin routine (you know, for my ‘chemical imbalance’–which the pharmacist totally believed in) and I was lucky enough to have an internet connection and discovered the other 30,000 people who take part in BenzoBuddies.
So yeah, I did that. My only real concern with the Klonopin in particular, was addiction. But I was reassured over and over again that I was taking “such a small amount” and I NEVER increased my dose, and it *seemed* to be working for my (originally situational) insomnia (until the interpose withdrawal experiences which my provider/s were CLUELESS about and did not ADDRESS).
It’s been HELL ON EARTH. THe akathisia the days/weeks without sleep, the cognitive loss, the loss of my creativity and my stamina, my food intolerances, my ability to tolerate *life* (and ever so much more)…my nervous system has been thru the wringer, and you *wonder why* I’m so ANTI PSYCHIATRY. I only wish those of you who so enthusiastically recommend/prescribe these drugs experience that hell. Those of us who have lived or are still living thru it are the some of the strongest, the bravest people on the planet…The CIA could not invent a better torture technique…and who knows? As far as the ECT enthusiast goes; you know, it struck me while in nursing school just how *barbaric* modern medicine is. I was offered ECT at one point and I’ve ever so glad I had the option of refusing.
People commit suicide *all the time* as a result of psych med withdrawal…I have *lots* more stories (like when I had a bad reaction–major hostility, which is also part of benzo PAWS, if you get my drift except this time I won’t end up in JAIL–to a newly prescribed anti-depressant and the shrink wanted me to UP MY DOSE!!!) But I’m firing on 2 cylinders and it’s time to calm down so maybe maybe maybe I can get a coupla hours of sleep tonight.
There’s plenty of sites that would welcome your views on drug therapy. What you’ve stumbled upon, is a site that has an alternative narrative to the psych/pharma party line. We are SURVIVORS of the drugging and the labels, and have found support and camaraderie here. WHat you and shaun and shook? offer is the same old same old, and seems to me to be *planned* so that when someone comes here QUESTIONING their diagnosis or their ‘treatment’ they are baffled by the bullshit, just as the media and their ‘health care’ providers do, pulling out their ‘credentials’ and their degrees. Some of us are also credentialed and have degrees but because there were no other options for us when we found ourselves in distress, we ended up in the system. A system that kills those on psych meds on average 25 years sooner than those who never venture into the world of psychiatry.
Which is what this article is about.
Guess what? I don’t give a shit. THis site seems to have adopted a meeker position with the recent changes; maybe their strategy is smart. I KNOW from working for change in political groups in the past that as soon as you start dressing in suits (figuratively) and piping in elevator music that you’ve lost your way.
I’m looking for the undoing of a false god that is killing and neutering millions of creative, unique humans who but for the grace of god (so to speak) could have what it takes to lead our world to a better place. This culture kills the diverse. Diversity is the key to survival…and at this point, what’s the use. I don’t need this place. I was loyal to it out of respect for RW…as it was him and his book that set me free.
Safe for tools of abuse and torturers?
I can read about mainstream anywhere in the MSM, but to have it invade *here* so blithely, and ‘trigger’ so many of us SURVIVORS. I’ve been bullied all my life by people like these and I don’t need and won’t put up with it ANYMORE.
I’ve lost years of my life because of people like these.
O my, we are too *uneducated* to understand the studies…hmmm guess all that science I took for my nursing degree makes me an idiot…o wait–the brain damage that I’m still trying to recover from by taking the DRUGS that were made available to me (not therapy, not help with my financial situation, not help with childcare with 2 under 5 and a 2 teens and an alcoholic husband) without INFORMED CONSENT that was ACCURATE. The docs have zero clue how to discontinue the drugs safely, and when *many many many* people do try to get off their prescribed drugs, *symptoms* pop up which are then DRUGGED some more!
Silly me…just a stupid sheep bleating in the field waiting for the big, awesome, smart *PROFESSIONAL* to set me straight.
Treating people with drugs without an honest INFORMED CONSENT is just *wrong*, shaun f. Neuroscientists and psychiatrist/psychologists know *so little* about the brain, and yet pretend that they know *so much* — causing HARM to those who find themselves in distress and turn to the ‘professionals’ for HELP. THe hubris is shocking. The vow ‘first do no harm’ has been subsumed by profit and quackery.
(again I notice that the comment are out of sequence–annoying)
*I* didn’t have ACCESS to the internet when I was dealing with my “issues”…I lived in POVERTY. I had no CAR. Your assumption that everyone is equal when it comes to information, and they are just lazy dumbasses for not finding out about the awful truth regarding psychiatry/psych drugs is ignorant. I ACCIDENTALLY read a review for “Anatomy of an Epidemic” in the New York Review of Books and here I am — off all the brain changing drugs and trying to get my life back.
And psychiatry could also be held to the same standards, right?
Dr. Mengle thought he was doing god’s work, too.
Psychiatry has a obvious historical links to eugenics and social control.
And as I keep saying, who gets to decide who is ‘mentally ill’? Subjective bullshit wrought by those in power and with economic interests, that’s who.
Blood letting used to be big, too. Your field is harmful to human life. Period.
Have you read any of the other articles on this site, or are you focusing only on this one for some sort of strategic reason?
Yes! Great post, pulpamor.
Read the book, shaun f.
Then get back to us.
It will make you a better helper.
Because I actively want to prevent more people from being sucked into the system like I was and the subsequent hell of the drugs, the impact on my life, and now the brain injury that I’m trying to overcome from the drugs. Simple. As an RN part of my job was patient education, and I like to think, in my small way, I’ve given folks another option.
The founder of this site, Robert Whitaker’s book, “Anatomy of an Epidemic”, opened my eyes to what was happening to me…and inspired me to get off the drugs I was prescribed for my ‘bipolar’ disorder…allegedly I needed to be medicated for life. I was astonished to find out that the ‘chemical imbalance’ explanation was a myth, and the well researched, footnoted and gastly mini-history of psych drugs was an eye-opener. And learning that those who inject these ‘drugs’ die on average 25 years sooner than the general population. The basic premise of the book is this: if “mental health” treatments are all that during these *modern times* why is it there’s so many people on the disability roles for ‘severe mental illness’. Psych meds/pharmaceuticals are billions of dollars businesses, screenings are literally *everywhere*, we’ve got ads on television telling us that if we’re not perfectly happy, there’s a pill for it….Pharma has a bigger lobbying presence than *any other* industry. Read the book. Or are you afraid to find out facts that would run counter to the truth you tell about yourself? Go on, read it. I dare you.
I would ask you the same question — why are YOU here? Your vigorous defense of your chemical cure makes me think you doth protest too much…princess.
You’re right, that. It *is* a religion.
“reasonable responses from people like myself are often ignored or minimized”
Maybe because these ‘reasonable people’ have harmed us? And we don’t want anyone else to get caught up in the trap of a bullshit field based on shaky ‘science’ dispensing bullshit diagnosis based on ‘opinion’ . Just guessing…
Sometimes things are obvious and the ability to extrapolate from the information offered doesn’t make me a bad person, as you are inferring, P.
Can’t own a horse without some significant financial resources in my world.
To deny that economic status is correlated to stability and safely is dishonest.
It’s a poor substitute, however, for a safe place to live and an adequate food supply, not to mention fluff like meaningful work and a community/family to provide mutual support.
It occurs to me, P, that you are doing so well *because* of your charmed position and circumstances.
Owning horses isn’t for anyone less than ‘comfortable’. I love horses, and have cared for them for years for others, but know that my ‘station in life’ and responsibilities elsewhere and my adverse life circumstances would keep me from enjoying an equine companion for purely financial reasons.
Shit happens to people. Sure, I made the decision to marry the abusive spouse who took me to the cleaners and removed my children from my care via the CORRUPT family court system, but the set up happened when I was an innocent child, unable to defend myself or remove myself from adversity.
Psych meds added another 20 years of hell to an already *challenging* life…and I’m still recovering from the brain damage after quitting them all 3 years ago. My life has forever been ruined by obtaining a psych diagnosis, as result of my grief and poverty after finally getting free from a manipulative man who spent our whole marriage telling me who I was and what I was thinking.
I am happier now, med and psychiatry free, than I have been since forever. I’ve learned skills to self-soothe and developed a way of seeing the world and a new appreciation for life on this planet than I otherwise would have.
Psychiatry is a tool for social control. To fail to see this and to ignore the history of the field is not ethical.
Just as an aside; as a former ‘health care’ professional, it seems to me that those interested in psychology as a field have some unresolved issues their own selves. As my psych instructor in nursing school said on our first day of the rotation, “most psychiatrists are crazy”…
The problem as I see it is: who gets to define ‘mental illness’? If that entity is making money from ‘mentally ill’ people, then I consider that worth noting.
Are you suggesting that we all ‘cope’ the same way, and that’s what make one ‘mentally healthy’? What does being ‘mentally healthy’ mean to you? Perhaps economic productivity? What is ‘normal’ and just who gets to decide that?
I have to wonder what brought you to this site? What is your purpose here? Seriously; I want to know.
Have *you* read “Anatomy of an Epidemic” or looked into any of Peter Gøtzsche’ work? His book, “Deadly Medicine and Organized Crime” is worth looking into for anyone taking psych drugs or contemplating such.
I think this ‘free will’ thing is all well and good if a person is *truly* informed about the DRUG they’re consuming. But the prescribers aren’t even aware of the harms caused and they’re ignorant about how to discontinue their drugs safely.
That’s my beef. There is no true informed consent when it comes to these substances.
Thanks ever so much for this, Noel. We’ve been stepping in it here lately….true believers out in force.
It’s called ‘spellbinding’
What concerns me is that one commenter can lie/be ignorant and leave it in the ‘record’ for others to find in the days and weeks and years to come.
As if the mainstream media has ever given any of us space! And now we must muster all our forces to make points only to have that person immediately refute them with more misinformation. Sorry my brian has been damaged and I’m not at the peak of my game.
I’m not Robert Whitaker, and I only wish that people who comment on here were familiar with his work.
The elephant in the room.
Yeah, that ^^^.
The ‘practitioners’ who are handing out the drugs *don’t have a clue* about long term effects, or how to DISCONTINUE them SAFELY.
I think you’re deluding yourself. Ever heard of the Murphy bill? (21st Century Cures Act) You don’t have 5150 in Colorado? Bullshit. You’re either very young, or you’re being disingenuous.
“We offer our expertise” TAKE A LOOK AROUND, shaun. Do you really *know* about the meds they’re pushing for big pharma? Do you know how to safely discontinue the brain altering drugs? Your inexperience or hubris is dangerous to others. A little humility would serve you if you *really* just want to help people.
Who gets to define ‘safe’? Who gets to define ‘illness’? Right.
No time or inclination to debate you, shaun f. As I said before, take a look around this site. You might learn something from a different perspective.
Hey shaun f
You might want to take a gander at some of the other information/articles on this site.
The only ‘treatment’ available to people in distress (caused by poverty, family dysfunction/violence, the breakdown of community, recreational drug abuse) is *psych drugs*. That’s it. And maybe maybe after a few years the prescriber can get the ‘right’ combination for ya. Psych drugs don’t CURE anything. There is no proof of ‘chemical imbalances’ in distressed people’s brains. Maybe, if you’re wealthy, there could be some counseling by a ‘mental health’ professional if you’re lucky. There is NO PROOF, NO TESTS, nada, nothing, zip (not even ‘genetic testing’ or ‘brain scans’) that can accurately diagnose ‘mental illnesses’.
Psychiatry and psychology are ultimately forms of social control.
To help those who ‘can’t take care of themselves’ our resources would be better spent supporting families in poverty, strengthening communities, and finding ways to encourage a meaningful existence, instead of the dog eat dog rat race to the bottom disposable paradigm we got.
Keep your ‘good/educated’ judgements and coercion off my body.
Maybe it was a way to get Bonnie’s article off the main page quickly?
Uh o PARANOIA strikes deep…
Are you perhaps replying to the wrong blog (this is Dr. Shipko’s post, not yours)…just wondering.
And yeah, it’s the RUSSIANS:)
You aren’t ‘changing’ anything! You are validating it!
