Saturday, January 19, 2019

Comments by CatNight

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  • What is going on with Facebook and it’s targeting? It seems as if it’s one hand has no idea what the other hand is doing.
    Before Facebook engaged as an internet community it should have looked into ethical and psychological issues that would be possibly harmful. The Hippocratic Oath of First Do No Harm is relevant here.
    This is certainly bordering on a problem that was created through a new technology that NO ONE was prepared for and it seems no type of oversight in any way , shape or form.

  • Actually the term used to be gomer and go mere for get out of my ER. This is an issue for the entire medical system though I am not sure about how urgent care units have changed the use of ER.
    This is a really sticky wicket and so very much messed up.
    If folks are in crisis or feel they are in crisis or family members feel the identified patient is in crisis other than hotlines which may produce a police visit which will in turn trigger trauma there are few options because all MH private practitioners and CMHC have go to your ER.
    And crisis does not come in convent times usually it is the evening of a holiday / the day after a Saturday funeral ect ect ect.
    Not one therapist o shrink was able to elucidate a plan for hard times. One mentioned breathing – well how and why EDMR was created by walking in nature with tree leaves. So the breathing therapist also said walk in nature but no good explanation of how and why.
    One can do this on one’s own. Have a set of daily weekly rituals that help. Have things to do during hard times. Create your own design and do not rely on the system unless you have the luck to have a professional worth their Wright in gold.
    A 24/7 trsuma center for ALL citizens makes perfect sense to me.
    Police, mothers, docs, nurses, teachers, retail workers, call center workers, clergy- we all need a place to go with non pharmacy tools.
    Now with the world as it is- it makes sense probably too much sense for it ever to become a reality. But one can hold out hope.

  • Yes. Abriana most people with addictions or mostly anyone in the system do not and should not conform to a DSM dx. This is an insurance driven mechanism like IEP dx that solely bring in money for the institution.
    I as others have been in patient settings and yes you are on target for that.
    I think you saw what I saw folks from the underworld hanging out passing time awhile far removed from those that want payback.
    When I was a volunteer at a woman’s n’s shelter in DC – two blocks from the White House near what we use to call needle park I saw drug deals going down with pregnant prostitutes. Hard to ever know what was what but it stunk to high heaven.
    I would observe the units would get really crowded on weekends. My guess is the psych residents in the ER came from such privileged backgrounds were so unaware of the underground life they had no idea they were being scammed.
    By Monday most of the “ guys – some females” were gone.
    I having worked with offenders knew but under massive medication and REELING from trauma couldn’t put it into words and so gain who would believe me?
    I also ran into folks who had two different personas in two different systems. My guess they could have been NARCS. And yes I know about NARCS and the good and sometimes bad folks they envelope in their webs of investigation. And I am not even going to go into other agencies and groups that would find these floors FOR THEM safe havens.
    So this what you might have seen and I would guess corporate might have had arrangements.
    There were true creeps in some of the units and some other weird stuff that NEVER FIT into any experience I had working in a psych unit pre 9/11.
    But who knows? And again I am now “ officially crazy” so my word means nothing and will never mean anything.
    And the so called “ help” in terms of talk not help at all, at all. I was robbed of a life and profession and most importantly I was my children were ROBBED of a normal life.
    Never fall into the dx trap. It is only a snapshot and useful for using something. I prefer trauma or other terms that are less stigmatizing and harmful.
    Research more- and keep away from the system. The doc seems okay and there are good ones but if he or she didn’t ask about your experience or confirm that there was stuff going down then go on your own. Until the totality of all of this comes out just be aware. And yes this does sound crazy but check out 60 minutes and the mafia don that hid out in a psych unit when needed. It does happen.

  • Cat, I am very interested in your comment about the Adderal high.
    When Ireturned to school I got a script from my GP. A relative had used it and it seemed to help andI did fit the categories.
    This is when the MH system got a hold of me. And now looking back probably was addicted. It was the beginning of the Cascade.
    So my question is should I do a2/ step program? I am off all drugs but still have things to work on.
    I know 12 step more from an Slanon CODA and my big qualm is this was given to me by a doc and have harrowing experiences I am off all of it. This is 13 years or so in the past. I try to do the steps any way- seems like there needs to be something for those that got addicted not by need but by the system.

  • This, I would put in the file labeled things your grandma could have told you or any other wise elder type of folk.
    Any type of any artistic engagement is always going to be a good thing no matter what age or background of human. Duh!
    This is a good example of labeling being essentially meaningless.
    When one looks as people as just individual human beings not as cancer patients, or psychos, or head trauma pets, or TB pts, or stroke victims – btw why does that phrase come so readily too mind?
    And thanks Alex for your own story and great example of art allowing us to be away from ourselves and the daily realities of life as it is.
    And Soneone Else I am sorry the MH professionals were so ignorant of culture and the artistic process. They seemed to be ignorant of more than that especially compassion.
    The United States lost much when the WPA and its many divisions were broken up and destroyed. We need to get that structure back. In the eighties I spent time with two Dutch artists. There is or was I assume still is a national work program that has every government building use work of Dutch artitists for appreciation of employees and other citizens. This gives folk work, there is an evaluative process so staked are still high, and created a win , win situation for all.
    I have been at nationally acclaimed hospitals where very beautiful but extremely high priced works are presented on fine marble walls. I know artist in the city who are working several jobs while still creating art and as I walked past the art work at 3:am, I would think how much more meaningful it would be to see a local artist works and one that I may know. It would provide a much more human connection in the lonely corridors one one’s family member could be at stake.
    Also- psych patients DO NOT HAVE the comfort of family members during their stay. Irony of all Irnonies/ as a mother I slept in the ICU , I spent literally DAYS 34/7 with my family relative/s and when I was held- visiting hours were strictly curtailed and strongly enforced.
    This is what a truly ethical researcher should be/ would be working on. Fluff is fluff whether in academic journals or everyday reporting.

  • Cat. Thanks so much for posting and yes Steve it is a long long list. I was at one of these so called hospitals and it was abusive and at best ignorant of any best practice.
    I discovered this several years ago by calling the institution and someone let it slip who the actual owner was. They keep it very well hidden.
    There are so many ethical and moral issues to discuss and it is hard for me because of the memories and I still haven’t cried. There still hasn’t been anyone I can discuss this with who truly understands and the internet is good but human eye to eye contact is so very necessary for finding some sort of safe space recovery pattern in life after endurance of this trauma.I also read’s Cat’s post on another page and everyone should read it. Yes and yes and yes.
    I don’t know about Yelp. I think I did it early in and my comment/ review was removed.
    One has to remember they have lawyers and eyes and they use them to protect themselves.
    I was on another forum for serious medical issues and there was talk about hospitals checking the forum comments out especially those that could conceivably be brought to trial for medical malpractice.
    I freaked and left the forum because I was afraid the issues could have been possibly identifiable.
    All I can think of is a class action suit or some sort of human / civil rights prosecution. Other than Tina M ‘s workor the ECT case I don’t see that happening.
    I also have been called on and never ever ever want to endure that type of torture again in the time remaining in my life.
    If there were a way to safely tell someone or some group I would do it in a heartbeat. Not only do I like Cat have the memories, I have the professional experience to tell everyone what they were doing was not only professionally unethical and immoral but tstntsmount to human torture in the guise of so called help which only for the profit for a few. My guess is the staff Sunday gettin paid well either and have their own issues and the company finds this out and keeps them quiet. It is bacically a concentration type framework utterly disguised and hidden in almost plain view. They were smarter this time, they deliberately decided not use the chimneys.

  • Craig this is just brilliant and genius. I really wish this had been out when I started working in the MH system.
    This is also great for those that I know who have chosen to take chemicals. I would tell them read this read that but this is clarity for visual learning.
    And Cat – I so appreciate your 12 step viewpoint. The old timers were anti – drug and yes they were right.
    The big Pharma folks created moral injury to us all.

  • Positive writing about the good that can happen in life can never really be critized in terms of the intent and the experience that allowed good to flow.
    However being this is MIA where folks in the field and front lines on both sides meet and converse it is a bit of a sticky wicket for me and perhaps others.
    Trauma is part of this site and how humans in today’s world try to cope with their own and the meta layers we all live with.
    The most painful part of my life as lived from within the MH system as inpatient and outpatient was the experience of a lack of caritas and agape in the system.
    As terrible as my experience was, I was aware of my family’s live but it was clear they didn’t know WHAT to do and were grasping at the ONLY STRAWS that were available.
    The poly pharmacy and psychotropics or neurotoxins – take your pick
    Blunted and dampened my own emotional self do love for my self and others became an abstract term and life situation. I am never sure if I had ECT but I do have Swiss cheese memory but love because of several treatment professionals and inpatient conditions CUT out love.
    Many many folks on both sides of the MH have trauma in its many forms. One can never forget that male aid my be an abuse survivor possibly with an addiction issue and behind on his rent. He just has the keys and someday or maybe earlier did not.
    The fact that it seems we humans continue on and struggle to either gain or get back the ability to live in all its forms over and over and over again is amazing to me.
    Studies in relegion have shown an interesting connection to how children imagine god to how they see their parents. If one is not exposed to love early on in some way how can one love others in return?
    Then there is Father Zorissima’s sp? quote from “Brothers Karamazov” about love in action which is so vitally needed now.
    “ The Little Prince” and others keep me going in these times.
    It would just be nice to have Peter come down from his perch. When one lives their life sitting on the catbird seat it behooves one to realize we ain’t all sitting there.
    PS Going to grad school there were many shrink wives going back to school so they could join their husband’s practices. They would come to class and talk about not getting the project done because daughter had a baby. Understandable but there is this edge and I have always struggled with their relationship together. Cloe Mendes and Jay Haley or Salvador Minuchin come to mind. One was once married to the other.
    So there is that undercurrent as well. Boundaries even the most well meaning sets off uneasiness in me but I know it happens a lot in private practices. And thereby hangs another tale.

  • I have found this site to be extremely helpful on the journey to a better life and as a retired social worker it has helped me integrate and process what I was seeing and experiencing in the field.
    I would suggest that this site needs the perspectives of all involved because I think what we are dealing with is an octopus and it has many tentacles and is well hidden and very hard to either trap and or kill.
    One of the most interesting facts I read lately was the Newsweek article of the 2990’s which was part of a push for drugs campaign. This makes so much sense and yes not only did we buy into drugs as only true response ( and I was skeptical and still slid into the system for myself and others) and meds as the real true and only silver bullet.
    To undo this all will take years and probably decades. This is similar to sex abuse in institutions- the tentacles were allowed to grow and grow and grow unchecked.
    The issue of silence is important here. There are legal ways of silence and making victim’s voices totally taboo.
    If one knows about abuse, offenders at personal, community, institional systems do a great job and making sure silence is not only enforced but continued.
    There are layers of offending from both the for profit and non profit systems and most folks are caught but they don’t even know about the octopus they are feeding. This is true on both sides of the desk.

  • Thanks Chaya I second Alex’s response.
    Maybe add all children who are labeled which expands the area. That MI term whatcha goin to do?
    Coming from a parent yes.
    The act and process of labeling has many threads from school, from an educator, from a family member, from a doc, from a friend, from one’s self.
    In educational terms to get actual help from the school system one is forced into labeling.
    No MFI- no IEP and ah the school districts get different amount of money levels depending on the label.
    Then labeling can vary from one doc to another,
    These area areas that deserve much work and reporting. Those without resources have the hardest time dealing with the system. And there is an inherent basis against those parents with those children.
    If you could go and one is allowed with the parents request to go as support to an IEP meeting wow! And FYI in terms of forced hospitalization the IEP is a legal document and parents have rights and not sure about the child but the goal was if possible st the end have the child be part and involved in the entire process.
    PTA’s have no path for parents with children who are labeled. Privacy is a real legal issue. I would write s newsletter going out to? for parents with IEP kids- no names. What most did not know there was a lovely parent who would type and edit my writing. Even back before being in system I had dyslexia and ect issues. The drugs and the docs never ever asked made it so much worse and the lingering Parkinsonism has hurt me with communicating my thoughts and ideas.
    So I would be known but not everyone had the full story in the community or wanted to divulge how they knew. No I got your newsletter thank you. Never.
    DW Winnicut Good enough/ that’s all a parent needs to be. Let them know that- almost what you are doing but a name can lend prestige.
    Title I used to have a parent support group included with Social Workers and no labeling.Another research direction.
    And acknowledge trauma and histories. And again, mst of the best people that have come out of this world of ours have been gloriously imperfect.

  • George, I am so sorry for the loss of your daughter. I have known many relatives of folks who have decided to let go of life and it is hard because we have a great taboo about talking about this part of life.
    And trying to get help and not realizing that the help was mostly a sham. Those of us psych survivors and our family members again run into another great taboo. Silence can be con ie this but it hurts in the short and long term.
    There is also the issue of abuse and I have no idea where your daughter was in that issue. My grade school had a cluster of suicides but it was a Catholic school and there were issues but who know?
    I appreciate your courage and please keep in exploring and learning.
    My idea is to have trauma centers that are available 24/7 to all with all sorts of support and separate from any medical connection.
    Everyone could use it.
    Take care of yourself and read the old stuff I Trauma there are some gems in the dust.