I’m so disgusted.
The diagnoses aren’t real, they are made up to support a power over structure and various moneymaking enterprises. There is no ‘test’ to prove your brain is ‘chemically’ imbalanced or ‘diseased’! The drugs don’t *cure* anything! They tamp down unwanted emotions or feelings, and ultimately cause more damages than the original distress! Have you even read Robert Whitaker’s book(s)??
Geez, where am I???
I’m wavering…thanks for corroborating my ‘reality’! hah
MiA seems to me to be toning down their critique of the “Mental Health System” lately as evidenced by recent posts.
and this PHD lady who recommends drugs to strangers in the comments section
If I wanted to read mainstream view on psychiatry/’medications’ I would read mainstream sites.
Why is this article even posted?
What is up with MiA? We’ve got the PHD pushing drugs on another current article. Can read about all this stuff on *ANY OTHER MAINSTREAM MEDIA* !
“if you are bipolar 2”
Wow, Ekaterina–you really are quite mainstream, aren’t you.
There is *no such thing* as ‘bipolar 2’…that diagnosis only came about with the advent of SSRIs–I can’t tell you how many people I know who were prescribed an SSRI for an ‘event’ in their lives, only to be diagnosed later with ‘bipolar 2’–skyrocketing the polydrugging of a huge population that all of a sudden were ‘severely mentally ill’ requiring drugs for life (according to psychiatrists and drug companies). Lithium has *severe* side effects, and a true informed consent, even with such an ‘old’ drug, doesn’t exist.
Wondering about MiA’s mission *again*.
I disagree with the focus on this story. Lets make it about ‘abuse’, shall we??? In the scheme of things, how many are ‘abusing’ benzos compared to how many compliant patients, just taking the ‘medicine’ as the doctor ordered?
Let’s not talk about the millions of prescriptions that are written for benzos, or the lack of *informed consent* or the ignorance about what this class of drugs do to the brain, and then the ADDED ignorance of prescribers who know NOTHING about how to wean the patients they’ve made dependent off the drug safely… or the lack of knowledge/recognition of interdose withdrawal, or how many get drugs on top of the benzos for *those* symptoms.
Sorry, stories like this seem a bit like the Democrats screaming ‘the Russians! the Russians!’ to take the focus off their own corruption/ineptitude.
Great post, pulpamor.
You have found BenzoBuddies, right? You’ve done an amazing job of educating yourself, and I like your attitude!:)
Benzos are the worst thing (well, besides one other traumatic event) that has ever happened to me.
Yup, you just gotta go thru it…if people/the medicos only knew how brave and strong we are. But *we* know. Good luck…
There are so many bullshit conclusions in some of these studies.
A lot of this is just ignorant and wrong and *dangerous*.
The damages caused by this class of drugs remains hidden and misdiagnosed. Check out BenzoBuddies for more of a first-person experience, all ~30,000* of ’em, which isn’t worth crap to the ‘scientists’.
There is far more than ‘anxiety’ going on.
*How many who get caught up in the Iatrogenic Damages caused by benzodiazepines actually have access to a computer, or speak English? This ‘problem’ is vast and remains unrecognized ruining lives worldwide.
No, but it might possibly make you ‘spellbound’. You should check out Robert Whitaker’s “Anatomy of an Epidemic”.
If psych meds are so *good*, how do you explain the increase in and the prevalence of so much ‘mental illness’ in this country (or other ‘western civilization centers or outposts’)? Meds are a first option for treatment for a variety of physical and psychic ills, and a big big business. Big Pharma has the *largest* lobbying presence in Washington DC! More than oil, more than the military industrial complex, more than *the bankers*!
If you truly had informed consent before starting your ‘treatment’ with pharmaceuticals, and still think it’s worth the risk, then knock yourself out. If you look around this site at all you will notice how many stories there are of folks who went to their doctors for help with some sort of distress, and ended up harmed by the treatment that was suppose to ‘help’.
Wish I could *afford* a pet, or find housing that allows pets.
Don’t worry, pets ARE just another commodity.
Back in another life, I had a dog who came down with Lyme disease…just a plain blood count from the vet cost 4x what it did for humans back then! The amount of money spent on pets these days is astronomical. And then I start thinking about all the dog poop I see walking around in my town…
“or wet water”
I’m asleep and having a nightmare…right? O please please….
The correct term for some of us is ‘iatrogenically dependent’.
When getting treatment, the terms can be important.
I’m still climbing out of the hell 35 1/2 months later. I’m sure you’ve run into BenzoBuddies…sounds like you have.
But no–I’m *not* an ‘accidental addict’…and yes, physicians and psychiatrists need to take some responsibility for their ignorance about ID.
I *don’t* think it’s a JOKE. I DO think ‘liberals’ and ‘progressives’ need to examine just who they’ve been supporting lo these last 16 years.
I am waaaaay beyond ‘liberal’. I did NOT vote or support Trump. I actually see homelessness and starvation in my future.
I just don’t get my information from the MSM, and curate my sources carefully. The fact that the Democrats can’t take responsibility for their failure, and their candidate’s loss, or be able to fathom the reasons why…and to BLAME everyone else but themselves is, yes, COMICAL.
I’m sorry you’re so afraid. We all are, but we just have different ways of handling it, obviously. Are you ready to get out into the streets now?
The EC vote casting…(19th of December. The ‘libruls’ still hoping the Ruskies can be implicated in vote tampering and *somehow* DJT will be rejected by the Electoral College.)
Oh, and PUTIN! (bare chested! HAHAHAHA)
One of the ironies of all this: Trump hasn’t even stepped foot in the White House yet. But still, all my ‘liberal’ friends are running around like chickens with their heads cut off sputtering “Fascism is 18 days away!”
I am speechless.
Thanks for your efforts, everyone.
What a surprise, right?
Yeah, I get that. Thanks for putting it in a way that I can hear. But, really? No MLK quotes? I’m forbidden to admire and look up to MLK and Malcolm and Che and Sitting Bull etc etc — I am forbidden to quote them? That’s going a little too far imnsho.
Right, Richard. You’re right.
I think Matt’s content here is problematic. It’s Richard’s and oldhead’s responses to you/Iden that I’m finding myself in agreement with.
I *do* think you are not as familiar with the political blogs/information that I seem to share with them, or the criticisms of what passes these days as ‘liberal’/progressive positions. It’s all become dilute with the entrenchment of neoliberalism. ‘Identity Politics’ is a tool used by neoliberalism to divide and conquer. Surely you’ve heard of the circular firing squad??? Capitalism is the problem overriding all other concerns.
Of course I related better to the “Dear Man” blog entry. I still maintain there is some difference, other than the targeted audience, between these two articles–what is it you want a person to take away from this article? To capitalize ‘Black’? To not use the term ‘psychiatric slavery’? To endow poc’s with authority and give them power in whatever group dynamic I’m also involved in? How can I do that when I don’t have those things, either? I *can’t* take on someone else’s experience or history…all I can do is listen and empathize and support them if I see them being mistreated. And why would I want to do that if they’re hostile to me?
I am just one person living in a rather isolated area with not a lot of access to political power, not unlike most disenfranchised poor people.
We don’t seem to be getting anywhere here. We are just entrenching ourselves into our dogma, thus achieving the goal the people in power hoped for. Complete deadlock, and ineffective.
Sure, Sera. But I’m not sure why *you* can’t see how whatever ‘unity’ there was in the ‘movement’ has been served by the attitudes demonstrated not only in the article itself (the tone is decidedly hostile), but the response by the authors to the commenters. Believe me, I’m scratching my head wondering how I came to the position here on this blog where I’m actually agreeing with oldhead and Richard-I have had many differences with them in the past (the ‘Dear Man blog). I’m not smart enough to do an analysis comparing the 2 blogs, but surely there’s someone out there who can name where this blog went wrong–or is it me and the nature of the issue?
Of course we should all check ourselves and be sensitive to the feelings of disempowered of fellow participants. Isn’t that just part of being a caring human being? (‘scuse the joke) You’re right that the ‘leadership’ of most political/social justice (cringing on that term) inevitably is run by white males. But I think the analogy that Frank made above about rape/psychiatric rape is somewhat comparable. As a person who has been raped, it bothers me not the use of the term with regards to psychiatry.
It’s the tone here. You are asking us to examine the role of racism in our ‘movement’…you are telling us that some poc are not being heard or having room made for them. The same could be said for women and poor people too, right? But it’s the way you all have said it. It feels divisive and authoritarian. It makes me want to rebel.
Maybe someday I’ll wake up in the middle of the night with blinding insight as to what it is you all thought you were getting at when you wrote this, and I’ll be duly enlightened and even, perhaps, figure out a way to explain it to others in a less hostile way.
Or maybe not, since I was born a white female in a relatively prosperous 1st world (that’s up for debate, too) country.
We are all in this thing together. I don’t know how to facilitate the evolution of attitudes we as a specie need to make in order to honor ourselves and the other people and life around us. It may be asking too much. We are just silly, imperfect human beings (joke again), an evolutionary experiment, bumbling along the best we can with no predetermined outcome. Again, for me, myself, my ‘activism’ is ultra local. And I see progress being made on the fronts I chose to engage.
I wish I could see what you’re seeing.
How has this article unified ‘us’ in the ‘movement’ at all?
Maybe I’m wrong, but I think this article applies to this conversation. Not that I’m all that enamored of ‘Salon’ as a source.
O, and reading thru the thread (a slog) I ran into this comment by Iden:
“You said it. Your words carry more weight than mine…right? I’m just a lone Black voice.”
When I hear/read stuff like that, it just gets my back up. Poor poor you. Perhaps this blog, the timing, the personalities involved was not well thought out or the right people employed. You are not going to win minds with the anger you so vehemently display here. I do not deny that there is systemic racism in *all realms* of public/private life by those of us who make up ‘Western Civilization’, and I don’t mind being called out on offensive behavior and asked to correct my ‘attitude’…but when those who are trying to do the correcting have obvious attitudes themselves…it does not serve you or your message.
There is great suffering in the world. Let’s just try to be kind, huh? I have learned in the last 3 years of my PAWS experience a little saying, “it is better to be kind than to be right”…how do *YOU* want to be remembered?
I would *welcome* Iden, Earl or whoever as human beings (hah) into whatever space I’m occupying at the moment. I would of course, notice that they were Black (or brown or red or yellow or purple or *whatever*) just like I would notice their hairstyle or their clothing choices. The first thing humans notice when encountering other humans is their *sex*. Pretty basic human behavior stuff. Personally, I try to be my best possible self in whatever situation I have found myself in, admittedly not always successfully–and I’ve been in some ‘interesting’ situations (jail, minority white girl in my Jr High School, only white patient in a hospital, the only white girl in a packing house) and managed to not only adapt, but learn *loads* of stuff I would not have normally have learned. But to focus on this one issue I believe takes away from overall important survival issues. I don’t know what it’s like to be Black, Brown, Yellow, gay, trans etc but we are all traumatized by our culture in different ways and at individually unique levels.
I just feel ‘identity politics’ divides us, it does not unite us.
I’ll try to re read the post and be more open minded. I usually like your blogs, Sera. I do find it interesting that they’re always *controversial*!!!!
Nobody is asking you to do that. What some of us are trying to say is that there are *big picture* concerns. Race/sex discrimination is real, yes. But as a HUMAN there are big issues facing us that include looming extinction.
We need to unite on a universal level and proceed from there.
That would be *me*, Iden. Humanbeing. Another *POOR* person harmed by psychiatry.
POOR people are having a rough time of it right now and we’re being asked to not talk about class but to only focus on race, religion etc.
POOR POVERTY let’s talk about that. Disposable POOR people. I think we can all unite around that. If we *want* to.
“I’m not denying that minorities are mistreated worse in psychiatric institutions. I’ve noticed in my own experience that minority people or poor people are more targeted. But I’m willing to stand behind anyone, regardless of race, who challenges psychiatry. The numbers, the demographics, shit, even the people themselves aren’t what’s most important to me. It’s the ideas that I’m concerned about, specifically the ideas challenging psychiatry’s intellectual and legal authority. I’m not interested in infighting”–Bingram
I’m just so tired.
Can’t we all get along? I’m willing to listen and to learn but I am *saturated* and feel beat over the head to have the right thoughts, the right words (*pronouns* now, too), the right attitude. I really do try to retain some humility. I have experienced certain levels of oppression in my life as a female in a patriarchal society but that’s not enough. I *do not* see color when dealing with others on a one-on-one basis, and yet can appreciate the stories of what it means to BE that person. Yes, institutions and organizations are whacked and lopsided and please, lets empower those who have been marginalized and encourage their leadership skills. But in my perfect world, WE ALL would take a turn at leadership.
I’m seeing a similarity to ‘identity politics’ and DSM categories. They both need to have the ‘stigma’ removed according to the progenitors.
Hell, I’m still dealing with brain damage and haven’t slept well in 2 weeks–this is all too much and feels really bad. Sorry if I’m not properly checking my privilege or not making sense. I really do try to be kind most of the time, and that’s what I try to live by.
I’m fucking afraid to say *anything* at all anymore.
Totalitarianism from the SJWs.
Saved to documents.
Good article, thanks for posting.
Called ’em all. Talked to 2 staffers, Diane Feinstein’s wanted my zip code.
My heart pounded for a half hour afterwards.
Succinct, just in the nick of time, and extremely useful–Well done!
Many thanks to you, Lauren Tenney!
Feel your feelings.
Everything changes, especially feelings.
I checked this article out just today, wary of anything the WaPo would write about in a fair and honest way. I was surprised. Great article; finally, this epidemic of iatrogenic damage caused by psych meds is being discussed in mainstream news.
Thanks for bringing this to my attention. Bookmarked for future reference.
This is a *great* read. Thanks to all!
Bookmarking it for furthering my arguments in my little corner of the world.
I just copy and pasted this article in the comments of a local paper, where one of the county supervisors (who has a ‘bipolar’ diagnosis) wigged out and was tazed and arrested for domestic violence. I have lived thru a similar episode after being prescribed imiprimine for postpartum depression–a horrifying and humiliating experience. What I needed was *support* but all I got were drugs, which led to a diagnosis, and never mind the trip to the county jail.
As the years pass, and I free myself from both the drugs and the diagnosis, and form the threads of support that make my life happier than I’ve ever been, I hear stories in my community of similar situations where a beloved family member wigs out after starting/stopping a prescribed psych drug. It is all too common.
Ooops…I replied not knowing Tim was right on it.
An ‘informational ad’???….if these tests are available, and the parameters are known for what is considered *normal* for these neurotransmitters, then surely we can figure out what dosages are needed for a cure for an individual’s ‘chemical imbalance’. But that never happens. Look at disability rates for ‘mental illness’ in this country.
Just like the myth that neuroscientists can test for a person’s genetic makeup (or *horrors*–test inutero) for schizophrenia, bipolar, ADHD etc., right?
Follow the money.
Are there blood tests for dopamine levels now? Who knew? A diagnosis is just a blood test away!!!
*der*…damn benzobrain. BDS. Boycott, Divestment, and Sanctions.
Change rarely comes ‘from within’…I do not in any way see this as a puff piece about the author.
Thank you, Bonnie for all the good work you’re doing. I wonder tho, about your faith in ‘academic freedom’…and it’s endurance in public/private institutions. I have seen what has happened to the BSD movement; the firing of professors, the squelching of dissent on campus…the *laws* passed forbidding the support of Palestine in their struggles against the realities of living under apartheid in the ever expanding state of Israel. I am the only one who sees the similarities of all current social justice issues?
I’m excited to read your post here today; MiA has me worried with all the recent changes. It’s refreshing to ‘hear’ someone talk about anti psychiatry ‘out loud’.
I wigged out on Imipramine, a tricyclic.
Any drug that affects brain chemistry is suspect.
I agree; I saw this *a lot* when I worked in a Community Clinic(™)…They now require drug tests before renewing existing ‘scripts, humiliating already compliant patients in genuine need of relief from chronic, debilitating pain. My neighbor needs medical care but now refuses to go to the clinic for her *heart meds* cuz they now require her to submit to drug testing.
‘Modern Medicine'(™ again) proved to be so barbaric in my mind that I can no longer in all good conscious, work in that field. *RIght Livelyhood* and all that…
Fucking give it a rest, Frank.
We get your little obsession; too bad you have nothing to say about the 1% who offshore their ‘assets’ and pay zip in the way of taxes.
O, right, you don’t believe in taxes…cuz you don’t use Medicare or drive on roads or go to your local library…you are totally self-sufficient and are now able to direct us slouches from you palatial estate about the error of our filthy ways.
I so want to be in a ‘movement’ with you…
Hey, I think we should just spend more money on war toys and overseas adventures…and then blame ‘welfare’!
You sound like a sad, lonely and rigid person Frank. Compassion and human kindness seem incompatible with your world view. So sorry for whatever it is that happened to you that makes you so bitter.
Maybe they should put you in charge of handing out the Black Pill. I’m ready for it~
Could be the zopiclone piled onto the AD.
It acts as a benzodiazepine (even tho they say it’s not)…you might have been kindled by the AD.
Check out BenzoBuddies for more stories like yours and support.
I hope you feel better soon.
First they laugh at you, then they….etc etc
Looks like we’re in the fight you stage.
Would niacin (not the amine) then help to regrow instantly the gaba receptors that have been re-absorbed from regular benzo use?
Cuz that’s the issue. As I keep trying to tell you.
Awesome essay, Jen. I share your conclusions; all these different issues are *connected*–YES!
What is the greatest threat facing life on earth today?
Is it psychiatry? Is it (lack of) health care? Is it GMOs? Is it racism? Is it endless war? Is it global climate change? Is it the police state? Is it immigrants? Is it Russia/Isis? Is it the Democrats/Republicans? All these separate issues keep us divided and vying for resources…not unplanned by the elite, imo.
Capitalism with the constant chant of “growth” and “profits” is killing us like a cancer. Can we challenge it successfully in time before life as we know it is wiped out?
I often think that the human specie is a failed experiment, facing an evolutionary ‘cliff’ as you’ve mentioned. I don’t think ‘we’ are smart enough to pull it together in time. On good days, I can live with that and accept it. For myself, knowing that does not mean I quit struggling with the greed and mindlessness I find myself surrounded by. It does not mean I am not angry, tired, disappointed and grieving.
Fight for what is important to you until the very last breath.
I could never shut-up about all the injustice either.
Thanks for what you are doing:)
That’s awful, Zelda. I’m so sorry you all are going thru this…good luck in breaking the pattern! You found your way here – it’s a start!
Just because I haven’t ‘forgiven’ my abuser/s doesn’t mean I’m not *advancing* and *growing* on my own path.
I thank Dr. B for this article; tired of the *forgiveness* for my ‘own’ sake pushed by various friends/former therapists as much as I’m sick to death of ‘thinking positive’…I’m actually doing pretty well, considering the brain damage and all. I have moved on with my life in spite of all the guru’s dire warnings.
Did I miss the part that tells us how much it costs?
A year is not long enough, imo, to detox off psych meds; certainly not benzodiazepines.
The utopia we are all seeking…
Black lives matter, too.
That’s the point I believe the BLM folks are trying to make.
Not to mention the damage done to that 20 month old infant, being bounced around from one situation to another.
The kid has nightmares now, and ATTACHMENT ISSUES!
Whoa! Yet another agency with absolute rule often with little or no evidence.
Had an acquaintance recently go thru a grueling 3 months of hell, lost her job, lost her place with the child care providers, while her and her FAMILY were dragged to court repeatedly, often with ‘witnesses’ not showing up or court cancelled for bullshit hearsay reasons.
That agency (CPS) is notorious for power tripping bureaucrats who seem to never pick on those with plenty of dough$$$, they LIVE to create meaningless paperwork so they can justify their authority over struggling single parents (mostly)…CPS is as bad or worse than psychiatry or (ahem) the absolute corrupt family court system.
Our society is just plain fucking sick. We’re all out here struggling to survive with *very little* in the way of social supports.
CPS->foster kids->drugging by psychiatry.
More pigs in the trough.
If only all mother-in-laws were like Lisa.
If only more families were as supportive as yours.
This all rings true, but it’s a messy, messy world out there with an ever growing cast of characters who are floundering in a sea of planned dysfunction by the powers that be.
Both you and Lisa had your inborn wits about you in your respective situations.
I think it is highly unlikely to find those traits in the ‘general population’ these days.
I’m dealing with a situation with a neighbor right now, and this essay gives me pause.
Thanks for reposting this article.
Loved the video, John.
Read the book and bring it up often to my annoying cosmic friends.
Will repost the link on BenzoBuddies which seems to populated by many of the discussed delusional ‘positive’ thinkers.
It’s dissing, pure and simple.
Sometimes, cat, you are worth your weight in gold:D
That was very therapeutic (HAH);
now, if only someone with integrity and in power remedy this shoddy reporting!
Thanks yet again, Sera!
When I went thru my psych rotation during nursing school, one of the things our instructor told us, right at the beginning, was her theory that most psychiatrists have ‘issues’ themselves.
Makes sense, huh?
I’ve also learned (the hard way) to avoid people in my personal life who are super interested in ‘the brain’ or psychology.
So then, the iatrogenic damage from the alterations in the GABA system would *not* be helped with vitamin B3. PAWS has nothing to do with benzos being stored in fat tissues…that *is* what you’re saying, yes?
In simplistic terms, and as I understand it, the iatrogenic damages (PAWS) is due to the down regulation of the GABA receptors in the nervous system.
Thus, Dr. Kelly’s recommendation for GABA would be useless also, since we would be unable to utilize it since our receptors have been absorbed and no longer exist.
GABA and glutamate are the ‘brakes’ and the ‘gas’ of our nervous system…we who are dealing with ID/PAWS have too much gas and not enough brake.
We would all like to find *something* that would facilitate a quicker regrowth of our GABA receptors. It would sell like hotcakes, for those of us who could afford this mythical future substance.
If the GABA receptors regrow at all! No one knows!
But hey, this only my rudimentary understanding of what is going on in my brain (and my gut and my muscles etc. etc.)
As Elsie states above, and if you ever perused the BenzoBuddies site, you would see that *overwhelmingly* most of those in the throes of PAWS (or ID) cannot tolerate most supplements. B Vitamins being first on the list. For whatever reason, they exacerbate symptoms.
There is no ‘cure’ for ID from benzos…except time, time and more time…if then.
Eating well, reducing stress as much as possible and distraction is all that is available to us at this time.
Dr. Kelly has written a great article here, but as others have previously pointed out, if you haven’t lived thru this hell, you cannot possibly understand.
Eh, I *loved* her tone.
Another great article, Sera!
Thanks, cat, for the quotes…she should be flushed out whenever possible.
Provided that you are in possession of *all* the dots.
Meanwhile, in my neighborhood, there is pending legislation to make it easier to 5150 individuals who seek help in emergency rooms.
It’s coming thick and fast now, folks. As resources dwindle, more and more of us are becoming expendable.
It’s long, but it’s spot on IMO.
Your early experiences are familiar, as well as the later ones after meeting the ‘Mental Health’ people.
I have days now where I’m confident and trust my perspectives and insights.
But my immediate environment can still warp my orbit. It’s getting better, tho.
Thanks for another thought provoking blog post, Sera. I love the way you are able to reflect upon seeming trivia, blow it up into a big picture and offer it for examination.
Hi Dr. Kelly
I just was on your site reading an article about ‘releasing the artist’ as linked on today’s front page of MiA.
It was refreshing and thought-provoking, and I liked it very much, but when I perused your site further, I felt a familiar let down and disappointment.
Specifically, it was the linking to the Amen clinics.
I have a good friend who paid thousands of dollars for a brain-scan at an Amen clinic in the SF bay area…his issue was opioid/cocaine addiction; he came out of the office with an ADHD diagnosis and a fistful of prescriptions for psych meds. and the undying belief that the brain scan proved his brain was not wired correctly.
I would love to believe all the things you propose and discuss on your website, and be able to afford all the supplements you recommend, but the red flags just won’t quit waving.