  • I haven’t listened yet but two thoughts. I am glad there are folks who have the memory of the past with Dr Mosher and Soteria House.
    Second thought Selma Fraiberg MSW did this type of work with mother’s- the father’s in my Program fee and far between. Home visits in some ways can be helpful but ah looking from the psych survivor viewpoint maybe not.
    Third party/ neutral sites were always an option.
    Folks need help and parents in today society just are not given the best tools and stress is all around and kids have that most excellent radar and sonor to detect when parents are especially vulnerable.
    Families need support from nuclear through and including the community and nation where they abide.
    There was the beginnings and then they got smashed down but good. I saw it happen and then became ensnared myself.
    Some day I hope Open Dialogue and memories of good help which were thrown out in the bath water can be gathered together and rise through the yuck.Look forward to listening. Thanks for this I will be interested to see how home visits fare after the travesty of ACT.

  • Jay you started to lose me with the title and then with all the different stats. I appreciate your efforts.
    When I was an inpatient psych unit social worker and having been involved in a new sexual abuse team service – I started asking the folks if they had abuse and or trauma in their histories almost to a one they had experience or experiences. This reflects what Dr Bessel van dear Klerk did on his own as well.
    So if research is using DSM dx and the diagnostic process is becoming more and more fraudulent then why put all the work and time and effort in rebuttal instead of just saying / especially with twins- we need the real experts- twins, their parents, their siblings, their teachers, their friends to explain why this and not that.
    Margret Mead had the bright idea of field studies and if you really want to know about twins a nice longitudal study might work.
    I would ask why?
    There are so so so many issues that needfurther exploration and research this seems like a scientific red herring.
    The two issues that do come to mind our twin loss and disability issues in sets of twins.
    Other than that – please look into trauma, sexual abuse, power and control in the mental health systems.
    Thanks for the work. I hope it helps out somehow.

  • Steve,
    It has been known for some time that family dysfunctionalities can create short and or long term issues which overlap with all the isms and basic structure of one’s life.
    Anxiety is just one manifestation of one human’s response to life- though I also would posit one’s temperament also plays a role but that interaction is like trying to figure out quantum theory- humans are not there yet.
    There once was an ancient emperor who devised an experiment using infants. Some where handled and touched others were not. The infants that were fed but not touched all died.
    Some folks say anxiety and fear can also be signals. I think this is also true. We are as humans are not in a very good space.
    I remember having a panic attack in the 1990’s and literally driving to an activist friend’s house out to state because I felt in my bones and soul as Miss Cavel would say from the Madeleine stories – Something is not right.
    She confirmed my sense and it was helpful to have had that interaction. Worth more than any, any minute or hour of talk therapy or any medication.
    So it is a very tangled trauma web we have all woven for ourselves.
    And so many are doing the see no evil, say no evil, hear no evil layers of denial.
    The rich created s scheme that really has greatly benefited them from insurance to Pharma ect ect
    And why would they stop what has worked so well?
    My sense as a child with benefits was despite the turmoil of the 1960’s there was still a modicum of human caring around me. If the neighborhood kids were playing ball in the street and a car came someone would always call heads up.If I was riding my bike and fell someone would – be it child or adult help out.
    There was a community fabric. In some places more in others places less but it was there.
    One of the negative fall outs of desegregation was the inherent problematic design flaw.
    School principals who were from the communities were not kept with the schoolchildren so part of the fabric was ripped that along with almost flaw designed other issues ended up hurting children and families instead of really really leveling the playing field.
    I just hope someday we can begin to turn around and undo and my guess is the need for so called “ help” will dissipate.

  • I wanted to try to comment on several threads.
    One is women pushing women to take drugs or “ get help.”
    Yes, I have experienced that- specifically the wife of a doctor sending my mother named of shrinks. I don’t think she had any knowledge of my social work career. At that time, my only sister was terminally ill with metatastic cancer and had three small children and my father had a severe disability. I will always have a hard time with forgiveness with her “ only trying to help” moment.
    And yes unknown to her and friends I had already gotten scheduled for support.
    They did an a surprise intervention and it was the last straw on the camel’s back and to this day there is the time before andnthe time after.
    Not what I would ever ever done as a professional or to my worst enemy.
    There is also the artist / musician access to drugs connection that OH brought up.
    So many many folks died young and or so impaired from their best selves.
    The story of Paul Robeson comes to mind because he was given forced ECT. And he once had been absolutely brilliant.
    John Howard Griffts in his closing of “ Black like Me,” mentions the pervasive fear. Nowhere I know it came partly from lynchings. He could have been easily lynched. And what else?
    Alice Miller – I just discovered she was a refugee from WWII. I knew from Germany but not the fact she lived in a ghetto.
    So much that was done and is being done.

  • I would chose one of the caves that has the primitive drawings.There are some neat documentaries about them. Also the young adult novel City of Embrr used that theme. However utopias like Brookland and others have a very hard time surviving humans being humans. I would suggest an island so that several communities could try to thrive in parallel.
    Some monastic communities have and still are doing okay.
    Plum Village and the Taize folks also come to mind.
    Morris West “Clowns of God” trends and treads on this theme as well.
    L’Arche and Catholic Worker homes are another option.
    There are many relegious groups that use volunteers and offer communal or quasi communal living.
    Ah but past history at established places is an Issues for psych survivors.
    Lois Lowery ‘s “ Gathering Blue” is part of a cool quartet to read and comes with others choosing each other.
    It would be interesting to try to do something if money could be found. A three year plan of cave cliffs or whatever could give lots of information and help those of us cope with our empathy.

  • The old plan with a new twist would be start with his feelings. Acknowledge fears. Do some Beryl Rothschild techniques with sensory motor aspects of calming and coming into the present.
    Then tak a what Fritz Redl would call a time life space interview and try to find the source of the anxiety and or trauma and or trauma trigger. This could take hours so maybe s walk outside some coffee and some food. Another choice could be calling on your friends Peer Irganization Liasin to do this Sometimes degrees literally mean nothing.
    If a cause or conditions can be identified if the fear and tangled trauma thinking is lessened and oh yes
    Tangled trauma thinking in this state NO HUMAN can function on a totally logical or rational basis.
    Then the choice could be the friendly 24 hour trauma center for community and more support and or the friendly respite house. And really WHAT DOES HE WANT OR SEE as needs.
    Putin a limb 24 something to help but last last resort.
    Of course this is not insurance or NAMI family friendly though if one could ever change their thinking –
    And your professional administration and the MBA hospital set could be up in arms not to mention the staff around you that are APPALLED simply APALLED that you are not probating here and now.
    The resources and knowledge base is present but the systems and ALL or many of the folks are resistant to change.
    I walked away when it got to unbearable.

  • Thanks for this. It still doesn’t make sense. In 1984 at Smith College Summer CEU they had Rubin Blank a developer of Ego Psychology with his wife Gertrude talk about his own toddlerhood in which he was so troublesome his family would refer to him as Rubin the Terrible. He did it with love and humor and explanation of children needing to explore and deal with theirbgrowing sense of all the boundaries imposed by them in the world. At times, no is actually a good thing to know how to say. He also made a point that the families were are born into are our families. It is our life’s work to learn to cope with them. No matter how we wish they would not be our families it is part and parcel of us. Bad or good or indifferent.
    Selma Fraigberg’s The Magic Years goes into this thinking.
    Trauma was known to some professionals , I guess not enough to stop the tide. Still how did this happen?
    And yes the other causes beside and or including trauma. Noise pollution, air pollution, chemical exposures. Rachel Carson found multiple examples thought the earth’s environs and did not have any background in psychological anything- if we had a modern day Rachel Carson looking into the equivalent of chemical toxins and yes visual artists are exposed all the time- look at possibly Van Gogh? Abd prescription drugs what would she find? And would she be allowed to go forth?
    Serpico? And have there been others who were stopped by the vargities of life and our world as we know it?
    C Henry Kempe a WWII refugee from Germany exposed child abuse. It helps to have a survivor’s experience to think out of the box. And Salk whatever concerns some have with vaccines – do you know he received no profit from his patent PER HIS REQUEST. A true caring person. Some professionals are not worthy to clean his shoes- truly.

  • The concept of legal recourse to seizure for assessment – yes. The ability to call for a mental health check has no conditions or regulations and no downside for the person calling. It has a huge downside for the one called on. Thanks so much treatment advocacy center!
    The Stanley Family is a source of funding for the center.
    There are so many many ways to handle folks either in cris or assumed to be in crisis. Police intervention can not only lead to trauma but death. And my thoughts are the police are not willing participants. They would prefer not to be involved and do actual safety protection. Plus they have their own trauma issues. Suicide rates for police, med students, vets are rising.
    This is just one tip of a largely hidden iceberg.
    The problem is it is so hard to fight. If one gathers for a food fast one and all are both liable for forced legal and medical intervention.

  • Thanks Robert. I remember a time when working at a university connected teaching Hospital was a actual learning experience for interns, residents, and staff. Critical thinking and analytical questioning were prized. It could be a conduit for a cracking open of the walls of the medical industrial governmental corporate industry.
    I brought my medical ethics prof to our Social Work rounds and he eventually was hired by a leading medical institution but his voice literally disappeared. Ethics should be involved in every aspect of medicine from school and beyond.
    One of the conditions in a ground round I attended was Pellegrea sp? Nutrition based emotional issue. My guess like Lyme Disease, Lupus, and other issues one is seeing only a fragment of the whole. The 12 blind men and the elephant meta metaphor comes to mind.
    They should have had in the best practice of academia comparison and contrast in research. They should have personal accounts from all perspectives, and their should have been an art/ media retrospective of treatment including survivor accounts both nonfiction and fictional.
    This is where Bonnie’s book needs to be in- all the bibliographies from medical, nursing, pt, ot, rd education and into alll the community college courses.
    The psych departments should also have tumor boards and all that goes with inpatient medical work at an academic teaching center.
    There was one patient and I have heard other accounts of both benign or malignant tumors causing supposed “ psych” symptoms.
    You could put your name in for a presentation next year. You have the status. And even if it’s for nursing assistants it is a seed or a weed which ever metaphor works for you.
    Cover it with a trendy title and then at least create a ground work for critical thinking.
    “ Splendor in the Grass” would be benign but give folks a what is wrong with now type of view. Doesn’t have to be big or flashy.
    I would love to see if you could pull this idea off.

  • Thanks for this. And aucontrare OH. In many ways the inpatient system has involved to actually be more nefarious and henious than in the 1970’s and other times. I am writing this having read the writings of those forced into insulin shock treatments and knowing and having to have dealt with a person who was a rape baby from their mother’s instiutilization and should they connect or not?
    My own experience post 9/11 was as awful as documented here. Any treatment a joke, severe restriction on movement, incarceration rather than treatment. There are no Day rooms anymore. The for profit industry has spread their tentacles all over the system from hedge funds who own city ambulance services to the most minimalist type of staffing where employees are required to be ignorant of any past best practices.
    In the roller coaster projection of treatment throughout time we are almost and in the juvenile justice system and criminal institution back to shackles on the wall. Dungeons and dragons are now real.

  • Yes! I read the book. It is a twofer for females! Pain and or DSM dx in ten minutes or less. Also the whole ignorance of the female physical experience. Has any female ever ever was asked what was or is your puberty experience and or who would actually want to disclose to some of the treating docs any way.
    Also the repression of sexuality so that gender almost becomes meaningless.
    Thanks for bringing this up. Books need to be written. And check treatment advertising! Women are the prime targets.
    And why are females in this movement more hidden than not?

  • Thanks for this Lawerence.
    This is another example of cross currents in medicine that have gone badly and how corruption and greed infiltrated the entire medical system.
    Insurance, education, and research modalities created further opps for abuse.
    The Sackler Family is worth a research effort.
    Back in the day folks with Sickle Cell Anemia and terminal cancer had true hard pain issues. It was a dilemma and people experienced terrible pain.Other conditions also had pain management nightmares.
    This happened parallel to and at almost the same time as psychisyry’s change into bio psychiatry.
    For both crisises there are alternative treatment and coping modalities. But there mostly are not funded by insurance, are scattered around and usually only work through individual trial and error and many times even if they work are too expensive to continue long term.
    Triple that level to pediatric populations.
    Good Living Through Chemistry. Right.
    My relatives and I found pain management docs a joke.
    Some found help with anti- depressants Truly.
    It’s just a gargantuan mess in capitol letters written in flashing neon colors.
    I would like to see Insurance Companies investigated as well as medical and professional schools investigated, private and profit hospitals addiction and Psychiatric programs, the entire range of owners of big Pharma and should shareholders pay a price for the deaths involved?
    The legal profession and government should be investigated as well. How many NDA’s are there floating around?
    And what other wealth strong arms with pens and legalcompandiums have negotiated silences from folks?
    Some folks do need help with pain. Some folks need help with trauma or perhaps other issues. They all and we all should have the right to have competent and humane medical and no medical treatment options.
    And the children- a real chance to live well and prosper.
    Sales reps told docs it was nonadictive, they in turn told their patients but the big lies create hell. And so many families are living in hell.