Just some feedback from a skeptic who’s been down similar roads to nowhere before.
Sending it to my skeptical, science-worshiping son.
Thanks for finding and posting it!
Thanks for posting this–a nice change of pace.
This is epic.
What happened in my own case is exactly as you describe.
Too bad I really AM disabled now, thanks to the iatrogenic damage caused by the drugs I was prescribed for my ‘chemical imbalance’.
You sound like someone in the throes of withdrawal from a psych med! From what I’ve read on support sites, and from my own personal experiences (with Effexor, too, among many others), feeling like you want to die is part of getting off the ‘medications’….I used to (still do–my brain has been straight up hijacked!!) ruminate on all my past crimes and my many faults and imperfections.
But I have hung on so far…living in poverty, just like many of us who ended up in the system. Finding joy in the small things.
Just getting thru the day is an accomplishment at times; realizing the ripples of pain I would cause if I offed myself keeps me on the planet *so far*.
The best thing I have learned from the BenzoBuddies site (despite it’s many imperfections) is the ploy of distracting yourself, in whatever way is at all appealing to you. I lose myself in stupid movies…a lot of iatrogenic victims use adult coloring books…I also find I feel better if I can be outdoors.
Please know you aren’t alone. There are thousands and thousands of us. Get thru the next minute, the next hour, the next day and you will feel differently with the passage of time. Everything changes; even our thoughts and feelings.
Checked out this guy’s site–it’s very informative, has some tools for organizing and education. Also credible information that confirms my fears about the damages done to the GABA receptors as being a permanent condition.
I can handle the loss of my intellect, and the difficulties with various physical abilities, but the confirmation that I will always have a magnified vulnerability to stress makes me want to just end it now.
There is so much I don’t do now to keep myself from being stressed out (which results in exacerbating my other symptoms, insomnia most notably). To think that the whole rest of my life will be restricted, or worse yet, when the SHTF being unable to cope is intolerable to me.
Travelling? Forget it….relocating? Not happening. Returning to school? Resisting the destruction of life as we know on this finite planet?? Uh uh…
How many of us have been essentially neutralized????
Humans are a blight on the planet. We’re in the process (like a speeding train) of wiping out ourselves, and sadly, everything else too.
I concur regarding vaccines.
DUH, but a fun little rant.
Thank you thank you meghan and *Katie*!
I tried to stay away from this as I found myself reliving traumas from the past and becoming someone I thought I had left behind in the past.
As other “benzo survivors’ have pointed out, it is difficult to debate all this and defend ourselves optimally when our brains are still dealing with the damages. It may not be personal, but it has been very difficult for me not to take it that way and to wonder, again; who does this article really serve?
Katie; I admire your tenaciousness and am grateful for your advocacy. This has been keeping me up at nights and has literally giving me nightmares. Thank goodness for those who, like yourself, are able to parse words more skillfully than I would ever be able to do.
As I was prescribed an antidepressant (*many* over the years) with a benzo combo, as were thousands upon thousands of us, this article seems relevant.
“If this is true, based on your comment above you believe we both have no right to EVER question or expound upon the ideas put forth by survivors. ”
So you are admitting that IS what you’re doing, Richard?
How can you not see the similarities of your ‘ideas’ for benzo survivors and what psychiatry does to patient’s experiences?
Admittedly, I am not the sharpest knife in the drawer, and my brain damage prevents me from processing information as I would like, but this whole discussion leaves me feeling helpless and misunderstood, and despairing of there ever being any recognition of this experience as a distinct entity with specific protocols?
How is this helpful to the thousands of us who unwittingly followed our doctor’s orders?
In my opinion, I think this is a bit of what’s going on here and why so many of us are uncomfortable with this article.
^That was in reference to BPTBA.
“This period spanned several years, all the drugs included. I was never warned or adequately informed of all the risks. At the time I was very naïve and ignorant about psych drugs. Many people simply do not know any better, like the younger me, and the myth of doctors as honest, unbiased, authoritative figures makes us even more vulnerable to the harm of their “treatment.” ” BTPDBA
So why the guilt trip?
What people need to be able to stay out of the clutches of psychiatry/medications is SUPPORT from family/community/social structures.
But we have been atomized (very deliberately) and fed a story of ‘personal’ responsibility and nonsense about mythical *bootstraps*.
When there are no tools available, and the milieu has nothing to offer a distressed or diseased (medical) individual, the institutions built to support the status quo are one’s only alternative.
Let’s build some alternatives, hey?
I think J. Doe’s analogies are right on.
My whole experience with the iatrogenic damage I have been dealing with (and *will* be dealing with for ???? how long????) would have been so much more tolerable if this ‘syndrome’ was recognized by ‘the health care’ edifice, and the proper supports offered.
My family perhaps wouldn’t have abandoned me when I couldn’t work and risked homelessness/hunger due to lack of funds.
And to seltz above;
My psychiatrist/’health’care provider assured me that I was taking ‘such a small amount’…and that I ‘didn’t have an addictive personality’, that my concerns about ‘addiction’ were not applicable (stupid me). And I never *ever* increased my dosage when the inevitable interdose withdrawal started happening (no ‘provider’ knew WTH was going on, only ‘care’ I received was more/different drugs.)
There’s something about the tone of this blog post that makes me feel invalidated, just as J. Doe points out.
This is a nightmare experience. How many die from suicide after discontinuing benzos, *even* after a ‘slow’ taper?? Why is NO ONE addressing the devastation incurred by individuals who FOLLOWED their doctor’s orders? Why did my doctor(s) not know there were severe risks involved taking these drugs? If I hadn’t had a friend with an internet connection, I would have never found BenzoBuddies and figured out what was going on with me, and would have ended up in a psych ward….When this is all conflated with ‘addiction’ it BLAMES the VICTIMS.
I am truly sorry for those who get caught up in pursuing street drugs/pharmaceuticals as a way to decrease the pain in their lives, hell, I’m addicted to *sugar*! (mostly free since the ID set in, since it jacks my nervous system up along with many many other things I can no longer tolerate) I get it!, but putting us all under your “big tent” is not helpful to our personal and professional lives.
Again, the examples J. Doe offers are totally applicable to our *unique* situation.
Yup, I’m finding this article pretty disheartening.
If things weren’t confused enough.
Lose vs Loose
loose [lOOs] adj not fastened or pre-packed; not tied up or confined; able to move freely; not tight, not firmly fixed; not close-fitting; careless, inaccurate, vague; dissolute, immoral; not closely woven; flabby; (of bowels) inclined to diarrhoea; l. box stable or van in which an animal can move about; at a l. end uncertain what to do next; unoccupied ~ loose adv in a loose way; play fast and l. behave rashly or unscupulously ~ loose n release; on the l. free from restraint; on a spree; ~ loose v/t untie, undo; release from confinement or constraint, set free; detatch; fire (gun); shoot (arrow); (eccles) absolve.
lose (p/t and p/part lost) [lOOz] v/t and i no longer have; be deprived of by accident or misfortune; mislay, fail to find; fail to get or win; be too late for; be bereaved of; waste; be defeated or beaten; suffer loss, become worse off; fail to hear, see or understand; cause or allow to perish; (of clock or watch) go too slowly; (refl) miss the right path; become absorbed in; l. one’s head become flustered, panic; l. one’s temper grow angry; l. one’s way fail to find the right path; l. out (US) be defeated after a struggle.
Spell check is making us illiterate. Use your words or lose them.
Thanks for the link, elipaul.
I recognize some of the stories from BB…
I for one would like to see you write about how you’ve been *well* for 3 1/2 years:)
No waves of symptoms? Can you handle stress? Drink caffeine? Have a glass of wine? Travel?
It feels pretty permanent to me at this point–
Thanks, J. Doe and uprising for chiming in…I still cannot believe this lack of support….
How discouraging; I woulda thought that here on MiA there could be some sort of opening for educating those who interact with benzo *victims* (I know how you hate that word, F) on a professional or personal basis, and maybe–just maybe we could get the support and services that are so desperately needed.
How many suicides from misdiagnosis?? How many families ruined, jobs lost?
It looks once again, that only those who know the horrors of the iatrogenic damage caused by *following the doctors orders* (I was told over and over by my ‘health care’ practitioner “It’s such a tiny dose!! You don’t have an addictive personality!! This combination is *working* for you!!) are able to support one another. But how do we find one another??? Not everyone who deals with PAWS/BN has access to the internet…or a ‘health care’ provider familiar with the syndrome (overwhelmingly so, thus this and J. Doe’s articles) How many of us are diagnosed with DSM categories and dismissed, compromising our health with meds and treatments that aren’t relevant or harmful?
How many people die? I know of 3 in my own community (none of them recognized, of course)…Benzos not only mess with your physical body in MANY numerous ways but they really do a number on your head…and there’s a pattern to it; as the years go by, I see the anguish of suicidal ideation, the acute loneliness, the despair…the loss of hope and the support of family and the breakup of marriages; and the all too frequent re-instatement of the benzodiazepine.
This article is about benzos–there are others here about opiates, and the combination of the two….but this article is about this one thing.
Oldhead; you don’t seem to ‘get’ it. It’s about getting the correct treatment and support, and nothing at all to do with ‘distancing’ ourselves from ‘those people’…benzos are not opiates. Opiates are a breeze to get clean from compared to the damage the brain must repair due to the downregulating of gaba receptors as a result of our ‘treatment’.
Our brains have been altered; not in the same way that opiates alter brains, or the same way that SSRIs alter brains, but in a very specific way that leaves us bereft of calming gaba and an excess of excitatory glutamate. We are in a constant state of flight or fight without the ability to calm the f*** down. We are actually brain damaged! This conversation is not *about* opiates! It’s about benzos!
Did you watch the video?
Right now my cognitive impairment is keeping me from explaining myself very well–But you don’t seem to be listening to what we are saying…which is typical and is just a glaring example of another thing that makes this experience a nightmare.
It’s hell on earth; the CIA couldn’t invent a better way to torture people.
Consider yourself blessed by your ignorance.
I think the point here is in terms of *treatment*–addicts are sent to detox (the time frame is short) where those who want to discontinue benzodiazepines should be using a long, slow taper that should ideally take months or even years. That approach is not something available to us unless we do it on our own, and most don’t even know that that’s what is needed! We are trying to change the terminology to help prevent the damages that occur from tapering too quickly, or from cold turkey discontinuation.
Who knew? Who knows? No one there to help guide us except for Heather Ashton and a few online support groups who often promulgate nonsense.
It really has nothing to do with the ‘shame’ of addiction; I empathize, truly, but it is not the issue for those of us who took a medication as directed and ended up in hell when we tried to quit–there is no help out there! What Ally and J. Doe have done is trying to change that!
(You ‘guys’ have my support, admiration and gratitude.)
Also, Ally, upon rewatching the vid…I am left with the impression that BN occurs only when the discontinuation of the benzo was done quickly…
Not always; or in my case: I did a year and a half dry cut off 0.5 mg of Klonopin….now starting my 27th month after jumping and I’m still markedly impaired.
And to bcharris, above–all supplements (with a few exceptions) jack up my symptoms, especially B vitamins. There doesn’t seem to be a shortcut thru this hellish experience…
There’s been endless debate about this on BenzoBuddies–again: YES, LANGUAGE MATTERS. Language creates culture. The culture needs to be changed to prevent more harm being piled on those *already* harmed.
Thanks, Ally, for all you are doing to expose this crime that is wreaking havoc with way too many to be at all acceptable.
The comments after this article are mind boggling.
No one is safe; nowhere to hide.
I did not see that it did anything at all. How would I have known, as I was taking 3 other meds???
Just one of the many my shrink had me on, trying to ‘find the right combination’ while not recognizing that it was the drugs that were making me *crazy*.
I didn’t have a lot of issues quitting the neurontin, but some do…funny, the shrinks never seem to be able to acknowledge the sometimes severe problems of coming off the ‘meds’…and don’t know crap about how to do it safely. It’s always your ‘mental illness’ reoccurring.
But they sure *do* know how to whip out that prescription pad-and kick you out right at 15 mins cuz the drug rep is in the hall waiting:)
At this stage in my career, I am convinced that the only ‘modern’ medicine that is truly helpful for the public is emergency medicine.
“BTW. Most physicians are loathed to prescribe Gabapentin for anything other than diabetic nerve pain or possibly restless leg syndrome.”
You should see the ‘other medications’ section on the BenzoBuddie’s site; neurontin is prescribed *all the time* off label.
My shrink prescribed it to me for my ‘bipolar’…
Handed out like candy from where I’m sitting. Not unlike benzos, ADs and opiates.
Great writing, and even better story. The most creative time of my life was when I was pregnant with my kids and the 10 years after…then came the divorce and the drugs.
Still climbing out of that hole–I have thrown/given away hundreds of dollars of art materials, despaired of ever being able to *make stuff* ever again…your blog entry is both reminiscent and inspiring.
Wow BDTba, you’ve missed your true calling!
Or maybe you’re a pro?
What a great way to start my day!
If you weren’t sure before….
Thank you, Robert Whitaker, for all that you do.
I see you meant *before* taking benzos…
B vitamins, and all supplements that I tried jacked my symptoms up significantly.
If you ever visited BenzoBuddies, you would see this is a common reaction.
If you’ve never experienced this, you’re just another armchair quarterback.
Those of us who *do* peruse the support boards sure would love to hear this…
The trouble is, there are untold numbers of us who do and who have.
It is hell on earth.
It isn’t just psychiatry, either. My local health clinic hands out benzos (and psych meds) like candy…
How many have died? How many lives ruined?
24 months off Klonopin here (and numerous other psych meds over the years) and still suffering and hugely impaired.
Somebody should be made responsible for the damages wreaked on lives/families/incomes thanks to big pharma and their enablers.
Instead, we are blamed and made to suffer alone and without support. I don’t know how many times I’ve heard the bullshit about ‘underlying condition’…
Thanks for writing up your experience, Robert. And like you, I wonder will this ever end? Are we permanently damaged?
This is almost exactly what happened to me, too!
Don’t know why I’m surprised.
Wish I could get all those near and dear to read this–gave them “Anatomy” but doubt they read it.
It’s not so easy, Frank, to be ‘free’ of the system…
GAH! I was under the impression my comment would be under oldhead’s Jan, 4 11pm posting.
Thanks, Oldhead for this. ^^^
I, of all people, was not saying that…the ‘case in point’ was only to offer proof that the left were just as bad as the right for promoting the myth that the ‘mentally ill’ are *violent*, and are quite willing to do away with civil rights in the ‘right’ instances.
Case in point:
This article from a ‘liberal’ site is chilling…
I am familiar with that flame.
It is the reason I am alive today.
Thanks for the reminder:)
That pretty much sums it up…
Good article, Jack. Thanks for putting it out there.
Great blog, Liz 🙂
Being an ‘addict’ is sorta like being a psych patient; no one takes you or your symptoms seriously, and more harm just gets piled on.
People who experience Ashton Syndrome often lose everything; no one believes what they are experiencing as being ‘real’…havoc ensues…misdiagnosis happens, more meds are piled on compounding the problems…the psychological and physical torture of PAWS is truly unimaginable for family members, friends, employers…people lose everything and have no where to turn to for support.
“Addicts” do…it’s pretty straightforward, and there are resources available.
Sorry it offends those of you who advocate for ‘addicts’ but our experience is totally different, and totally misunderstood by *everyone* who hasn’t ever had this horrible experience.
It’s very lonely.
In the almost 2 years I’ve participated on the BenzoBuddies site I have seen newcomers just about universally go thru the same stages of agony.
Suicide is often contemplated.
I’m into my 23rd month after a year and a half taper from 0.5mg Klonopin….and still hugely impaired. Maybe forever…
There are so many of us.
And yes, the language is important.
Thanks for the article.
Way to make this blog post all about Alex…way to do EXACTLY what Sera writes about above.
“You enjoy taking part in a collectives or groups portrayed as being all on equal footing, but when you do, you still feel entitled to retain control (even over objections) as the most frequently heard ‘public voice’ representing them.”
“You read this list and your immediate reaction is to get angry or defensive or to come up with a list of ways in which you’re not privileged (followed by unwillingness to work through any of that to understand why or be a part of the change).”
Sorry this has been such a trigger for me…I’ve been in MANY political groups and it always works out the same…the men are in the limelight, taking all the credit, and the little womenz are in the backround making it all possible: paying bills, emptying trash, making themselves small so they don’t accidentally trample on some man’s huge ego.
Instead this blog post has given yet another platform for the same old voices espousing their superiority and magnanimousness.
The phoniness just got to me today. Seen it all before.
The more ‘tolerant’ I am, the more my feelings and perspectives get shoved aside for those whose egos can’t share a forum.
This article is about women’s perspectives and experiences being dissed/dominated by men in political movements. It’s about power-over. Something I’ve seen you have trouble with in other blog posts. Some women are collaborators and undermine any progress women might make as a group in any endeavor.
This isn’t about the menz *at all*…which is the point I keep trying to make with Alex, but he keeps pontificating about his enlightened awareness and his simpering truths.
Tired of it.
A little humility would be a vast improvement for the many male contributors in the forum section.
Rock stars, indeed.
Thank you, Oldhead.:)
Have you ever been in a courtroom, just as one example.
Who makes the rules?
Is it women? I think not.
Women give childbirth; fraught with danger in some places (getting to be more and more dangerous in this country thanks to our shi**y health care system). Women live with ‘partners’ who kill them or threaten them with homelessness or the loss of their children calling them ‘crazy’…how many women shrinks give a ‘severe mental illness’ diagnosis to men? Not many, I’m guessing.
How many men get raped in this country? The stats say 1 out of 4 women in the US are sexually assaulted in their lifetimes.
How many poor elderly are women? And it’s not just because they live longer.
How many men are caretakers–a necessary and vital part of society—do you have any idea how LITTLE caretakers MAKE???
The porn that is so prevalent and so common…only a man could turn this around and make himself the victim of his power-over privileges. (Sexual dysfunction in real life).
All you men on here protesting this blog by Sera seem to have completely missed the point. Like a fish in water, you cannot see what you are swimming in.
Do you ever listen to yourself?
You read Sera’s article, and none of it applies to you is what you are saying. And you keep bleating “what about the menz???” and “my truth” blah blah blah.
You take up a lot of space here, Alex. And you don’t seem to see how you crowd out others.
Alex; READ THE ARTICLE.
You are making it about YOU.
It’s a wonder that anyone paying attention isn’t bats*** CRAZY.
Seems like you’re sidelining here, Alex. The article is about women’s experiences in political (the mad ‘movement’) groups.
Thanks for saying that, oldhead. I thought the same…
“Ok great! I’m glad we got that straight! What an important issue…”
Actually, it is: the fantasy that there is a technological fix (which leads to even more life threatening consequences) to the damage humans are doing to our one and only planet is pretty harmful.
It leads to denial and inaction.
And, no one has YET to figure out how to deal with the waste or how to decommission ‘old’ plants…
We humans are sooo smart and sooo in control.
Counterpunch published another good article today about gun violence and the ‘mentally ill’…http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/10/28/psychotic-shooters-on-the-open-frontier-of-profit/
Glad to see this posted on the front page–it’s a great article.
Thanks for this compilation. 😉
I skimmed the site linked above: all the shooters were “mentally ill”. Not a word about psych meds…
I thought this article examines the gun violence in this country in an intelligent and useful way, reviewing Michael Moore’s film, “Bowling for Columbine” as a guide.
Made me think about it all in a different way.
Already posted the link in the forum…but for your consideration here.
This is excellent; I find it difficult to understand how your ‘psychotic break’ is considered to be so aberrant…guess I must be CRAZY, too.
Good work escaping your confinement and living to tell the tale.
“First do no harm…”
I sure as heck did not have access to the internet 20 years ago when I first encountered psychiatry…where was I suppose to do all this research, anyways?
Not to mention how much emotional pain and turmoil I was going thru…’
Screw that ‘blame yourself’ crap.
The pharmacists I dealt with over the years gave me waaaaay more information than any of the docs…
Signed the petition, but it failed to be submitted for some reason…
Will try again later.
If the ‘good’ is only in our imaginations, then what is there to save in the field known as ‘psychiatry’?
that’s power OVER!
how nice –a benevolent and paternalistic tale about the magnanimity of those who ‘know better’ and their power of those of us without insight
This bit made me laugh:
” I preferred the assessment of a seemingly lesser stigma, the diagnosis that supplants Frighteningly Insane with Harmlessly Incapable.”
One of the best things I’ve ever read here.
Swappiing out SSRIs for benzos is a TERRIBLE idea!
Good nutrition, fish oil, supplements: they all cost money.
Some people don’t have the cash for decent food; fruits/veggies/protein is very expensive if you’re living on the margins.
The problem with this thinking is the fact that most people in distress who seek out help from the ‘medical/psychiatric’ establishment are never asked about what is going on in their lives.
It’s the sources of the trauma that need to be address.
A little justice and maybe a few resources would be a good start before the chemical lobotomy option.
Don’t know where you live, but I find this ‘theory’ to be extremely prevalent in my social/professional milieu. It is ubiquitous and tenacious, still cited in pop psychology books, and the media.
I am glad for every bit of ammunition I can get my hands on to let the air out of this tired old propaganda.
Was certainly presented to me as the explanation to my post-partum depression and the subsequent polypharmacy I was prescribed over the next 20+ years by the ‘mental health/health care’ pros, and I *believed* it until I discovered “Anatomy of an Epidemic”.
Still working on getting my brain back…it’s been a long, hard road.
Thank you Dr. Hickey for reviewing this book, another tool for disassembling the machine.
This is just despicable–the LA Time had a piece with this ‘news’ (sounded like an ad) and the comments were enough to crush whatever hope I had that progress was being made.
I know, right? I look around me at what is consider to be ‘sane’ and I think it’s anything but!
Wish we could edit our comments here: apparently when I use certain keyboard symbols to post they just don’t show up.
What I keep trying to correct is the statement that I “get” the denial…I understand why people do it. I do it too.
I get the GAH!
Know what? The whole deal with climate change has messed with my ‘mental health’ for awhile now. I look around at the ecosystem that I have lived in for 32 years now and I gotta say: something’s very very very wrong. Things are DYING. The fact that the ‘sane’ society feels that money is more important than LIFE makes my head spin…
We are living in an unprecedented times…no humans have ever had to deal with the a situation like this *ever* before…we can’t look back and read our history books anymore and say to ourselves; ah, well, this has all happened before…
We are in the midst of the 6th great extinction. I has been estimated that 200 species a day blink out–no more; gone forever…each of those endings impacts other life that was necessary for yet other life (forms). We are all connected.
So tell me again that this subject has nothing to do with humans and their so-called ‘mental health’…
Some days, the overwhelming grief affects my every thought and action. Other days I *pretend* that life is going along normally. Some days are better than others. I get the …we are going to need to learn skills on how to cope with the realities that are looming on the horizon.
Of course they did.
Iatrogenically damaged/dependent are the terms I have come to use.
You know about BenzoBuddies, right?
Someone there might be able to steer you in the right direction, either on your own or finding a doc in your area.
Informed consent, Joel Hassman, MD. I had no idea and foolishly trusted my ‘doc’ both the shrink AND the subsequent MDs…
If it’s so easy for patients to get the drug they *ask* for, why not pheonbarb? Why not cocaine? Why not heroin?
I expect ‘health care providers’ to KNOW the ins and outs of the deadly medicines they prescribe.
More good news; after 19+ months of PAWS thanks to the prescribed Klonopin (and the other psych drugs I discontinued with varying degrees of difficulty) I still am prone to dementia…I don’t even have my cognition back and now learn that perhaps, it never will return…
And yes, I think it’s important to differentiate between iatrogenic damage/dependence and ‘addiction’…thanks for that.
I dunno, capitalism is doing a pretty good job of it, too…wars, famines, extinctions. We are living through the 6th great extinction; all so we can ‘grow’ the economy and make a profit.