  • Well Oldhead amends can mean many things on a spectrum or actually going off the spectrum to start a new paradigm.
    Suffering and trauma and altered realities whether by a spiritual or another means all will still be here even if and when psychiatry is changed, destroyed, altered, or ended.
    Healing of human souls is paramount.
    How we go about that in global, national, regional, or local areas depends on what voices are the loudest.
    History is written by the victors so how to achieve that?
    According to recent books and articles I have read- manuscripts and letters were destroyed by wars and aggressive relegious frictions of all sorts. There has been much that was lost or suppressed.
    One needs not only to have a game book but a game plan as well. Unless one has those essential tool along with funding and some ability to wield power nothing will happen. We can talk or write but that doesn’t change things.
    I still posit there are people in the system who could help.

  • It’s been interesting to read everyone’s thoughts. I found Fromm’s work around college and grad school and was intrigued. I tried to use it for Agra’s school course and received an failing grade and just ended up rewriting what the prof wanted or needed to hear.
    In sacred literature and philosophy there are shades and shades of definitions of the word live. Agape, caritas, Eros and others.
    Companssion and having the ability to truly connect with anotber’s suffering is an absolute requirement for shamans or any in the helper role.
    This is so sadly sadly lacking in our word today and in the MH system or any so called service profession.
    I can consider writings such as Fromm or sacred literature or any other thinking work or artistic creation as touchpoints or touchstones.
    Every culture has them and they can be at times traced to the extreme past which is so interesting.
    Doesn’t mean we agree or disagree they actually are ah! A Good Trigger or set of Triggers!
    Talk about missing the boat or mark! The blatant focus on me, myself, and I, the igornace of human history, and “ Wallstreet” the movie prime directive of “ greed is good” have been swallowed hook, line, and sinker, by many.
    The old primary source writings sometimes reveal a different wisdom more embracing of kindreneess of all and insight to suffering to occurs in all its many many forms as a key to connection rather than hate.
    Psychiatry as in other institutions not only needs to acknowledge the awfulness of treatment, make appropriate and sincere apologies, and then appropriate and real ongoing amends.

  • Dear Cheri, thanks so much for this. It is more than past time that you as a person and as a cohort of peers come out in to full view.
    So much to unpack here for my own narratives and as a micro – macro- and meta narrative of trauma as it has been conceptualized by Medical, governmental, and other systems some more corrupt and self serving than others.
    We are all patented by trauma survivors. Any person who has or had a parent who survived Concentration Camps, DP Camps, Refugee Camps, War even those on the so called winning side and especially those children of vets or who were raised by nurses after their trauma in the WWII Philippines and Brit civilians in the Pacific Theater and after, there are so many incidences as many unfornately as stars in the sky. Can you imagine parenting after having a loved one killed by lynching?
    That there are survivors at all is something to honor in and of itself.
    Before my time in system – irony all of my life is irony- I created, developed, and implemented a program for children in the MH Clinic where I worked. For some reason, it was taken away from my control. Though one of the workers hired admitted to me her mother had issues with parenting and some sort of trauma. She did not last long and the program seemed to disappear as well.
    I also was involved in a parenting program which tried to address trauma and parenting using Selma Fraiberg’s work. Her essay , “ Ghosts in the Nursery” is old but worthwhile reading and should be in any educational syllabus for training any type or level of professional in the system. That it is not, is beyond comprehension.
    During my time in system both in and out of places – your story of children touched by the system in almost an immoral corrupt way and family matters as a nonissue, deliberately ignored was so very true.
    And what was I to do with my knowing anger? It was beyond BS for me and others but to speak and challenge was only punished by more drugging and more punishment.
    As a family, we have never processed in any shape or form what happened to me. Nada – nothing- SILENCE.
    I have learned to hate because of all of this. But I REFUSE to let hate rule my life. NO.
    I have spent thousands of dollars and still silence from all of the professionals I have tried to work with. So I exist and do what I would tell the kids I worked with, tell and tell and tell again.
    One’s voice becomes weak with the telling, one’s fear rises as one has had to deal with police intervention – illegal and uncalled for- so I exist and hope someday those involved with my own narrative and others will be brought to justice or the truth will come out and be exposed.
    Thanks again. And BTW your take on NAMI is on target. Ah trauma when it goes underground it creates minefields for all. They have their own issues and have fallen and are not allowed to get up and see.

  • Rachel , I always am interested in your thoughts. Yeah I know we were duped big time. And I totally understand your self loathing. Been there done that. Depends on the day, depends what triggers I am forced to endure. Drive past the hospital ect ect ect and just that could drive folks into trauma.
    12 step programs deal with your feelings. Just lie say your an addict and leave it at that or do CODA.
    Stick with the old folks they know their stuff and yes they know exactly how you feel. Our issue is we were totally no responsible – we were just seeking help- not a crime. Bessel van der Klerk has states church sex abuse victims have an extreme self loathing – kind of the same dynamic.
    NB Noel – Writing is good but engage and do. Talk is worthless without action.

  • I am shocked just shocked at these redearchers’ conclusions. Really? SES and other migrating factors may impinge on the well being of folks broadly either possibly depending on the statistical level of significance of their lives?
    Have they not read or were taught James Agee’s “ Let Us Now Praise Famous Men”?
    Have they not read or were taught Harriette Arnow’s“ The Dollmaker”
    Have they not been exposed to or taught about Jacob Riis sp? Photographic expose of immigrant children?
    Have they not seen or been taught both “ Brother from Anotber Planet” and “Matewan” John Sayles excellent film narratives of folks in the lower SES levels of America?
    Have they not been exposed to all of the past and current art forms of all kinds from all cultures and genders that have been documenting this aspect of our country that many do not want to acknowledge or if they do acknowledge the graphs, diagrams, formulas, and advanced analytical equations use their suffering for their own personal, economic, guild, and academic enrichment and immoral- unethical gains.
    Way too little, way , way to late.

  • Thanks Noel. I find this a nefarious tactic and almost perp like. Use something legitimate but abscound with the money and goods.
    I refused to look at the latest DSM when given a chance. In the other ones there was a axis about stress and life events. It was there but never ever used.
    Now folks see trauma as a profit engine.
    BTW folks should read up on the Sound if Music family. There were issues like in all families and one member was ill used by the MH system.
    I am still waiting for the use of the system to be shown to be used by corrupt other systems. Andrew Greeley had a thinly disguised mystery novel where a priest who had uncovered church malifiesence was remanded to a Psych. Unit.
    The system needs an entire inside out reform.

  • Eric, I am so sorry and hope to hear about a positive outcome.
    Stephan G yes the Day Treatment – Old Partial Hospitalization programs are a good example of professional “ babysitting”
    Waste of time for all. I don’t know who was more bored the staff or us clients. Both were cigs in the system.
    Developmental Disability programs at least back in the day had better program planning. But once back in the day some MH Clinics did do more. Depended on staff.
    Also the Green Door Program in DC with the club format. But then was then, this is now and it’s like looking back at former leaders of our country and thinking wow maybe they were better than I thought because the now leaders are beyond reprehensible.

  • I found the docs who endured military service like WEII ect. have had more of a wider perspective and heart. Not all but some.
    Now it seems that the system of getting to medical school is rigged. Parents pay for tutors in preschool just to keep their kid in the upper mix. And how are any “ othered” folks ever going to fight such an entranced secret system?
    As soon as you walk in the door of an upper class PTA meeting – by your skin color, by your dress, by your accent. And if heaven forbid you fit “ the criteria” if your child is in the special needs stream oh my oh my oh my. Actually some of the best teachers are in Special Ed- I you are lucky to get one of the good ones wow. Not all but I did put my other kids in a tracked classroom because of how good the team of teachers were. Those kids deliberately dumbed themselves down so as not to get put in the other stream.
    Lots of kids in the advanced classes ran into trouble. Sometimes med students and residents as well. Not enough life discomfort.
    Medicine is a contract between community and folks in the community. For multiple reasons including several systems that are corrupted that contract seems to have been smashed to smithereens.
    I would love to have a transgender doc, or First Nation, or African American, or Huspanic- anyone who has lived life with no rise colored glasses in. I would trust them and take their advice and really ponder it instead of in the first three minutes of a new pt interview want to get up and leave.
    At least in other medical types there is a chance for running into a possible good one. Psychiatry is less and one is hardly ever believed- at least for me in my time on the other side of the desk. I worked with some caring ones back in the day before bio took hold- also know it wasn’t all pretty for many- but never had one that helped only hurt. Some tried but their efforts still damaged.
    I want docs who lived through stuff in al specialties.
    I
    I knew of one resident who got into trouble for referring too many of the patients to Social Services- just discharge planning, nothing else- not billable you know.
    Holly Nesr has an old song” It Could have been me…”
    I think she needs to rewrite it and title-
    “ It has been most of us and now we Rise Together”
    I just don’t know how to make it happen. By having been taken off the streets and forced treated my fear stands in my soul. I do not know anymore. Blocks and walls and I don’t have the wherewithal to surmount them anymore.

  • Thanks for replying. I guess with my former professional hat on- there are so many layers and is not whether one has been traumatized it’s the whole story.
    The lack of female trauma experts is a concern and the lack of other gender types as experts.
    Selma Fraiberg MSW from U of Michigan did trauma work with mothers. The MH business like society has femanized or otherized trauma denies it and it moths into craziness.
    How many mothers in the CPS system were abused and victimized by men? I still am traumatized by a clients last words to me indicting her father to the abuse of herself as a young girl after blowing up after two years of work. She wasn’t able to talk as I wasn’t in my time in the system and still am or feel constrained.

  • Interesting thoughts Bob. It’s refreshing to hear a professional discredit the DSM and yes the DSMII was different.
    I am not sure about the stroke analogy and um the reference to the mums. My guess is paternal or paternal like actors play a role in abuse. Easier to get angry at a female- and why is that?
    Also racism et al is also is trauma inducing in and of themselves. Inter generational personal, family, culture, gender is another damn layer.
    And economics! Macro and micro!
    And the environment!
    But thanks for your thinking! And I would really like to hear your own story.
    We are all trauma victims but ah so important to go beyond into better things.
    Did the folks in the system agree to see you? That would be helpful to know. Also were any released? Because any type of incarceration is trauma.
    The best thing you were able to elucidate for me was trauma’s impact.
    There is enough trauma is life when other types of trauma are either allowed and or made to occur that in and of itself is a divine human tragedy.

  • Well all, of course Ghandi was imperfect as Jesus, as Vera Britten, as Rabbi Hillel,
    Victor Frankel, Corrie Ten Boom, Dorothy Day, . The importance is not their flaws, their importance was/ is that they spoke out. Some better than others, some less hypocritically than others. There are no saints on this earth.
    Some people like Dr Peter Goertze speak out.Some do as Stephan Gilbert has chosen.
    The only option I have found for myself is to tell my story to chosen people and groups. And it was as far as I can tell a random shout in the dark. But I followed what I would tell the kids I worked with to tell and tell and tell until someone listens and hopefully either can or will act. No guarantees just the knowledge that there usually are some sort of good folk around. But luck is a crucial element.
    Oh my Dr Torrey talk about wrong way Corrigan – perfect example of TROUBLE.
    The force that drives the fuse.
    I just hope someday we can have a counter force that drives the fuse of our own.

  • I always enjoy reading Sandra’s work. She is thinking!
    I think as survivors we can’t always make all professionals whipping posts for our very justified anger and rage.
    This WHOLE movement is a process and there are fits and starts and fits and starts.
    As much as the Nazi’s in Germany and other repulsive regimes with their minions are completely reprehensible to me. I also know there were those who tried to help. Some did amazing things and were killed, others did little and still were killed, and others lived on.
    Every time we blanket our thinking it stops as Leonard Cohen put it so well we need to acknowledge that it helps that other humans let the light come in through the cracks.
    And I will stand my ground with stating every every corrupt system has cracks.