It takes a certain amount of careful study to see what’s been done by entities such as the IMF/World Bank the European Central Bank…
Where one gets their ‘information’ is important. Most of what passes for ‘the news’ these days is pure propaganda.
The comfortable have trouble seeing anything wrong with the big picture.
So just sit back and enjoy the show? Nothing can be done? It’s always been this way? It seems to me we are more than taking steps backwards; we are *devolving* into selfish, hyperindividual drones while the ‘aliens’ have taken over the ship!
Keep watching your big screen TV…
The lemmings are heading to the cliff while texting.
And thanks, Congress, for giving Obomber fast track authority; the corporate coup is all but complete.
There are sites that give graphs of the corps who greased the wheels (and by how much) and another on which ‘congress person’ took how much to change their initial (posing) ‘no’ vote.
To the poster above; so it’s OK for our culture to have ‘evolved’ into dog eat dog? Darwin speaks about diversity being the trait that saves species…
This is so f***** up.
I’m going to copy and paste it for an anticipated future conversation. Hope that’s OK!
It sums up perfectly the points I was trying to make yesterday with my adult son, who is very enamored with the ‘science’ of ‘mental illness’.
Thanks for your succinct review of *how it is* out there in the current ‘mental health’ system.
Great…years of protracted withdrawal only to end up in a home drooling and drugged anyway…18 + months free of Klonocide and the ride ain’t over.
Infiltrated, then crushed.
It was crushed by the state. Clearly.
Great essay, Will.
My iatrogenic brain injury kept me from being able to read and digest this until just this morning, but I agree with everything you said. It’s pretty much what I’ve been saying for months now when someone brings up the nascent anti-psychiatry movement.
Can’t get away from the big picture.
There are real investigative journalists publishing ‘real news’…one just needs to do a bit of research. The information is out there…but I wonder how long the internet will remain a viable source. The horizon is very dark…
Thanks you Richard D. Lewis.
Some hold their ideology close like a security blanket. Woe unto those that try to jerk it away…fear. Fear of change…the fear the media whips up to keep us cowed.
When I was in nursing school, the instructor for our psych rotation implied as much…
Let’s hope that the medical community will start to recognize the signs of tolerance withdrawal and wrap their minds around PAWS.
Heck, let’s hope the *do no harm* medical community quits handing out pills like candy…
Thanks for this new feature. It’s very much needed and I predict it will become a basic part of MiA…
that would be *rang*….gah…
Great rant, Nancy! Sure ran a lot of MY bells!
I, too, see the ‘problem’ of psychiatry as just one symptom in a much larger picture.
Thanks for putting my rage at what has happened to me, personally, into words:)
Have you ever lived off grid? It ain’t cheap. Where does the water come from-will you have the money to drill a well or develop a spring if you are so lucky to have on on ‘your’ land? The above link to the ‘cheap land’ most assuredly does not.
Where will your food come from? Have you ever developed a working garden before? What is the climate like where this ‘cheap’ land exists? What crops can be grown there-can they be grown year round? Where will the amendments come from? Animals require fencing-are you strong enough for the labor involved or do you have the capital to pay for the infrastructure needed?
Where is your nearest town-you are going to need gasoline, groceries, a modicum of health care…vehicles are expensive to buy and maintain…a crappy vehicle that breaks down is of no use to you ‘off the grid’…
I have lived that lifestyle. It was a pleasure, but damn hard work…and very expensive. And not many people out in the woods want to live in complete solitude without access to some sort of society.
All of that blathering about living ‘off the grid’ isn’t based on any realistic alternative, and sounds like an excuse not to fix the inequities that exist in Baltimore’s communities (or any other urban blighted under-served infrastructure collapsing city).
Something systemically is deeply wrong and moving to the woods isn’t going to change it.
It takes bucks to move. Most folks are living paycheck to paycheck. Not at all that simple.
The police protect ‘property’, and the owner of…
Great story, and unfortunately, a familiar one. You are very lucky you have and had the support of your husband. It doesn’t always work out that way…
You escaped psychiatry—good work! Thanks for sharing:)
For big bucks, I might add…($3,200)!
I had a young friend go to Dr. Amen’s clinic in the SF bay area; the ‘brain scan’ was interpreted as his having the “worst case of ADHD” the physician had *ever seen* and my friend left the office with a fist full of ‘scripts….
His reason for seeking help: addiction to cocaine and oxycontin…
And benzodiazepines are still handed out like candy…
Also does this article infer that tricyclics are BETTER at treating ‘depression’ than SSRIs?
Not everyone ‘abuses’ benzodiazepines…legions of us take them as prescribed and then experience *HELL ON EARTH* when we try to quit.
It’s not for the fainthearted…
I think some good old fashioned self-reflection would help here:
“The other thing that is holding us back, and is very related, is the incredible nastiness we express to one another in the psych survivors movement.”
And; we are all doing the best we can with the resources available to us. Some kindness and humility would go a long way. When I, personally, feel someone is trying to throw their weight around, I run for cover. It feels too familiar.
You are not alone, I’ve been trying to live this way for my entire life. It sure doesn’t make me a ‘success’ in the conventional understanding of the term, but money and prestige aren’t serving life on the planet from where I’m sitting.
This hit the spot for me; this is what I have needed all these years instead of drugs, labels and med checks.
“It’s almost like saying that once the trauma has impacted, TWO new lives have to begin:
1. care & treatment 2. an entirely new life
Care and treatment should NOT be the person’s only lifestyle and orientation.
If the person always wanted to learn to play the guitar, learn how to speak french, had a dream of becoming a veterinarian … If they have a natural skill, gift, talent or ability …
Incorporating those things *immediately* into the care & treatment plan will allow them to make a connection that will help to “unsolidify” being condemned into the trauma and near-endless treatment of it.” mjk
I hope you are well, mjk. Your input on this site is sorely missed.
Government money or no, I wish there were more places like this. The need is huge.
That’s evident from the way the government funds services for children and families.
I just ran across this in an article published on CounterPunch by Ben Denby
The production of deviance is based on the fact that deviance itself is a completely subjective concept, and as such is a matter entirely of how those with the power to enforce their own interpretation of the word on common usage choose to define it. It typically has very little or nothing whatsoever to do with the appearance, thinking or behavior of those so labeled. The process of producing deviance is notable for the fact that the interpretations of deviance that are chosen and imposed on common usage are generally self-serving for those creating them; in effect, they create a problem or threat for which the creator becomes both cause and cure. For this reason, the production of deviance is as much a matter of reasserting the authority of the definer of the term in the face of crisis and shifting the blame for the crisis away from them onto a physically or numerically weaker scapegoat who can then be silenced through whatever means are considered appropriate. The value of this process to a power structure facing ever more acute threats to its own existence by virtue of the finite nature of the substance upon which its existence depends is obvious.
I believe that the world is big enough to contain “all” of us; I believe in the basic goodness born within the individual.
I believe that evil only manifests itself when the organism is violated in some way.
But then, I’ve always been an incurable idealist.
And I’ve pretty much had it with “society”.
What I actually meant to say is that I wouldn’t want to be what what is considered ‘normal’ in this society.
From where I’m sitting, those that are considered ‘normal’ are killing the planet and value money over life itself.
I dunno, but that sounds pretty sick to me…
That was directed to theloniusmonk…
I wouldn’t in a million years be what is considered ‘normal’ in this society.
What is ‘normal’ and who defines it?
I’m responding to Tina M’s comment at 12:40 waaaay above (so frustrating to have a ‘discussion’ with this current set up with the inability to reply to the intended post)…
” There is a persistent strain within capitalism itself of people rejecting the ordinary ways to make money, but often as it seems to be in Alex’s narrative it becomes a personal bootstraps story, if I can do it so can you. This is a narrative entirely within the capitalist/individualist framework. ”
Some of us have many more resources (money, family, community, friends, housing, etc etc) than others. What I read on here in the comments section many times I find to be discouraging and shaming rather than ‘meeting’ me where I’m at.
I don’t have money to hire a lawyer to make sure I get re-trained according to my rights as a person deemed ‘disabled’…bully for you, but tired tired tired of the bootstraps shaming crap.
“If I can do it…” Please stop.
When I had my psych rotation in nursing school, the underlying understanding about psychiatrists was that they were ‘crazy-er’ than the patients. Promolgated by our instructor, btw.
I have a very similar story; the 2 kids and no sleep for years in particular.
I have not healed the relationships. Pretty much on my own now but drug free and a handful of really good friends.
We ought to start a club.
I posted below without knowing you had replied, Melissa.
Yup-words need to be precise. Words create culture.
I agree with this; on the BenzoBuddies board these two terms (addiction vs dependence) have inspired a few threads that upset me with folks taking positions on both sides.
I never felt a compulsion to take Klonopin. I took it as ordered. I never in 10 years increased my dosage, even tho I experienced obvious (to me now, but never to the health care provider) tolerance withdrawal. I don’t miss it—but after 15 months of PAWS my brain sure does. Still. I am still majorly impaired. My brain is damaged and I don’t know if I will ever get myself back again.
Living in a very rural area with little support and meager finances I tried going to NA meetings but it just never felt right. I am NOT an addict. I may have problems with drugs but I was only following (stupidly) doctor’s orders…there’s no craving, there’s no drug-seeking. While I found the folks who attend these meetings to be warm and welcoming, the ‘program’ rubbed me the wrong way.
I wish there was a way to explain to my family and friends what has happened to me (and so many others) in a way where the immediate image of our characters and sanity wasn’t in question. Going thru this alone is beyond difficult.
Context seems to be something only the rich can afford.
The comments after this article are depressing…(hah!)
Amen, DebraLynn—me, too and how many others?
It’s called population control. The ‘useless eaters’ must go, and what better way than to have them do it themselves?
Hilarious! (as I cruise the internet not sleeping from the withdrawal from pharmaceuticals…)
Happy Birthday, Monica and congratulation. What you do online is more helpful than you can know for those of us who have been caught up in the ‘system’.
Hey-no problemo; our new Koch congress has SSDI slated for a 20% decrease in 2016…what coreyjwiley states above is true; I anticipate a surge in homelessness/suicide. That’ll fix our economic/social problems!
While your story is amazing and inspiring, I am sad to read about the continued sleep issues and susceptibility to stress.
13 months off Klonopin and polydrugged for 14+ years…
Wait-did I write this?? (joke)…I am in my 13th month off Klonopin; I have come to the same conclusions. While I do have a camera on my cell phone, I have yet to be successful sending a photo (cognitive deficit? A bit!) I have picked up my old Canon AE1, found a battery and film for it and have been taking it with me when I feel well enough to go out for one of my walks…
On good days, I can feel my creativity bubbling just under the surface-haven’t had the money to develop any film yet (also using an old Yashica 120 format and a funky plastic lens 120 Chinese camera) but have been reacquainting myself with film and processes as my brain damage allows.
It keeps my mind occupied and helps prevent the constant looping psychological horrors that have characterized this process thus far.
Thanks for this piece, Sascha-more people need to made aware of this ‘history’ and connect the dots. As the old saying goes, ‘the personal is political…’
The book ‘The Spirit Catches You and You Fall Down’ was a great read, one that many in the ‘helping professions’ could learn a boatload from. I’m happy to hear options like that are still available to the Hmong in Merced.
I cannot tell you how timely your linked essay is to me-all my thoughts and feelings, the despair, the fear-the frustration with the minions who are propagandized and cannot see what’s happening all around us…I have felt this way for years…like being a passenger in a car without brakes. I’m so scared.
Fine by me, selves; I was an RN…and it made my heart sick at the suffering and barbarism that is considered to be the state of the art in care in these modern times. And I’ve seen plenty of abuse in the medical field. As far as I’m concerned, the only good medicine does these days is for emergencies.
Right now I’m a professional sick person recovering from the iatrogenic damage caused by ‘modern medicine’…and it’s hell on earth.
Beautiful, Meaghan! Love the images your words evoke. The shattered vase and mosaic/glue seems almost written for me…good luck in your new environment. I, too, have fantasys of finding community *somewhere*…it certainly isn’t here.
I find the article totally relevant to the issues this website covers-stop trying to censor conversation about the elephant in the room!