    The other issue is there is no good alternative yet. If you are rich maybe but jus maybe because professionals can take advantage of the rich.
    Who btw is “ treating” Kayne West?
    Hell of a job?
    Where is a person who cares about the little boy that he was and what he lived through? No language but a cry that is unheard and labeled mental illness.
    So there are few open doors and windows which makes the field like living in Germany knowing about the camps or just after the Allies came in and what does one do?
    The ability for funding and creation of true supports is ALWAYS iffy.
    British Military Medical Staff knew about trauma because they had no choice but to return soldier suffering from battle faitigue to the front. It worked but after the war ended- No more soldiers needed at the front lines do it was all forgotten to the detriment to all of us.
    So while we are in movement and there still is no way to Adequetely heal from the malpractice and abuse we suffered we have to slug on and anger even the best and most justified can end up a burden. MLK Jr. and Ghandi and Vera Britten and others knew rage and because they knew it so very well they choose the nonviolent path.
    So don’t stop wring criticisms just maybe doing something somehow. May not be realistic but I speaking for me, can’t totally turn off others when they are trying. If we do turn off others we are uncomfortable about or maybe they are a trigger- so many ways of walks
    I don’t want to be as rigid as the Nazis and other tyrants my way or the high wayor for many in contact with them
    death. Or the parents who says when I say jump the only question you can ask is how high?
    Allies are important even if you don’t totalky see eye to eye.

  • The Deaf Community ran into quite a large number of issues in the MH system. One of my graduate school placements was at a pact unit with a significant deaf population. One could be labeled psychotic with a mere misunderstanding of the type, kind, or dialect of sign.
    Interestingly , Joanne Greenberg who wrote “I Never PromisedYou a Rose Garden” had many writings based on the Deaf community. “ In This Sign” a heart wrenching read.An excellent intersectional meme or metaphor for this topic of Fanon.

  • Sascha, Interesting thoughts. With your MSW are you in a peer role? Does your written job description require lived experiences and does it require a graduate degree? If the agency recognizes your graduate degree what is the pay scale for you compared to other peer support folks? Same or different?
    Are peer support roles used as babysitters? Keep them quiet til the Crisis Unit or Pilice arrive? Or do you do actual support ie yoga classes, meditation classes, nutrition or can you do how to walk away classes? What about anyone taking a trauma history? What about inter generational trauma issues?
    Are you allowed to speak about discontinuing meds? Are you allowed to get folks bro bono legal help?
    What about those folks with children? Where are they and how are they?
    I did Peer involvement to meet folks. I had one job but kept very very quiet. My local area is almost all NAMI enforced thinking though I just want informed choice at this point because so many are not open and are so ignorant of history.
    The local peers seemed very constrained and most are not aware of any other options. At a meeting only one other perso an addiction counselor knew of Robert’s work. Job Kabat Zin was a new name for many. Many took the job because so what are you going to do? And like me maybe a possibility of sharing and small human connection and contact.
    Each two places with their folks disappeared and the job was too dicey.
    I found the system as a LISW too broken to ethically work in. And I found NASW local and national regions to be of very little help and or support.
    My most wow type memory before being in the system but working for an agency was when in a staff meeting the African American psychiatrist asked if anyone would be willing to take either Haldil or a similar drug – just to see.
    Silence and I would guess fear. That says it all.
    And BTW my guess is that there are invisible peers who are in treatment and or in meds but are not “ out.”
    This maybe the biggest stumbling block of all – what webs we weave when we first practice to deceive.

  • Steve
    Thanks. The most help I have found is through just folks that have been in the system. But for me I also had another life and have lived other paths before, during, and after my time in system.
    Having a more non mainstream look at the system plus some folks stigmitism in the past makes it difficult. To pretend or not to be pretend is the question. Much of the time I have difficulty doing either.
    Breathing and walking and other alternatives help but to thrive and get back to where I was and that journey in and of itself was not easy. This site and some peer meetings have been helpful but there needs to be more.
    Aeopisciplian authority given by the people to medical professionals is a legal and social contract. There had to be a way to break or call
    BS to contract that harm.
    I await it’s coming.

  • My other thought is that enuf with trying to figure out comprehendthe other side.
    What would be really helpful to me asa psych survivor is a framework – a compass rose- some rituals or paths others have used to not only walk away but continue on and if at all possible thrive in some way.
    Reading some of my medical records by myself was almost a revictimization. Talking to others is a literal crapshoot because so many upon hearing your real life story use “ that voice” of now but very effective othering.
    And again I have come from a lucky spot.
    How to live with the memories?And they come up at various times unwillingly.
    EDMR okay but my myriad of issues and practioner change to require meds changed that option for me.
    The anger of knowing how I treated folks and the trauma of not in any way shape or kind in return at certain times stillrankles and the inability to dialogue and understand where and why and how these practioners treated me as they did is at times an existential agony.
    Anger ultimately is only helpful on a short term basis but forgiveness that is one sided can be achieved intellectually with effort but is hard to retain and unless one is truly a wisdom healer never enough to change life paths in an effective way.
    The geographic cure can work but again the issue of memory.
    At this time we are seeing memory come up for sex abuse , and. othering and abuse in our nation or world history,but not psych . There have been so much too so many in ALL areas.But a mee too movement for us? Or is that beyond the Pale?
    How can we help ourselves bind our own and other’s traumas?
    To be effective activists especially now with so many arrests and physical and weaponized ( instruments of all kinds) WE need to walk in and move forward rather than do I what I have done – hide.
    One activists suggestedalways carry a second set of clothes so if your taken you have a change. I don’t WANT to be taken and until I have a modicum if some sort of resolution. No- no matter what. If I had not had my 15 years in the system, more than likely I would be out in full force for a variety of causes.
    I know one cannot give power to people but when the people still have the power what can one do?
    Getting of SSD but nine months and that track record hasn’t been reached though I have tried.
    School again? Two graduate degrees and my abilities are as sharp in the past and there were LD issues from birth.
    Volunteer one has to disclose or pretend.
    Inust want the freedom to be me and offer wheat ever small wisdom I have gathered.
    Anyone else have this need for resolution to move beyond?

  • Thanks Michael and Judi for the after comments.
    I would say another word for empathy maybe user and knower of human emotions- more of a phrase but it’s essentially the same idea.
    Samenow sp? in his writings of criminal minded folks – the real kind not the forced and contrive school to correctional system elitist pipeline – talked ofcomplete and utter comparentalization. There was no thread between their life just a series of moves of power and control.
    “Angels with Dirty Faces” is an interesting take on this as well as”Heart of Darkness”
    In my past work with offenders there were several type of folks- some were able to eventually move on past a predator mind set others not. Abuse and trauma were ever present in all of their histories.
    I think we see this mindset in almost all of our systematic institutions. Dietrich Bonhoeffer and Oscar Romero – Corrie Ten Boom, Miep Giess, Dorothy Day, Raul Wallenberg, Sr. Dorothy Stang,
    James Wendell Johnson, have been and there are now folks who at best died in the face of these forces
    or challenged the status quo. And throughout systems there have been so many deaths, so many silenced voices, so many possible great hope futures deliberately or by happenstance killed off.
    The predators know human beings well, so well and they as stated in Judi’s commentary take time for the set up. There are many – too many rape walks. A rape walk is when a perp prowls in invisibility around the home or workplace or whatever and sizes things up. They know fear and anger and anxiety. And are skilled in creating it and using it for their own purposes.
    My best guess is somewhere there was a choice made by them to go full throttle into this mindset.
    The problem is we as patients, or parishioners, or constituents, or consumers, can easily be gladhanded by these folks. And I have found despite my dissident professionalism I still was dragged down into the basement bowels of the psych system. My sense of intuition and trust shattered to the winds. And this is from someone on the at first other side of the desk. What the world has done to so many without my privelge is at times for me devastating.

  • Katherine, Interesting though the comments here are correct – this is old stuff and it pays to be sensitive to those who are reading. That being said who asked you to write it and submit?
    It is important to know the curve and trajectory of history but there are slot of gaps like maybe Bedlam? And the Dalem Witch Trails right up in your state. One reason was possible Ergot poisoning. That is worth a blog right there.
    I think one reading one of these articles it would help to know many many states had institutions like these and many are still alive who were in them or like mevisted and or did volunteer or fieldwork in them. All of the ruined buildings are places for the kids to go in and get scared.
    Matter of Fact there was a big movement just awhile ago about this very topic. Halloween and the insane asylum for fun and profit. No.
    The point on the graveyards.Just like in Ireland. I strongly recommend the movie about the Magdalene Laundaries – very unsettling but true. In Taum numbers and numbers of small bodies were found and I would be if a dig was done in an asylum some small bodies would be found as well.
    Also before writing I would suggest you do some research on the West African port city? that was the dispatching site for the Slave Trade. There are several good media pieces about African Americans walking through the holding rooms.
    I think this is still important as one day one hopes the well intentioned good and the horrors are catalogued as past history as the families and children who have been detained by our government will walk through the buildings and walk through not as refugees but as free people. The same with Rikkers and other heinous facilities.

  • Thanks for your thoughts and this type of information Lawerence.
    I was in a museum which housed an old drugstore and the old meds were infused with opiotes. From infants to the elderly much of the so called elixers were made out of addictive substances. The probation era did not focus on these but maybe those substances were outlawed?
    How did snake oil salesmen morph into Pharma reps and docs with a pen and a pad of paper?
    EugeneO’Neil highlighted the old addiction epidemic in “ Long Fsys Journey into Night”. Day not Fsys.
    One would think that drama would be essential medical school reading.
    One idea might be a new way of writing scripts that would make the physician admit to doing a thorough medical history and write down three possibles scenarios: outcomes of taking the medication and then it is informed consent and then the patient can decide.
    I would also like to see investigative journalism take on Pharm Reps and other Medical Sales Employees. The are on the front lines and did they not know what they were doing? No ability to see the local population as human beings? No ability to let the docs know their educational background? Any moral or ethical classes?
    Please write more history or research it for us? When did the tide turn back?
    Not sure about your concerns re universal health coverage. Again research andcomparision to Norther European countries. BTW Nursing Homes really started going well with Medicare/ Medicaid. Some folks use a good idea and utterly ruin it for their own nefarious benefit.

  • Yes I found that out as well. The history of the Rorschach Test is interesting/sad as well.
    Paul Robeson psychiatric treatment and suicide is another story that needs to be told. His son wrote about it and came to some interesting conclusions.
    Likewise Hemingway’s story has some perhaps unusual details as well.
    The Mad Hatter character in Slice in Wonderland is based on history facts.
    Workers in hat factories would go out of their minds very often. It was the chemical fumes that caused the mind alterations. I find that something to contemplate.
    I still think we all are the canaries.

  • Unable to LogIn on any other name.
    Julie,
    There was much non help in the past and currently. Luck of the draw. As in any maladaptive system there are always people who try to do their best and try to have a high standard. Then there are the others and more others.
    In sex offender training we had a video of a nurse in a children’s hospital who admitted to abusing kids with severe neuro issues precisely because – they wouldn’t tell.
    So at various times there would be winds, waves, of truth BUT NOT FOR LONG.
    This was before sex abuse really came out just at the beginning edge- the system folks didn’t want to deal with it and it still lies buried.
    There is the buried abuse of all kinds from sides on the floor – poorly trained, working just to survive with their own issues that they try hard to keep under roots and up the ladder. The worse for me is the administrators who don’t go on the floors, who make money pushing papers and are wined and dined by big Pharma.
    As a lowly medical social worker, I was dined ie lunch/ one time and never ever again I refused even Christmas gifts. Oh and there was one free baseball game and lunch for the Mental Health Center Staff. One time.
    Beer rounds on Friday afternoons for all the residents- it’s a story in and of itself. From pens, to fridge magnets, to Rum. Similar to the 1776 musical song-
    From Bibles to Rum to Slaves. YouTube it and insert the words nouns if your choice.
    I am truly sorry to you and all.I went in to change the system and became woefully victim of it.
    I did do some neat things. Out of the box but still stuff happened and the memories are part of the life I live now because no way to break them through formal or informal means. And who am I?
    Too many life experiences and any wisdom I did have or gifts lost.
    Again my apologies to those hurt.
    Nothing can take back the time or memories- in a truly just and or merciful world there would be a formal written apology, listening and grieving time, and some sort of compensation. Unfornately, I know of no Time Machine and the taking off if the masks and stopping if the dances st The Net and pleasure resorts seemingly will never happen.
    Make a list of those you have lost and send it to the CEO’s and CFO’s of Oharma and for profit psych hospitals and private prisons and juvenile detention or treatment centers.
    Send it to your local County MH board and DD board. The abuse and corruption is spread and anyone who is disabled is at risk for lowly or the worst high level Perps.
    Also the artists need to wake up. They fell in line and look what had happened. Just like me.

  • Actually in the world and all of its history there is always the tension between artist and systems. Dante was forced into exile. Kit Marlowe was killed.
    There are between the lines stories of many artists some mentioned here in this comment area. The more brilliant one is and wide seeing the more trouble an artist walks into. Stalin and his regime was very unkind to artists. How Boris Pasternak survived and his work broke free is another between the line tangle of story.
    Here in my area one has to play the game to survive. There is no room or even an iota of space for other nonsporoved opinions. One pretends and pretends or is hauled off or worse.
    Some are doubly or tripley unlucky with being an artist from less privelege and or othered classifications. DFW was white and male as were others. I am reminded of the play title “ For Colored Girls…….” Nina Simone and others who tangled and were tangled into knots. Tied so tight – ever after the trauma bound times by docs or other officials refused solace or comfort. And some -many lost their lives. And art dies.
    I once was in a educational parent council for parents of kids with “needs”
    Made it to possibly two meetings – childcare issues.
    Some of the women – and they were all women- were really interesting and I would – had there been childcare provided or help from the school district to continue on.
    However, there was a Mom I thought was great. A few weeks after it turns out she was abused and killed by some young men, Layers just layers of trauma here- whirlpools.
    From reading the accounts – it seems they had seen her daughter and scoped her out as victim. She must of sensed it and went to get car alone. She was abducted and my best guess is she refused to tell the offenders the location of her daughter and they killed her.
    To this day no one from the Parent Council ever did anything to honor or even understand what she did. I was aware because I worked with offenders in the court system in one of the many jobs before terteriary,secondary, and primary trauma and life as I live coincided. And the art I thought I could do and share is not a possibility.
    This could have been, this woman’s life could have been used to understand not only trauma but how humans lose the ability to care and have empathy for others. My guess is those offenders had hortirific stories of their own. And sometimes trauma can cause the choice towards awfulness and a life of awfulness until death. Poor or wealthy.
    We talk of suicide but that is a stillpoint or ending. It is an end cause and the various why’s are deep and wide. My guess is in that family relatives have thought of ending it all- the ripple affect.
    Writing about suicide doesn’t really help. Writing about the why of the whole so called helping world does a bit more. Callling out the acts of human bravery or kindness sheds light in a very dark world. Artist can feel the flow of the cold and or warm currents – see the stains in the water or the affect of sunlight on a calm dawn beach. We also tell uncomfortable truths or see them and live with them in the prison that we all share -the human mind.
    I request that if you read this comment offer up a moment of silence to this mom I knew for a brief shing hour or two. Do something for another person today- do something more than just common.
    Work on art or help or forgive someone and or maybe yourself.
    Cry for the hurting males who killed her perhaps. They were not born that way- they were made by our common nightmare human inhumanity to other humans. I have no doubt.
    And then can we break these chains we all have tied around ourselves? And just move out and beyond ourselves.
    In her honor I will be retiring my Catnight name
    Next time it will be my own name and damn the consequences- it can’t get any worse I have lived through it all and am still here.
    Best to all- Mary O’Malley psych survivor seclusion…….. all of it – and retired LISW with twenty years experience in trauma issues.

  • Lawerence, You have written about a searing issue in today’s world.
    As always I wear several hats on this issue.
    1) Having worked on a medical floor in Social Services pre opioid era there were huge pain issues for folks. Sickle Cell Anemia who mostly come out of an African American population base were sometimes not believed by some of the staff. Elderly folks with compressed spinal fractures were totally incapitated.
    So pain was a huge quandry on multiple levels.
    Pain used to be used as a diagnostic tool back in the day.
    Salk developed a vaccine for Polio. He refused any monetary gain. And why NOT others?
    How this all became so awful is still unbelievable to me. Who was supposed to be monitoring the ethics of ALL of this?

  • Well so much for true intersectional dialogue. Despite his reliance on diagnostic toolShaun at least takes time and energy to reply- thanks for that.
    I think this thread covers a lot of bases old and new.
    I would love to have some Vets speak and dialogue with them. Way backs out ten years ago a mother who lost a child to suicide was telling me about the suicide issue in the VA. I would submit unless you have been in country there is no way any one can get the experience and peer relationship might be very important but I don’t know.
    There is trauma but there is also the spiritual mindset but I don’t have a good sense of what is what. Druids use to intentionally create a psychotic type of experience. So there is that whole realm that is never accounted for by most professionals.
    There is the whole epigenetic issues of trauma generations in the making with the whole world of isms that so many people deal with and have to deal with still today. Lynchings and Detention Centers and forced marched exiles.
    It would be nice to hear a We have no idea and let’s do a remake with a three year review with everyone involved.
    Some folks are helped by mainstream folks and processes but that is a very narrow spectrum and why not use everything?
    Healing has always been needed because human life just ain’t easy.
    The corruption and sense of do harm rather than do no harm just needs to stop.

  • Stephan, I always reading your comments and I thank you for your well written manifesto.
    I have issues with peers support in some ways but you are witnessing in your work place. I am so sorry you are not seen as the gift that you are.
    You could easily be co- managing an unit and really shine.
    The fear of professionals has prevented so much good from happening.
    Why not Peerand Professional Managed Units at every hospital and do an evaluation of comparison and contrast?
    Of course the administration already fears the outcome and are barricading every level and type of access for any other option.
    Thanks for your work but I wish better for you and please take care of yourself.

  • Shaun, I am commenting on several of your thoughts.
    Any psych dx is a snapshot of someone in a moment -it does not hold true forever or in the next thirty minutes. A broke arm is a broken arm that can be seen on X Ray even after the body has been submersed in a bog centuries after death.
    So even the use of PSTD has concrete issues. In regards to your opinion that not all humans involved in war exhibit that label- it depends.
    The British Government had problems with returning vets in WWI – and during the war the military had an advanced program to treat soldiers who were suffering from so called battle fatigue- ah another problem with labels- they can change and fall in and fall conviently out of favor. The main aim of the program was not to resolve but to make them ready to return to battle. Any knowledge that was gained was either buried or lost.
    So although the returning vets did not fit a label of battle fatigue – there were no more battles- they were unemployed and had so called unruly issues. Wonder why?
    The government as so many institutions do too many many times gathered them to form a security force in Ireland which was in the midst of one of a zillion rebellions. They became the Black and Tans and wrecked havoc and further trauma on the Irish people – a so-called moral harm type of period.
    Trauma signs and symptoms does NOT neccesssrily be OVERT it can be subtle and life long and for those with either wealth, or power, or those with strong support networks, or those with a healthy environment, or those with a strong educational background, or those with a special talent or gift, or those with just sheer good luck, it can be there but not exposed and or kept in quietly or loudly hidden by themselves or others.
    The mass 1960’s youth movement where did that anger and energy come from? My guess is 90% had a parent or parents who were somehow directly negatively affected by WWII.
    Not speaking about trauma is still living in a silent prison of trauma.
    Some sex abuse survivors if they do tell especially those with clergy or other dominant societal offenders take thirty or more years to tell the truth and many go to their grave effectively still silenced by the offender and or the system that refused to acknowledge the truth of the trauma cannon.
    And once one is medicated one is usually stuck in the system because of the medication.
    There is NO institional method that is acknowledged by the MH system to Eliminate the Label and diagnosis and or use the medication as a true short term solution.
    The MH system now plays the productivity game – at least at my last job – where workers are made to have high productivity rates or literally be fired.
    It actually works better to see clients for decades rather than not.
    I only worked in one program that was as trauma based as possible at the time where there was a time limit involved. Then for awhile short term treatment was in and they changed the program time frame. The wink wink here was – they will always be back.
    This is too long- Icould write a book but your journey is still in the making think more, research everywhere, and we survivors not only have knowledge but deserve much much better than what we were given. Restitution’s are needed.

  • Patrick, I appreciate your effort here, and the fact you are writing in a second language. You sounded like Lacan and possibly Levi- Strauss.
    Shades of Literary Criticism here which most American folks unless they have a grad or BA degree in Literature would miss and might not only find confusing but off putting.
    I think you were trying to say I am with you but too high flauntin’.
    And if not that you built a fourth wall with your use of the word Signifer.
    There are lots of gaps here but the history is expansive but we need the whole kitchen sink- dirty plates and all.
    So the torture that was considered treatment needs to be called out. Freud and his forced reversal with his first academic writings on sexual abuse of his female patients changed to hysteria.
    And although Anna Freud did some great work – what about her relationship with her father?
    I am glad to see your calling out of the issues with Autism.
    Have you read Sue Miller’s “ Family [email protected]? It is still one of my favorites though now it is dated but still.
    You by passed addiction and what was the real story on Freud and cocaine?
    And according to my memory bank in the nineties we as professionals were being to the DSM was bunk. We just we never told the truth about why.
    One of the things as a professional that I respected with a few of the psychiatrists I worked with was their ability to have compassion, empathy, and even as mutation to those thevwirked with or discussed. Some of them would talk about artists of all kinds and be in awe of their creative talent. A few. And in your Psychoanalytic journal one of them always had a section on artists and or creativity?

    I did not get this empathy in your writing. Next time maybe more Victor Hugo and less Satre.
    You cannot join with others if bridges are too walking.

  • Dear Helen,I appreciate the effort but not there yet.
    To quote TS Eliot – that is not what I meant at all-
    When I suggested dialogue in an earlier post. I meant like Gail Collins and Bret Stephan’s weekly writing. A dialogue – could also be more voices now and then.
    The divide is not broken until listening occurs and is internalized and oh light bulb moment occurs.
    I am reminded at one hospitalization at Windsor Laurelwood they had a student nurse give us patients a talk.
    One patient asked her if she was afraid of getting contaminated by us- this was after for me 15. years as a LISW with time in the inpatient and outpatient worlds of mental health system.
    Her reply is classic and should be put down in Capitol letters in the first/ next M H system tell all book or even better Medical and Nursing and USocial Eork text books on what not to say to folks.
    Her reply was no because she had asked her parents if anyone in the family had issues and they assured her no- no one in her family had issues so she felt safe.
    I wanted to stand up and shout- you lie!
    Anyone but anyone who has worked in the system know almost all profs have had some family experience or the old sawhorse shrinks kids are the most troubled of all doctor kids. And I would say anyone who has a doc as a parent needs a 12 step program just for that.
    Another Social Worker who went on to a PhD in academia – name available upon request- discussed this. But we both were unaware – oh our dads were vets- obtbey could do great work but yikes their trauma issues really played out at home. And it doesn’t mean just Vets. All and I mean All are survivors of various types and forms of trauma.
    Until that is put up front – the bridges are still down and waters still troubled.
    The aide? Staff member – one of the great ways control is used in inpatient units- one never knows the education level. Aide? LPN? Intern?
    RN? Roving Staff? Hired help? Student working while dealing with single parenthood and school and another job?
    The aide who called me a crazy bipolar bitch probably was not just calling me that there were echoes of a past or present she was presumably unaware of.
    So please better ways of dealing with power and control. Again as porrviste the effort. You all can do better.

  • When I was a professional I had an idea but not total comprehension of those supposedly I was helping.
    I think this dialogue needs to happen here- a joint survivor /prof ongoing conversation.
    This project is worth all try but the issues raised here are very legitimate.
    There are several aspects
    Power and Control – Systemic in a variety of areas
    Human Rights
    How one reclaims a voice when it has literally and metaphorically been quashed
    How to reconcile- past, present, and future.
    Just more thoughts for other pieces.
    I believe it can and SHOULD be done.
    My mother was a Social Wirker and worked with pregnant women and had them climb stairs. She told me after she herself became pregnant she realized the 7 story flight was awful for them and never did that again.
    I feel that way too. In some ways, I had no idea.
    So how to change perspective when the system has walls high walls around change?
    John Steinbeck’sThe Grapes of Wrath and Rose of Sharon’s lasting life giving image at the end.
    We all have to change. Some from what was done to us others for what we did to them.
    Another run of columns two person please!

  • Dear All, I think we should just do it. If fear is involved one can use a made up name or relative or friend who is supportive of the cause.
    I wear many hats. Survivor, like seclusion, like forced meddling, like police taking me away from bank, like.Parkinsonism .
    Various relatives have used are using these drugs. I have had many experiences with suicide of peers and others.
    I also was a professional for over twenty years before being pushed into the system.
    I think that it’s better to work as we rather than them. It just makes sense. There are really really awful professionals but my sense is these who post and interact aren’t the ones we need to focus our outrage on.
    And to the profs. This action is scary. Taking a step when police have been called several times scars one. And it was bad real bad. Never expect Kumbaya from us.
    But this a good idea and worth a shot.
    Miracle on 34th Street? To see a flood of paper and o email would be so worth it!

  • Steve -actually it is common practice to use antidepressants for pain management and benzodiazepines as well. Also I have seen psychotropics used purely for behavior management for both the old and young.
    Show me a patient with a complicated surgical procedure and I will show a potential addict.
    The other issue is offspring of folks who are given these meds and viola the old wine in the cabinet filled by teens with water becomes the pills swiped from the medicine cabinet.
    Now it’s both etoh and psychotropics.
    The drive had lasted for so long / it has literally been consumed into a mindset. I even get pushed and then ought into it.
    Remember PSA’s Yul Brynner and his face seeing him say when you see this I will be dead?
    None of that now only add upon add upon add upon add.
    And don’t tell me Big Pharma folks were not aware of what a poor economy and employment situation can do for sales.
    So twisted and tangled and no end in sight that’s why why not do something rather than not even if the doing has issues?