If you don’t like the subject being discussed, don’t read it!
This is so timely for me (and yet not timely enough for life on this planet)…for the last two days I have been overwhelmed with the knowledge that the arctic ice is melting away faster than ‘predicted’-there are warnings about methane bombs and the dire consequences that follow…it’s like sci-fi but we’re living thru it.
The grief I feel, and have been feeling for the last few years, for not only myself and my children, and for the loss of the life-forms around me is overwhelming! My thoughts run to the starvation that surely is coming…drought in California has already sent food prices through the roof-those of us on the bottom-worldwide-are looking at slow, ugly deaths. Unless we are lucky enough to see our government provoke a nuclear holocaust in their march toward total dominion…
How can we support ourselves and others as we spiral into extinction? How can anyone who sees what’s happening around them possibly remain ‘sane’?
What can one person who is so compromised economically and physically possibly do? I keep asking for them to send the black pill-why can’t the powers that be just be kind enough to do that one small thing?
Yup, happened to me. It’s real-it’s happening. Your rose colored glasses are essentially blinding you, selves. Keep plugging your fingers in your ears and hum “lah lah lah” louder while the rest of us deal with the trauma caused by those in your ‘profession’.
I am around a lot of elderly and their underpaid caregivers…families/communities have fractured into small pieces where only the ‘strong’ survive. The care the elders receive is abominable-how can a physician learn of an elder’s beliefs, preference and wishes in a 15 minute appointment? Palliative care seems to only apply to the actively dying; old folks, like children, are not valued in this culture for the reasons stated so well by Richard and others…
One little quibble: “difficult choices people make as they loose”…did you mean ‘lose’? I see this all the time now; spellcheck or ? Language is culture IMO.
Great piece, Matt. Thank you.
Perhaps we should rid society of those (the psychiatrists) who go outside the law (via psychiatric social control) to destroy the decent, for the criminals? And go back to belief in the concept “all people are created equal and have certain inalienable rights.”
yeah, if you’re a whie male and own property.
They noted that other research on disasters has described “some beneficial effects of disasters for mental health through mechanisms such as increased community cohesiveness and support for those who are vulnerable.”
Hey, boans…the gratification in both cases is the ‘power-over’ dynamic…well, maybe not always in the case of needle rape, but I’m sure they have some satisfaction that their will was accomplished.
Sexual rape isn’t about sex/gratification, it’s about power.
Yup; where to start???
Trying to heal with few resources-it’s overwhelming!
Isn’t the bigger problem the 1%?
Just rediscovered this article, which I think expresses the frustrations whoopsie verbalizes.
I long for this, too.
Think they’re working on the ‘superfluous’ population with psych meds, too. The mental torture I and many others have endured (from benzodiazapines in my current experience) seems like straight up torture to me…never have I had the urge to kill myself get so specific and insistent.
Hi out there
I dry tapered my 0.5 mg dose of Klonocide over the course of a year and a half thinking that would prevent any issues from coming off the drug after taking it for over 10 years. WRONG.
Still steering thru the hell on earth that is Protracted Benzodiazapine Withdrawal Syndrome at 11 months off-Jan. 1 will be a year since I took my last bit of dust.
It seems to me that those who do experience PAWS have had some sort of history of psych meds, or alcohol abuse or starting and stopping benzos or psych meds over a period of time…the phenomenon referred to as ‘kindling’…not everyone experiences difficulties. I’ve read it’s only around 15% of people who quit deal with any of the litany of symptoms; insomnia, akasthisia, anxiety, depersonalization, derealization, weakness, nausea, tinnitus, ruminating thoughts, suicidal ideation, cognitive impairment, sensory sensitivites, etc etc etc
We are all different when it comes to the aftermath of coming off these drugs-and there really isn’t a whole lot of support for those who do have issues…I feel my own lack of support (I’ve lost everything) has made this journey more hellish than it otherwise would have been, but maybe not. The not knowing how long it will go on is one of the more difficult aspects to grapple with…
The many reports of contiued sensitivity to stress also makes me discouraged; life is stressful, especially so when living in poverty and unable to see a way out with the walls closing in all around me.
This is so disheartening. I’m just about ready to riot in the streets…! Psychiatry has taken everything from me-I have nothing to lose…
Like rounding up the Jews, you mean?
Yes. This ^^^^.
I don’t think it’s insanity at all to link it to climate change; maybe you just aren’t able to see the big picture? It’s called capitalism, and it’s eating us and everything on the planet alive for a buck. More, bigger, use up all the resouces to sate artifically implanted ‘needs’-a lot like a cancerous growth.
If Adam Lanza did not partake of Mental Health services as the NYT states, then who is Dr. Fox, the psychiatrist he saw for treatment?
Like the NYT is a credible source…
This is a great essay; I wish I could ‘make’ certain people read it…thank you for posting.
Great article-love your humor…glad you are diassembling the edifice in a way that’s understandable to the average joe. Thank you and carry on!
Meaghan-good for you that you hung on to that little itty-bitty kernal of self that knew you were good, that knew you had worth, that knew what you were surrounded with was injustice and lies.
Congratulations on winning at all sorts of different levels.
Nope-how can we possibly say, ‘OK, some psychiatry’ when all they really are practicing in not ‘medicine’ but ‘witch-doctor-y’???
And how would it be different with the ‘right’ name, Corrina. I think who gets air time is just like any political issue-who has the money (voice) and who doesn’t. THAT’s the problem.
I remember telling a friend after a stay in county ‘supportive housing’ that the Mental Health dept. was making me crazy!
To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize
It matters when we see a doctor, it matters when we move about society, it f***ing MATTERS.
B-here is a comment by one of the moderators on BenzoBuddies;
After personally experiencing the aftermath of chemical dependence on benzodiazepines I’m not sure why anyone would think that it is not important to differentiate between a physical condition and a psychological one. Every time someone perpetuates the idea that these two conditions are one and the same they are perpetuating the problem.
It IS important to distinguish the difference between the two! Unless you’ve lived it, you can’t go around expounding your ‘viewpoint’!
No, I don’t agree…I don’t *crave* the drug AT ALL! I never did! I jsut took the tiny amount I was prescribed like a good patient for years without ever updosing. I recognize now the many problems I had during those years as tolerance withdrawal, but you still expound a bunch of stuff that you don’t know anything about…there is a huge difference in the definition of addiction vs dependency!
I’ve tried getting support at NA meetings, but found it to be a poor ‘fit’ since I never participated in ‘drug seeking’ behavior (didn’t have to, my health care practioner just renewed my ‘scripts routinely), I never CRAVED the drug…and while it did, ultimately, ruin my life, my biggest mistake was not having access to the information to make an informed decision.
It’s waaay more than ‘psychological’ addiction; they create a PHYSICAL dependence by changing the way the GABA receptors in the brain operate…your whole post here is full of faulty assumptions, and I’m too BRAIN DAMAGED to refute them right now.
Great, just great. Dealing with PAWS from 10 years on Klonopin, with no end in sight after 11 months of HELL ON EARTH and I get to look forward to Alzheimer’s at the end of it. At 58 years of age, there really isn’t any point to this.
I, for one, appreciate the fact that I feel ‘heard’ here on MIA…because I sure don’t anywhere else out there in the wide world.
not to mention the distraction of the inmates who are psychiatrized..he goes on and on about them and yet how many millions of americans are caught up in DSM labels and their ‘treatments’?
Thanks. Michael; your ‘tone’ is perfect-love it. Helps to keep our sense of humor when dealing with such depressing subject matter;)
Maybe she wants to be the person she was before she was traumatized, diagnosed, then discarded.
I just re-discovered these comments; worth printing and handing out…I am a member of BenzoBuddies and it’s frightening how many people suffering from PAWS want to take another pill to mitigate the very real torture we are going thru-with no end in sight!
Seroquel is mentioned, often…I try to educate but am often met with hostility and disbelief. I used to be an RN, and even back then, before I was declared ‘crazy’ I would get frustrated by patients not taking any responsibilty for their own health, and just wanted the doctor to ‘fix’ them. They are still, unfortunately viewed as GODs.
This is almost exactly my story, mjk…you haven’t posted for a long time-I hope you are alive and well. Please let us know in the forums if you’re alright-I’d like to start a ‘club’ where women who lost children thru the courts to their abusers can at the very least support one another if not figure out how to get some sort of ‘justice’. My kids prefer to think me ‘crazy’ rather than have to acknowledge that their lives from 8 and 9 years of age until now is based on a lies and distortion.
That should have read *your* passion.
It seems to me that the more populated our finite planet becomes, the more of use become ‘throw away’-and if someone can make a buck doing it-WELL>>>
Wow Madmom-your post is inspiring! Thank you for passion!
Sorry-the level of dysfuntion in the family is terribly triggering-I’m sorry for all parties involved.
Not seeing what you all are seeing in this piece.
It’s the 6th great extinction-happening right now, in your neighborhood. Do humans have a death wish? Sure seems that way…
Thanks for this, Sharon-while the subject of class has been broached, no one has dared speak about patriarchy-and how our culture is drenched in it.
one crazy bitch
It’s so hard to believe-I can’t believe this is happening…how to change the dream?
Thanks for this; in the throes of withdrawal from Klonopin myself and most days everything dark and futile…this article and comments give me some hope for the future personally and planetarily (is that even a word?-pffft who cares…)
I’m so so sorry, putteshoe-how many are lost? Pretty sure I would not be here if not for the internet and the support I’ve found online.
How sad it that…it is truly hell on earth. No one who hasn’t experienced it can fathom it.
If I live thru this, if I make it to the other side, I’m going to make a lot of noise.
Thank you for this; me, too…9 1/2 months out from my last little itty bit of Klonopin. Who knew?
I can’t help but think, here in the middle of month 9 since I quit the ‘itty bitty’ dose of Klonopin, how this withdrawal syndrome (see BenzoBuddies) seems to be an experience straight from Abu Ghraib or Guantanamo-Dr. Mengle, anyone?
My kids were taken with with an ex parte hearing.
I meant 3-my fingers….!
The 2 theraputic questions
What happened to you?
How has what happened to you affect you now?
What do you need to heal from what happened to you?
I used to be an RN-I made mistakes…the number of patients we were assigned, the amount of paperwork we were required to do…the lack of ‘time’ to learn about new treatments/drugs we were suppose to administer…
I am no longer a nurse. I would go home every single night with my heart pounding-the dangerous situations I had to juggle was more than I could take…some people thrive on this kind of stress…good for them,
The administration makes these decisions based on acuity (numbers assigned to various textbook ‘conditons’) but fails to account for the different on the ground conditions on the ward…always trying to squeeze a buck out of a situation, and not really interested in the wellbeing of ‘the consumers’.
I have had my life saved twice now by emergency medicine…I now believe it to be the only useful kind.
Viva la revolucion-thank you…I love this site…
This is beautiful and so sad-your daughter is lucky to have your heart and support. I wish you the best of everything.
Mine as well…
That comment was suppose to be directed to Ted’s at 2:37am on the 14th.
Sums it up in a nutshell.
I’ve been polydrugged and have a diagnosis because of this; I’m off the last drug and suffering from severe protracted withdrawal now which is why I whined yesterday after being triggered by this article.
Klonopin-the drug that keeps on giving. BTW, obsessing about the past is part of this horrible process-that and feelings of wanting to just die to escape the mental pain.
I am fortunate to have access right now to the internet; found BenzoBuddies in time to learn there are thousands of us going thru this. Klonocide is particularly evil for the mental crap. Sorry for whining.
Does losing your kids and home in an ugly divorce count? Sometimes I do wish they had just died so I could grieve properly and move on…
Thanks Monica for blogging about this both here and on your site…timely that this should be posted today.