  • Mickey this is a very interesting idea from a community organizing standpoint. Very Saul Alinsky. For those who don’t know or have heard negative accounts – Saul really was brilliant especially with tactical planning. He wold only take on paid work if he felt there was more than a 75% chance of winning. He did not come from a victim and or survivor view. It was all about power dynamics from the setting to the furniture.
    Things have changed so much in the world now. We really as a movement are quite restrained. Many of Saul’s tactics would be quickly quashed now. And many would be failures.
    I just read somewhere that many docs sign NDA for big medical corporations. The system as. someone once said is rigged. Many private corporations or family run businesses have huge huge amounts of money to spend. Huge.
    So there is a phrase we must all deeply consider here. Politics make strange bedfellows.
    We have to sit with unaligned folks because they have better seating placement and more money and access.
    This rankles and hurts and in many ways is totally unfair. But there it is.
    We need however uncomfortable to become we. And then We are Many They are Few can create change and hopefully not cosemetic but true change. Abolition? Complete Dextuction?
    Transformation?
    To be determined and who knows? Who really knows?
    As much as I am angry and righteously so -I know no social action can be totally based on anger. Anger in and of itself fizzles, can become boring, can become a problem in and of itself.
    I would say let’s try it. What more do we have to lose?
    Unless all sorts of people intermingle and talk/ the walls stay up and bridges are never ever built. And yes sometimes you want to burn those bridges. And I have done my share of burning from all the stuff I lived through/ but what the hey?
    It is action and we have done nothing on a national basis-everyone else has.
    Sometimes as Harriet did one has to wade in the water and find out what happens after the water is troubled.Shevould never gaurantee safe oasssge. She had a history and knowledge but everyone just had to jump in.

  • Thanks Sera for another empathetic and informative piece. As the Latino world deals with death in prayer ritual- Presente David.
    We all are dealing with layers of multiple issues with the topic of suicide and as Robert’s previous recent article the water is both deep and wide.
    And kudos for being so wise with him. Education and intelligence sometimes obsufacstes human kindness and compassion.
    To sit with another’s pain is a high calling not taught or recognized in many parts of this world today.
    Henri Nouwen not only was sat with but sat with others in the last years of his life. There is a stream of folks and someday MIA should highlight those.
    In the article you focus on professionals. And I agree with your thoughts.
    The question is why and how come and why not?
    Again history of those folks who could sit and listen and how past communities were able to have them in a much much more available is so so very important.
    The one issue and for another time I hope is the concept of mental health checks and folks using the police to handle their problems and actively and purposefully avoiding any other action. A kind of wiping the hands clean.
    It is another layered quagmire.

  • Hi Steve, before I go offline. I just wanted to share thoughts.
    One sheriff is not a neutral word.
    Two Reading over things before sending a roller coaster learning curve that is affected by many things.
    Tbree. Male hold on the system even in anti system is still here. Most folks served by the system female and or othered folks.
    Use these thoughts as you will. I wish the best for the site but a learning curve still for all of us.
    That’s all folks!

  • Good luck and having the person who tagged a comment tell their thinking is essential. We are suppose to grow out of magical thinking around kindergarten. We need to know the specifics of why as you will.
    It would be nice to have a delay mechanism where before your post goes through – it comes back and you let it go through or not. A we are our own Sheriff idea. In grade school I had a teacher who brought in working phones to teach how to handle the telephone. I also had a record about safety Mr. Rogerish. We and the world do not yet have a template yet in place- hopefully it can be created soon.
    And nah the sheriff idea was that sarcastic humor? All I could think of was Bob Marley’s song.
    I will take a break and then comeback later.One never knows. A good faith effort can never ever be dismissed.

  • Eric, A good psychiatrist and or other professional in the system who has learned about childhood development, who has read SelmaFrau erg, DW Winnicott, who has read Jeanne Greenburg’s “I Never PrimisedYou. Rise [email protected] and “In this Sign” any of Judi Chamberlain’s writings or life stories,seen @ Splendor in the Grass and “The Snake Pit” and other theatrical and art based Humanities based classics would allow and actually be okay with anger. If course there is anger and there is anger. That’s why time outs work. It helps to create internal boundaries and the ability to self monitor and censor. At times we all need time outs and gain the skill of walking away when the anger is not helpful.
    But if a child does not get angry, does not challenge parents they will not become emotionally independent.
    So I think you asquience too much.
    We have been mistreated and we have the right to be angry and the responsibility to tell.
    How and in what way and what timeframe is still an issue on the table and this site.
    It takes an average of 30 years for an abuse victim to admit – many go to the grave in silence as well.
    WhenI was a professional in the system I consider anger a sign of awareness of something. And I tried hard to listen and support my clients – going so far as getting pro bono legal help even if a gaurdian ad litem was involved was at odds with the teen’s desires.
    And yes not all current professionals are evil but many are ignorant and or have been blindsided. And I would positvictims in a weird way as well.
    There is nothing wrong in agreeing to disagree. There is nothing wrong with owning the trauma that was imposed from the system.
    One wants to discuss from the experience not out of the experience.
    “Tell things slant” Emily Dickinson wrote. A step away.
    I have never found your comments deragatiry to me when I read as a former professional. And right on target when I wear the survivor hat.
    MIA has been slanting in a way I am not sure. Topsy turvey and ah so much going on and the waters are troubled everywhere it seems.
    Continue to wade in the waters unapologetically – we all need to remember just wade in sideways!
    And professionals should be okay with anger but it creates riptides then they have a right to have their own anger moment and own how they handle it.

  • I would have liked to see the commentary from the survey shown perhaps without names used.
    My thoughts are several. Maybe the voices of each movement need their own website or stream. We as survivors should not be beholden to anyone even friendly and supportive professionals of all stripes. True empowerment would mean a global based site with voices of those that have been in country.
    However this should not preclude interaction – which various streams with bridges for dialogue and debate.
    There also needs to be voices of professionals who have been in country after years in the system and also one for those in the system who came from the system. I am not sure how the Abolitionists worked out the slave voice Harriet Tubman, Sijourner Truth andmany others who spoke or wrote accounts, versus the priveleged but awoke white make voice and those white males not as priveledged as in President Lincoln , with Lucy Stone and the Seneca Falls Convention white females who realized Woah we have some common ground here.And the whole Disability movement in the late 1950’s into the 1960’s. Initially started as a parents group and then growth not a mirror image of NAMI why?
    Model U.N. programs teach debate somewhat elitist but so essential to these times. We all need to think and research and dialogue facts not just react. This is a hard burden for survivors because not only do we have righteous anger we also are in a recovery ladder sometimes greased by us ir sometimes Inswaer poured in by others who do not want us to be heard.
    All vets are survivors. That does not preclude official office or government work. Why those and not others?
    Fred Freese just died. A big friend of E Fuller Torrey. He was a survivor bought or played into the hands of those who used his life story and fo some reason he let them. Not sure why.
    The trouble with complete destruction is what to do with those in crisis? There will be more and more as the migrant crisis is not solved and even so with things as they are generations of new hopefully better help.
    There is a time for every thing. My question is what time is it now? And how can we all work together and in subgroups?
    One of my relatives was DD. Her parents would say she could do- normal- for so long and then start getting stressed. She had both DD life activities and “Normal.”
    That should be some sort of template.

  • Thanks Kindred for the poem reference. It is worth a read and maybe a mailing to professionals and government officials.
    Marian Wright Elderman if the Children’s Defense Fund has several books one with another poem.
    The first child abuse prosecuted was in NYC two centuries ago and they had to use an Animal Rights Law.
    There are so many threads here. The complete and utter lack of trading in Child Development to all or many professionals who work with children.
    Michael Harrington’s The Other America is also a must read though old.
    Jean Vanier and his L’Arche Communities not close to this but helpful to know about.
    Every child is unique and deserves not only a safe place at home and school but also the opportunity to thrive with environmental and economic equality.
    Read Octavia Butler’s bio. What she could have achieved with equal supports. And yes she was depressed but who eouldn’t be in society as she was asso many of us are or were?
    Sen. John McCain in the other side of politics for me did send the first National Geographic magazine that featured Climate Change to all members of Congress with another official.
    We need to do more of this.

  • Eric, I concur with Oldhead.As much asI would like to say it would help – no. But I really understand your need to write it.
    This did give me some fuel for possible future actions and or areas to research.
    Back in the day while Maryland was in the process of deinstutilization of both MH and DD institutions – and apologies for the MH label – there was a NFP MAUDD that had a Social Worker and JD that took on folks to help them st least get out from the institution. More DD but it is a sort of template.
    I don’t know what other templates and tools and techniques were used during those days.
    It seems as if the need for self critical analysis of psychiatry and the MH system was never try put in place.
    Most organizations and the government have red teams, the RC used to have a Devil’s Advocate, and in medical circles they had Tumor Boards and would convene a critical response team when things went down and or south.
    In Maryland,folks were arbitrarially places in either instituiyoon sometimes with out regard of strengths and or weaknesses.
    If one reads Probate Court papers folks were just forcibly placed after a petition to Court was made.
    Again, I am not sure how and why it was stopped but it seems Mental Health checks called into police have filled that gap as well as the power of professionals without regard to the rights of the folks threatened with psychiatric incarceration. Likewise there is no method or framework to either self advocate or have any other official or no official person advocate for you.
    Part of the problem is the literal well metaphorical wall between impatient and outpatient professionals. This makes the impatient folks so much more lethal in their power. I never understood the lack of communication but maybe fear on the clinicians because they too are one step away from someone calling the state liscencing board and causing financial distress and loss of business.
    In my locale – a former CEO of a Center was foricibly removed from a town hall about the county system because he disagreed with the current administrations handling of the system.
    There are groups other than our friend NAMI but more in the DD or physically disabled communities.
    In the DD communities if one has been petioles to have guardianship over one’s self there at least in the past was a full throttle legal advocacy for the person being considered for a guardianship. Just because one had a very low IQ and the family who were fairly pro self advocacy but were concerned about safety in the system- even in that type of situation a legal hearing was usually held full throttle.
    What is the legal difference between guardianship and AOT?
    Why can’t there be some sort of mutually agreeable compromise and or tool?
    Are there time limits?
    And if not – why not?
    How can one put in the latest research and st least get professionals and others to do a critical anaylisid of all relevant information?
    Why don’t o those involved in this cause accept pro bono status?
    According too the ABA -all lawyers in the association are required to set aside yearly pro
    bono hours.
    What turned the tide in the past?
    Can we make an Allie movement like in the LBGQT movement?
    What about Bryon Stephonson and his work?
    Can some of these actions be considered hate crimes?
    If UN declares torture? How does one use its strength?
    Are there any Law Schools that actually identify this as a cause and if not? Why?
    One does not have to agree with all things antipsychotic to see a human being had the right if nothing else to voice and advocate of their beliefs- hands down
    Guardian ad Litem work? I actually got pro bono stormiest to work on behalf of my teen clients when they disagreed with the guardian ad litem’s plan. It had nothing to do with what I thought was best but EVERYONE deserves to be heard and given appropriate consideration to their views, wants, and desires.
    Mycenter did have a complaint system and some of my clients used it on me. I gave them the names and numbers to call. They were angry and whether I was wrong. or right I felt they needed to be heard.
    I hope some how this rambling helps. Good luck.

  • Shaun As a former professional in tbe system I know the process of seeing and then acting on all this new information is not the easiest. You need to read all the histories of otherness and start thinking beyond
    A stand alone trauma center open 24/7 with alternatives and ohg free services or low cost would be so helpful. The rural and urban areas are shut out except for some 12 step programs and their are entire counties without any.
    The other idea is what is the basis of altered stars? Def from drugs but also in First Nation cultures and others altered states are induced. To this day I am not sure how much drugs and then my spiritual/ artistic/Empath makeup was part and or parcel.
    Trauma and some is severe and what to do after you have seen genocide?
    Getting the dx off would be a great way to make amends and help psych survirs or whatever tripe of human label one uses
    This has been the worst for me.
    Despite my past professional record I still have the dx in the records. And attorney help no tried that in various ways- THEY DONT WANT TO HELP
    Say a certain phrase and you have turned to nothing literally nothing in their eyes.

  • Hi Emily, I read your posting and thanks. I know exactly what your are talking about though for me the vocabulary would be different.
    I think you described the before and after body and mind sense and how one cannot truly forget and move on. And the need for folks and institutions to accept responsibility and atone and amend. It will never be what we want but a ritual a removing of label and truth telling.
    The word trauma fits for me because it is everywhere and eventually affects all of us though many wear masks and or deny.
    And life is not fair. Much more not fair for many. I am always aware if I had not hand luck and upper middle class ( though ah we were the family that read poetry,
    read de Chardin, and listened to Bo Didley and Harry Belefonte, had contact with other cultures so looking back we were probably considered weird in my town)
    If not for that random luck I would have been dead years ago. No doubt in my mind.
    Tillie Olsen wrote a lovely book called Silences and it is old but still worth getting your hands on it.
    Joanne Greenburg’s life and work are worth reading
    Audre Lorde yes, her too.
    So many have been victims on our earth so very very many. I try to learn about that ones who continued.
    Maybe no nouns just adjectives like Susan B Anthony suggested?

  • Emily
    Thanks for the reply. That is vital to building community. Victim yes but one needs to know there are other roles- POWS are not POWS forever they were prisoners , the Japanese Americans in interment camps eventually got out. We the living owe the others a voice and enemy lingers in the victim identity- issues. Maybe a new name ? Once the border crisis is over what role name will we give tbe children? I could go on and on.
    What does give me hope is Emma Lazarus. She was not only a poet but a Social Worker in the tentements of New York City.
    She developed cancer. In those days cancer was not treated in tbe hospital – stigma and all that. Her frien Tose Hawthorne Nathaniel Hawthorne’s daughter took care of her. After Emma died Rose became a nun and started a freeHospice program for terminally ill cancer patients.
    Society and medicine eventually changed so that cancer was not considered an anethema.
    Steven Biko died but his voice helped dismantle. apartheid.
    The abolitionist and suffergette movements wow centuries ?
    And btw an underground railway or Martha transportation line would be great baring that letter writing. I feel the safest with that.

  • Emily, I have appreciated your words and wish. you the best of luck? Why not Canada with Bonnie? And why go into academia when tenure is still such a ongoing problem?
    I have seen multiple sides of the MH system and find it now totally broken. Apartheid in some ways.
    In the past there were some as I was awoke professionals but we were still blind to slot of the abuses. As in any tyrannical government state there are good people. So often and so tragically it is sheer luck that one bumps into them.
    If you have not been forced hospitalized or pushed into an ER visit which usually ends in being escorted in a wheelchair with security you truly cannot begin to comprehend the experience. Or waking up in a seclusion room with no one telling you how it happened or why and with s nurses aid saying they are putting you into a nursing home.
    But kudus for trying to understand at least admit that some things will be forever beyond your kien. We will not hold that against you as mother mostly do not hold females who choose to not have children against them at least I do. Differences and heterogeneity are important and vital for growth.
    Saul Alinsky was aware of this.
    I looked st the survey and no. Been there done that – even enrolled in a NIMH before I rewoke. Not the best way to make change though ah it is alluring. The psychiatrist at Boring old man website -despite his elitism – was the best at debunking the ghost written research.
    As to your musical metaphor. In my area we have The Gathering Place that caters to anyone touched by cancer. No docs no dx anyone – whether you choose to have treatment or not – free services to all
    Mixing at times of most yoga and other classes and events. You are just you without a label of patient or caretaker or partner – whatever. I think it is a lovely model.
    I wrote up a replication in terms of trauma and sent it to the Board and the orgininatir of that program was on the board. She knew me and at least some of my cancer ties. Nada nada nada.
    This model would have by passed the medication and labeling issues for all. It removed them from the playing field. My guess is too scary. NAMI is so big in my area and I have been hounded.
    Giving free Reiki at a church with a NMA I group they had to come and give me their speil Mentsl Illness is like Diabetes. Nice folk but so ignorant and so very very uninformed. I know folks with Diabetes on a personal and once professional level. Not a good connection. In fact there was once a teen who wanted to stop her insulin the medical staff let her do it. Eventually she changed her mind but when I was in my seclusion rooms I thought of her freedom of choice often
    One complaint and this is for Dteve when a comment is removed the writer should get an explanation. It also would be helpful to track the why if it wafting a trigger and how to handle readings that can induce anger.
    An angry response place that can be put on hold and then renegotiated or voluntarily removed after 24 hours.
    Good luck in life.

  • The comments are an interesting reaction to efforts that should have happened decades ago.
    Does anyone know how the Nuremberg Trials were created and who and how witnesses were used?
    Elie Wiesel struggled with the concept of forgiveness for the rest of his life. Again I would look on how others handled restitution and reclaimization. The history is not that great. Intially, freed slaves were promised a small amount of land and money. But somehow it fell through the cracks. The First Nation folks are still dealing with multiple issues of health and sociology- economic status. South Africa did do a Commission but it will take decades to work it all out. The Japanese American containment – proper word? camps just had a SCOTUS long delayed moment.
    So much of human history and now we are so aware of it but instead of using it as a bell toll do many of us continue to hide our head in the sand.
    So many psych survivors myself included and horrirific experiences and done in isolation ie How do you tell close or extended relatives or say children I was put in seclusion and chemically raped. For no good reason other than I was more knowledgeable than staff and was uppity.
    So I think the psych survivor skinf to the sexual abuse folks have another layer of absolute isolation and for the psych survivor we are labeled and in that labeling our entire power our entire ability to fight back had been completely taken away.
    There are the folks on the unit but as mentioned in Eric’s writing you don’t see the folks outside.
    It’s multi layered and deserves an almost separate Nuremberg type trial or Truth and Reconcilliation Committee.

  • Chris – it has taken awhile to comment because now I find your use of the b word triggering. But that is my issue at this time not yours at this time.
    In the past in my journey, I did try to embrace the whole label role. Actually in NAMI money donation literature they suggest you use your label while asking for donations. In an act of protest I choose to use the s word. Because I knew it had negative connotations in the community and just to show what embracing the label could do in a community.
    My letter donation campaign resulted in police calls to my house. No ever came up to ask me what my story was.
    So I literally shot myself in the proverbial foot by following in pa resistant way NAMI ‘s advice.
    Prior to this my child’s soccer coach had relayed once finding I was a LISW that his brother was a s and had issues also another writer friend needed help with a relative who needed some help who was also labeled s. To their credit they were not dismissive but genuially confused and now that I know so much about the survivor movement I wish I could do a do over spend get them both connected to this site and other groups. I know they would not only listen but learn.
    At one of my CUEs before I quit the profession the presenter basically dissed the entire DSM process and said they gather in a basement and hold up their hands for options. And this was for the DSM III R.
    If you want t embrace the bi concept – whatever works- however you are on the journey and this may or may not be the last stop for you.
    I look to nature and science.
    And it shows many diverse patterns beside the binary system. Artists also talk about the four season cycle- so maybe one can call themselves a quad?
    Prosody in Poetry has all sorts of patterns- one could use as a snapshot or label. Today I am a trochee. Tomorrow or next year I will be an iambic pentameter.
    Fractals! Maybe some of us are fractal people?
    Humans for better or worse have always exhibited a need for classification. The Caste System in India is ancient.
    We also have both expressed and nonexpressedneeds for community.
    One time s relative who had a DD child said, he could be in society but stress symptoms would start and back in another more DDish community the stress symptoms would disappear or be less.
    One needs to live in multiple communities and how do we manage that? How do we talk to one another?
    And add to that Trauma and Yikes everything becomes more confused and harder to find solutions.
    The Irish still talk of The Battle of the Boyne and Oliver Cromwell and it’s is centuries! And Armenians still cope with the trauma of their own genocide over a centryry ago. And African Americans still deal with the memory of The Midfle Passage.
    Some of us carry remnants of the Neanderthals in our biological make up. What happened to an entire once thriving species?
    After a war and most wars eventually end even the 100 years war ended there is always the next morning and people have to live with each other. I try to remember that though so easy to forget.
    What do we say to each other in the morning after a war?
    How has it be done in the past?
    What happens to language?
    What happens to memory?
    What happens to art?
    As angry as I can sometimes get and rightfully so I don’t want to have to deal with an involvement of an atrocity.
    But then again there was a movement against Hitler?
    What happened to its survivors?
    And when one dismantles – how does one rebuild?
    And what about the cornerstone or keystone in a foundation of s building? If it is damaged or rotten what is done?
    More questions than answers here,

  • Thanks Knowledge. I found thee work at times very problematic. Drugs were used with kids in hospitals who were sick enough to need nursing care but to old and rambucious to handle on weekends in the floor units.
    And that was way back.
    The prof organizations need to be woken up somehow.
    BTW
    Dr Julious Richmond Surgeon General began the talk of stopping homosexuality as a sx and issues with smoking. It just takes one strong bearable voice and then the cracks start to open.

  • Julie, I am glad you wrote this and I like the discussion going on. I hear she is a good writer but I have my own particular issue with her separate from most of the discussion. I have read the other books from Kay to Andrew to Ellyn. Each has their strengths and weaknesses. And Their is the ethical debate that has never risen to any type of solution about client stories and this goes for all sorts of books especially like Mary Piper and her “Raising Ophelia” book. That should be an entire blog and more because with bestseller earnings without those human interest narratives where would the book be? Like Plantation owners where would they be without slave labor?
    One of those things that even when a book’s ideas are good and it is well written there is the reader unease but look at Eugene O’Neil and “ Long Days Journey Into Night” he used his family and his mother’s addiction to morphine – so similar to the opioid crisis now only you don’t live addicted you eventually OD and possibly die. So there is the issue of art and human suffering how to protray? And how else to get an urgent message across?
    Tony Kushner’s “ Angels in America “ and the other works of art that the AIDS crisis brought out were essential in turning the tide that and the forgotten AIDS quilt. So there is that fragment side of the discussion as well.
    Trauma studies also complicate the picture and I still see in my local community people identifying with the diabetes analogy only wow you do have a great chance to become diabetic- how ironic is that?’
    And there in my family and others those that choose to use meds and get benefit. You can’t smash them and I despite my history refuse to be rigid about their choice to take – although some day I hope it will be seen like a tobacco issue. Until that time comes and unless there are varied and solid alternatives most folks have to struggle on their own.
    Since I once was a professional I also wanted to say back in the day
    Termination of treatment was the goal. I would say we are a team and my job is to put myself out of business. And there was one program I worked in that was as trauma focused as possible during the time and it was an enforced two year time period where the last six months was all about ending treatment.
    So at times the thinkingbwas there until it became incovient to the powers that be. And I think there was a knowing downplaying of all of that and highlighting the bio aspect and illness metaphor.
    The system already iffy became solidly rigged. There was no treatment as I had treated my own clients it was pure and simple incarceration.

  • Rachel I am not sure what one would call it. And there are still gaps in my understanding because there are walls of silence around that and other things.
    All I know is that I had this friend who was very influenced by Lauren Slater in graduate school. She and others staged this meeting where multiple where aware of what was going to go down. The worst aspect is a a liscenced Social Worker I would never do such a thing to someone and I had already had sought out support. They actually gave my mother a list of shrinks so the message was medication. Not support.
    The really strange layer and their were and still are many is that a relative was trying to withdraw from a med and I was supportive at the very same time.
    Other friends were going through their own family traumas and I didn’t want to burden them and those folks continued to have really really hard times. The best I could do was disengage but life has never been the same.
    My writing hopes were destroyed as were many years of my life.
    Kind of a psychological tar and feathering so to speak. Irish folks did that to women who had the sheer gall to fall in love with a Brit.
    I was just ready to change my life and not just stagnate. So much for that.

  • Thanks for this heads up. Despite the flaws of this approach there were some real insights gathered on trauma and or childhood.
    I think the biopsy history folks saw the cracks and used the fall to suit their own purposes.
    But this is important to everyone here and around the nation,
    We of all folks especially those who were incarcerated while being a parent know this scenario all to well.
    This issues and others no matter what your political thinking gives us some sort of a voice.
    In some reports the children and teens are being forced into chemical treatment. They are being taken to psych units where some think it will be better for them. Unless the centers are aware and woke it will not be better possibly with the chemicals worse.
    The Poor People’s Campaign is also s path,
    One can call or sign a petition.
    This also would be another opportunity to break down folks ignorance about our public fear if a person is safe to disclose.
    If nothing changed it will get worse for ALL of us.

  • Dear Julie,
    Thank you for this piece. I always wondered where Lauren Slater was and I was afraid she was one of those who would continue to drink the cool aid. I also enjoyed reading about your own journey away from drinking the cool aid.
    The journey you have taken and I as well was hard and st times still hard but with as much empathy and some writer’s envy as I have- I am so so glad I did not continue the way she has.
    And I do appreciate your empathy and realization in the past we were hoodwinked. And the painful aspect is it is s Hood one can only remove by one’s self. And sometimes for many and for many reasons the Hood is the only option seen and or given.
    Your writing hits a painful chord. Lauren came to a local college to speak and was a demigod to an old close friend.
    Because of her, (LaureSlater)my old friend and others did their own ignorant intervention when I told folks I was thinking on separating.About five people were involved including my husband albeit they pulled him in. The intervention went down badly for me and I suspect with hindsight them. I have never ever been the same. There was the me before and there is the me now. My mother was called and she was dealing with a disabled husband and a dying daughter and I was contacted. See a psychiatrist. Implied wax you need medication.
    The trauma of that month made me want to take meds because I felt so NOT ME anymore. And down the rabbit hole I fell.
    It took months for my husband to admit what they had done. He was a StageIII cancer survivor and my sisters terminal illness and his post treatment side affects really made him less than what he had been. We have been back and forth. He is more able to see his role and we have some what but not yet totally resolved our relationship.
    My dying sister never thought I was crazy- She knew the details. But they never asked her.
    So I have always felt Lauren Slater had for me and maybe others a weird non involved but influencer type of role in my life.
    She is like NAMI others in needsee her and those as pathways where in reality they are error prone as all humans.
    I am not surprised at how she is doing. And I am for sorry for that. I hope she can see the light some day.