I am 8 1/2 months out from the last little itty-bit of a 0.5 mg Klonopin. Same dose for over 10 years…the docs said ‘O-it’s such a small amount…and you don’t have an addictive personality…you need to sleep, don’t you?’ Except now I recognise the tolerance withdrawal I sought help with twice before encountering “Anatomy of an Epidemic”. After reading that, I got off the remaining meds (got diagnosed as ‘bipolar’ after losing my children, home, career blah blah in an abusive divorce) titrating slowly over a year and a half. Little did I know what I would face! Klonopin-Klonocide is kicking my ass-I’m lucky in that the physical symptoms aren’t nearly as bad as some experience, but it’s the insomnia and the obsessive, dark thoughts-the feelings of utter isolation and abandonment. I wonder how many people kill themselves when trying to get clear from these drugs?
I want to help educate others about these drugs but am so busy trying to keep myself together-trying to hang on for just one more day…and having a diagnosis pretty much dismisses me as being credible even if I was to write letters to the editor-small town, my history is known.
Will my life ever be worth living? It helps, I guess, to know I’m not the only one…
This is a great discussion-thanks for the above, Frank. There it is, in just a paragraph or two. I too would love to see some kind of collective form around these issues-something tangible I could plug into. I will help in whatever way I can.
Thanks, John, for this; yes-exactly…
Wow-I just stumbled upon this discussion; this has been a big issue for me for many many years. We do have much in common with the Palestinian people-it is history repeating itself over and over. Look at the Native American population, see any similarities?
I have been haunting the forum hoping for discussions such as these. Seems like we could use that space better, imho.
Valium and Xanax are also benzodiazapines.
I was able to access acupunture during the terrifying acute phase of my withdrawal from Klonocide-the treatments took away the the terrible shaking/akathesia and helped to finally get a bit of sleep. It kind of plateau-ed out after 2 months, tho-wasn’t seeing any improvements so I don’t go anymore. The practioner was kind enough to treat me under a ‘scholarship’ program because I cannot afford $75/hour.
And you’re right, elocin, about the supplements-I have been desparate enought to try something called ‘lactium’ (hey, if you haven’t slept in weeks-you will try almost anything) but it was a waste of money. I do take Vit C, magnesium, zinc & iodium (I’m hypothyroid). B vitamins rev me up-I stay away from those.
I am also seeing a homeopathist-and I had a month long ‘window’ in July…she is sliding scale, which I much appreciate, and also an old friend. There are no side-effects to homeopathy…and yah, it might be hooey, but pfffft…first do no harm.
Benzo withdrawal is the worst.
That’s what scares the sh** out of me-and as someone with a diagnosis, my views on the subject are sluffed off as the rantings of a ‘crazy’ person.
Why would anyone willingly use Google? Or use an email service/smart phone knowing what we know?
What was that saying? “Those who surrender freedom for security deserve neither…” paraphrasing Ben Franklin here.
And the alternatives often involve large amounts of money.
I was able to watch a few of these yesterday; thank, boans for bringing it to my attention. Very well done-and I felt inspired! What struck me most is how close the dianosed/undiagnosed really are. It just seems to be a matter of luck.
The media has a capitolist bias…
Thanks for this article.
Where are these strenght based programs? I would love to find a community of mutual support where I could find access to jobs, housing and social capital…I just read about and saw the short video mentioned in the forum section about the formation of the Mental Patients Association in Vancouver, BC back in the ’70s…
It doesn’t seem possible nowdays; money is so scarce for social programs…people are so atomized and hurried trying to keep the rent paid and food on the table…I would love to have a center like the one mentioned available to me. I would love to have a space to do creative projects and JUST HANG OUT. But this seems like idealistic dreams of a past time…how can anything like this be possible now?
Thanks for calling ’em as you see ’em…Will Hall is one of my favorites.
If I had money when I went thru my personal trauma, I would not be in the position I am now. Fact.
Hi Laura-I don’t know if it’s just my computer or not, but I cannot get the article to come up correctly-there have been other links from this site that manifest in the same way. My connection is good, plenty of band-width but I get the first paragraph and then what looks like bar codes stretching down the page. Most frustrating.
Would love to explore this particular subject more. A friend said to me not long ago that the only reason I expect things to be ‘fair’ in life is because I’m a white American. And I said, ‘brought up on Disney…’
Good for you and right on.
I feel permanently neutralized by my diagnosis…if I did ‘organize’ and ‘protest’ in a public venue I run the risk of arrest/forced medication! Have you any thoughts about this double bind? No one believes anything I say due to this stupid, arbitrary diagnosis-as long I am labelled, the abuse I’ve endured is normalized. The patriarchy has got me stifled. I can only have conversations with individuals to try to educate and change the way psychiatry is viewed. I have a chance when it’s one on one.
Bets on the outcome?
Great article. It is spot on, imo. Thanks-glad to know you’re out there and can’t wait for part 3.
I don’t live at all in suburbia-I live in a small town in a sparsely populated county. The small town serves the very rural area surrounding it.
No one waters their lawn here; we can’t afford it. Most of us realize the river can only provide so much. I can’t set up a rain barrel here in my apt. complex (over 80 years old made from old growth redwood)-kinda funky and the logistics and the financial resources just aren’t there. You have no idea who you are talking to CC-you have no idea what my life is like. Back off.
If there is a government, I think it’s sole purpose should be to finance things that individuals cannot. Roads, postal service, you know-infrastructure. We can’t go back to tribal life as much as I would love that.
When I lived in the woods, and had land I did have my own water system-no utilities and no telephone. But unfortunatly, I didn’t get any of that in the divorce.
I don’t know I can articulate this with my benzo brain, CC, but in my town, we’re upgrading the water system. Whadda know, they’ve run into cost overruns. You know who pays for all this, the necessesary upgrading of crumbling infrastructure? The rate payer. The ratepayer in my town mostly consists of little old ladies and the folks who work in town at the local shops.
In my mind, this is what government is for; to foot the bill for the greater public good. After all-water is life. Government need to quit spending 76% of the budget on imperialist adventures overseas. The military is the largest consumer of fossil fuels. It’s just another aspect of our sick modern society.
The best predictor for a successful suicide is a previous attempt. And more women attempt sucide by a factor of 3. As heard on Madness Radio interview with David Webb.
Not to mention all the children who are prescribed drugs and have absolutely no power or control.
Poor people don’t have access to the internet, Francesca.
Thank you Steve!
The 3 theraputic questions:
How will what happened to you affect you now?
What do you need to heal?
Seems like the dog story was on the right track…
I also had a bad reaction from Jonathan’s comment. I see lots of dialogue here, a lot of things that apparently, need to be said. The ‘othering’ happens as soon as we get a psych diagnosis, in my opinion.
This brought tears to my eyes; I was separted from my children in an abusive divorce. They are young adults now and don’t seem to have suffered…my youngest told me (over the phone-I’ve probably spent less than 30 days with them in 14 years) when he left the area to go to college that he would miss his sister, his half brother his dog, but not me because he had already gotten over missing me.
Wish I could say the same.
I want to help with this cause so badly…and I will…and I do…but I’m still in acute withdrawal from the last psych med: Konopin.
Imagine: when I finally got up the courage to leave my charming, manipulative husband, I had only tried to get counselling: but that made me crazy in the judge’s eyes.
How long do we wait for our ‘Martin Luther King’?
I love her^^^thank you Donna.
Just ran into this article. I was given BOTH ADs (switched up many many times to find the ‘right combination’ and Klonopin )lowest dose possible (it’s such a small dose, don’t worry-you don’t have an addictive personality…) and I’m here to tell you that K withdrawal is hell on earth, and I DO wonder how many who try to quit kill themselves…because that is how I have been feeling when the wave hits and I must ride out wanting to die for days/weeks on end…and hell no, I can’t afford ‘therapy’. Help lines? Hah what a joke they are.
These drugs have ruined my life. I have absolutly nothing to look forward to. But benzos, by far, are the worst, and they are still being handed out like candy.
Sorry those of you who want to ‘dialogue’ but I’m with Daniel here.
I’ve been involved in a few political groups, and I’ve found that those who ‘dialogue’ with the other side soon BECOME the other side.
Rightgeous anger is the only way any sort of change is going to be made-I’m not advocating violence, I’m saying our anger can be channeled into action and change.
It would be some sort of miracle.
Amen. This ^^^
Yup, that ^-my ‘hostility’ chinched my bipolar diagnosis, and got me the SSI lucky me.
And I’m still pissed off.
The comments after the article are going to keep me awake tonight. Scary.
Wow Just Wow
Just stumbled onto this post…yes, very old…but Donna, I don’t know if you’re still out there-you’ve described my life! I’ve lost EVERYTHING my abusers carry on like normal, OK people! To the T you describe what happened to me!!!
I’m in the midst of Klonopin withdrawal…I’ve been on LOTs of psych meds since my abusive divorce…K is the last to go! Brain damage, insomnia, suicidal ideation blah blah blah…this is so sinister.
I wnnt to help somehow but am so damaged I don’t know if it will ever be possible. I want to educate but no one wants to hear it-the ‘chemical imbalance’ theory is alive and well in No. Cal.
I love this site-I wish there was a way we could connect and organize thru it…
And mjk-haven’t seen you post for a long time; are you still out there?
Peace and healing to us all.
This is timely.
I’m crying my eyes out in the midst of Klonopin withdrawal because I cannot relate to anyone on the BenzoBuddie boards. They all have houses, cars, families-microwaves even. I’m recieving disability after being diagnosed ‘bipolar’ after an abusive divorce where I lost EVERYTHING-my home, my kids, my business, my profession…I have not recovered from all that loss and the message I continue to get is I’m suppose to slap myself around and ‘get over it’. I cannot feel close to anyone. I cannot relate to people who take vacations and watch DVDs via their ‘entertainment’ centers.
I am utterly absolutly on my own and this withdrawal just points out how useless it all is. I can’t sleep, I can’t be around people without freaking out I’ve lost empathy for myself and others. I want to die.
I wish the 1% would send me the black pill cuz I ain’t doin’ a thing for them.
If only I’d had some help getting away from my abusive husband-if only my family hadn’t abandoned me..if only life wasn’t just about money.
Thanks for this, Bruce. I’ve been on my own personal campaign to get the word out about this bogus theory but encountering a huge amount of resistance. It’s strange to me how many of my acquaintances resist this information. Adamantly resist, get pissed off at me for even linking to pharma profits. Curious and scary.
I’ve got to quit reading this stuff when I’m in withdrawal; I either want to die or leave the country-O yeah, that takes $$$
Thank you *all* for being here-I don’t feel so much like the lone ranger. I relate to every single one of these posts, it is so helpful while battling the acute withdrawal I now find myself in.
A little late for this comment, but I am feeling so powerfully validated, and recognized, and Thankful for finding Anatomy of an Epidemic (I read a review in the NYRB and began my efforts to get off the meds…) and this site. The messed up context of our lives and the injustices…how could we not be ‘crazy’? I am inspired and wish I could help somehow, someday. Thank you Robert. You’ve changed my life.
Damn this discussion is GOOD. I was feeling like I just wanted to check out when I (again) couldn’t sleep, and you people here, and you, Alex, and you, AgniYogi, have mirrored my own thoughts and beliefs…I am considered a freak because I’ve never chased the dollar, I live simply and I am ridiculed! It’s so nice to know there are more of us out there, truly. Blessings to all of us.
Alix-Thank you so much for this…I live in a small town in NoCal and wish I knew you, as I am going thru much of what you have described here. I am in severe withdrawal from 10 years of Klonocide (Klonopin) and it’s 1 am and BenzoBuddies doesn’t get this deep.
Thank you for your responses here, thank you, Leah for this article, and thank you thank you to Mad in America.
I don’t have an internet connection, but will answer that now: I acutally dry-tapered for 1 1/2 years…I had no idea post taper I would experience all this additional crap.
Yeah! I’m at the beginning of what I’ve come to understand is acute withdrawal from Klonopin. 10 years on Klonopin, ‘it’s such a tiny dose…’ I am suffering like I never have. My family has already written me off…my friends, my profession. All because of an abusive divorce. Yes, I have a mental health diagnosis…and what I read on here scares the crap out of me…Robert Whitaker’s book made me aware of my true situation. I am not crazy, I have withstood a lot of trauma in my life. I will get better, I hope…thank you for this essay/letter. I, too, am angry. I recommend the BenzoBuddy site for others who are breaking the chains of psych meds.
Why is no one freaking out about this?