  • Well if one looks into trauma – the ability to comprehend and analyze what a person is currently experiencing sometimes never can be done ie Vets in POW camps and such.Dr Henry Louis Gates program on family history highlights hidden stories of trauma- literally for safety and other reasons not able to be acknowledge.
    Back in the day in grad school threre was acknowledgement but so small. Michael Harrington’s book- “The Other America” is still seminal reading. The problem came to the fore with the downgrading and lack of funding for community centers and many folks WANTING to go into private practice. Both options proved to be toxic to ethical professionals. I totally dropped out.

  • Thanks. I as both a former professional and as a psych survivor can empathize. It was abuse and I would venture a form of torture. There were some places in the past that did try at helping. Fritz Redl’s work When We Deal with Children.
    America is great at wording respect for children but if you look st the history no. The first child welfare case used an animal cruelty law that was in place. That was during the era of the orphan train and lost children from immigrants or dead parents or parents with issues from the whole plethora of societal problems. In retrospect the orphan train seems a better idea- at least if it was abusive you could run away.
    And lost children. We have one in our family history. There is a marker in the cemetery – Our Willie.
    Kudos for keeping on. I did it backwards from you. I still struggle because the help actually was so harrowing it taught me access hate not only for the so called helpers but for myself as well. Some days are better than others.Forgiveness is a long process because to hold on to hate is ultimately destructive for yourself and others – lose/lose situation but hard because there is no formal ritual of restorative anything.
    Essentially a doctor/ pt role was a formal societal contract read Ormand’ work on medical authority
    Legally if a contract is broken or illused there is a pathway for recompense. Any first year law student with brains can riif on the law case about the man with the hairy arm.
    As such now like in Aparthied South Africa there are only walls with some cracks. And they still are mired with issues and will be for many decades.
    What is do hard is when you drop off a pet for boarding and the staff is more empathetic and uses feeling. Words about your pet than ANY inpatient staff at any and all levels.
    And outside profs are unable to get it. Nice folks but you have to be inside just as with pregnancy.
    You don’t and sometimes can’t know what you don’t know.
    I would go for the trauma center idea the system is broken beyond repair. And also more profs need to come out like yourself
    Police, politicians and tell truth to power. But again no safety net yet.
    And a movement to stop mental health checks
    Who ever thought that one up?
    Needs to spend some time in country.
    I still can’t do things because zI live in fear of those calls. One false step a word or a “strange” behavior and I am back to a place where NOBODY CARES as the Broadway show put it so well., The Me that Nobody Knows.
    Best
    Mary

  • I don’t know Oldhead. If you go back decades there was Ken Kersey and other artistic efforts that if not upsetting the applecart at least had a tint or shade of resistence.I have been amazed at how folks on the whole nine yards of the political spectrum have been actively blinded sided to the psychiatric system’s brokeness and abuses.
    Family Therapy was started by professionals in the system who saw there were big problems.
    They flourished for several years in various areas and now seem to have a very small voice and impact.
    So any help from inside the system is few and far between.
    The Roman Catholic Church in the fifties had social action cells that convened in different areas in the States. That would be one way. I don’t know how it worked just that once it did exist.
    I think the young folks might be the key. They just need to be mentored.They at least have a huge stake in the game.
    The hundredth monkey idea- if they could see as in the shootings there is a deep and more complex story as in gender. racism, and sexism- I think they could get behind the movement.

  • Thanks for this Sarah!
    I think you have encapsulated a part of human existence. I think it works for all folks and did help me to put some of my experiences into a more clarifying framework.
    This should be taught to students everywhere so that we can have an informed public.
    It seems we are as a country – a society- and world all in trauma mode. And not with one trauma but many overlapping the personal and public boundaries of family, work, region, culture, religion, gender – and on and on.
    I think trauma maybe the one universality that can pierce through the blinders of eye, heart, ears, and mind that we all either have chosen or have been forced to wear.
    I would think giving this to the movements besides ours would be invaluable.
    Keep up the work.

  • Dear Richard,
    Thanks for sharing your gift and talent.. I was always told to mouth the words when singing in class by the nuns. I did have one friend who allowed me to sing during a trip. It was joyful- so kudos for using your voice in a good cause.
    It reminds me of the old songs – from Joe Hill to Little Boxes – to Biko- to Whose Garden Was This and so many others. There should be a list. We need more songs and creative endeavors- may yours lead the way.
    I enjoy your thinking though I come from a slightly different perspective in terms of my life as it is was and who knows what is next.
    My ongoing concern seeding this from many many sides is the system is broken and has been but how to help everyone deal with life when there are the range of OMG and WTF issues that come up like flotsam in our lives and some issues are most definitely systemic and ah the current political wave we all are forced into riding willing or not.
    I also try hard not to lead forward in anger and resentment though I know my anger was justified by the awful so called treatment I received made worse because though I was in the system I tried very hard to be aware and help. Not sure if this approach ever worked despite my own best intentions. And I also know there are always some good apples in the bin the trohble is having the ability to find them admits so many bad ones. That takes time, money, luck and a modicum at the very least of societal privelege.
    If one does not know who what how to look for help and those answers are quashed then how can one ever triumph? The fact that people have and do is amazing to me.
    I would love to have restorative justice for the stems survivors some day. We may not be able to talk directly to the abusive charlatans who creased, maintained, treated us or others but some sort of legal, societal reckoning would be great.
    I also would imagine some of the professionals in system were somewhat harmed or compromised as well and there issue at the right time needs to be addressed some where along the spectrum.

  • Sandra— I like your comment on families. As I have evolved or de evolved hopefully evolved I think families are lied to and not in th the dark and support is at the very best woefully lacking.
    I think that I had a child visit in one of the hell holes and it was so oppressive I would consider it undersong torture and no “ helping professional” in sight.
    This was the one with the tv in a locked wooden crate and the IT room locked with no OT staff though filled with supplies when I made a fuss and they let us use the supplies one time.
    The system is broken for ALL except those in power who profit.
    They break families – break down good memories and insert trauma moments.
    Just think how it affects the family dog. If animal lovers were aware of how the “help” of inpatient treatment affects and damages the pets just the pets mind you- they would be up in AAarms against the secondary trauma endured by the pets who can’t figure out what has happened to their beloved owner.
    A visit to a doc and then ER time and the pet waits alone.

  • Thanks for all the talking points.
    What can we learn from South Africa,The Female vote, and Abolition of Slavery?
    Many of these movements were multinational and reguired strange bedfellows to get the actually work done. It took decades and several generations before some of the goals were accomplished
    Witness and bearing witness is such an important concept and role.
    The immigration crisis and massaive refugee global issues – all play a role here because of the trauma issue.
    Freedom House in Detroit caters to the needs of refugees who have experienced torture.
    Our community might help here.
    Have you ever met a refugee from a war torn and violent country. I just felt the absence of safety from them. It was clear they had been through a hell I never could fully imagine.
    And in some countries -others- of all kinds are in unsafe zones.
    So how to use history and how to expand a fishing net.
    I don’t have the answers – and my locale in some ways is hard.
    But we need to think on witness-trauma- and change or someday end the system as it is now.

  • Thanks Au for your time, effort, and thoughts. I have issues but you have created a great framework for discussion.
    In your community I am not sure where the issue of trauma lays.
    My one and only concern is how can we- will we deal with trauma and for it to work we need to address it at almost all societal levels
    I am coming from Caps for Sale approach to all of this as a worker and yes through my fault I did the dip in more babysitting than not work- I had no idea of what folks who were there were actually dealing with- then I have my time in MH system and then trying to live out of system but trauma issues are still present

    We need to be able to meet in a safe place and organize. One of the student groups against gun violence laid out shoes in front of the Capitol steps for each child victim of gun violence since Sandy Hook – it was a visual like the Aids Quilt
    And in a fully trauma aware world the shooters and other offenders of all ills would be at least understood to have some sort of trauma template in their lives.
    No excuse but to understand is better than hating and or stigmatizing.
    Keep up the work you all.

  • Dear Cal,
    Thank you for this. I am so very sorry that this has happened and is still happening. I had followed some of it but did not know it was still continuing.
    Thanks for the numbers to call.
    It helps to be able to use your voice and calling for me is doable.
    What else would you like the MIA and psych survivors to do?
    There has been a bad rift between the MH – no better word for now- apology for this- and the DD folks for a long time. The folks on the A spectrum seem to have been thrown in the midst and not in a helpful way at all at all.
    FYI- Some local and state government funding divides and separates funding. My local country does this with DD services getting much more than MH.Divide and Conquer indeed.
    In the old state hospital system where I zI had seen both but more involved with DD state systems – it was crumbling structures similar to Public Housing in one of the so called bad areas- and a pervasive sense of sadness. But nothing like this – though there were cottages I was not allowed to see.
    There was the beginnings of cololesence in the 70’s and with the advent of ADA.
    We all need to work together.

  • Thanks Julie ad Pam’s for your kind words.
    It helps to not be alone with this issue.
    And to have the dx label taken away.
    To have this step put in would be utterly invaluable.
    A was a for Social Worker and I was always aware of the power dynamics. I would say I am the pilot you are the navigator we work together as a team.
    To have mostly male docs treat me like dirt- to have them and most staff treat me worse and in ways I would never treat another human being in a professional capacity I still find shocking and the wounds to my self image, esteem,trust, hope are still open and the scars still not formed enough.
    To still be confused to the why and how come and what the hell did I do wrong questions is maddening no pun intended.
    The layers of trauma that put me in harms way and the trauma that was called treatment and then the lack of clarity is every day hard.
    And Julie to put salt on my wounds- I told folks I worked with that the only perfect human is a dead human. If I did something I would admit,take responsibility, and make some sort of amends.
    If I were to call CPS I would have the kid sit in and hear every word and then I would give them the scenario facts good and bad.
    This what should happen and this is what might happen. No guarantees because the system even way back was broken
    I would advise tell Again and again til someone hears you.
    Now I know in some cases no onehears you because iPod facto because of where you are in society you are basically s non human.
    All the professionals who are in support need to think long and hard on what to do.
    We have our voices but need a way to become hear able.
    Novels like Bonnie and art in all its form helps.
    There needs to be a way to remove dx labels and a forum for professionals to apologize – take responsibility and make some sort of amends.
    That this process is not legitimized in any areas of our society today shows how off course we are.

  • It was neat to see the support given to folks. Happy Birthdays to Bonnie and Julie and a very unbirthday wish to the rest.
    Sometimes I wonder if I was given ect superticiusly. My experience was so bizzare and I did get a hip fracture and do you trust the memories of those times? How much fog was real or not?
    I have interacted and failed so I go day by day.
    I am unable to find away to integrate my self before in system my self in system and my self outside system though every time a police car passed me by I inwardly and outwardly cringe because I was hauled off.
    I can ride or walk and give an historical trigger trauma life recount.
    Leaving is an option but where and when and what would constitute a safe place for me?
    The sum of my being is deer in the headlights frozen
    The risk of being hauled away with face mask and five point restraints and forcibly medicated is to strong to overcome.
    If there were pathways of acknowledgement of apology or amends it would help but no.
    Silence from written correspondence and the records I have obtained – many Un obtained are not helpful and just the fact second parties are used to copy them means another human being has seen my history without my permission.
    I don’t comment much anymore.
    Best to all.

  • Of course responsibility is very important. There used to be a professional therapist who worked exclusively with adolescents who had murdered a parent. She never advocated for them to be absolved if the murder but worked within the criminal justice system. If and when able and allowed she would take them to the parent’s grave site.
    She understood the seeds of trauma but also comprehended hate and severe aggression is intolerable in a functioning society.
    And we all have to acknowledge there is a very wide spectrum on how humans have distinct temperaments and how each of us copes with trauma.
    I just get upset with the nomenclature used to avoid responsibility of the powers that be who avoid responsibility with the use of the phrase “mentally ill”.

  • The latest news report I read and it is hard to even consider delving in-reports TRAUMA!
    He is an ORPHAN!
    The system failed him and all the ties that bind- the big Pharma playbook, the NRA change from times where assault rifles were not used or even thought about, the weapon industry – those who make money off of assault weapons, the Mental Health system which soon after deinstutionslization began to flounder because monies from the Federal government weren’t forthcoming and a divide and conquer mentality ran slipshod and wild fire over the disability movement especially seen between the DD and MH funding and publicity.
    Professionals in the helping fields became cogs in a more and more restrictive and push the pills work culture. Important information on Trauma was pushed and or erased so that the pills could or bogus therapies designed for submission could be used and touted.
    He in the eyes of the world was one of the EXPANDABLES.
    And he figured that one out.
    Until we all rise up
    Victims will be melded into Perps
    More people and children will die and ever so many people like in Thomas Grays “ Elegy in a Churchyard” will live lives at best of quiet desperation and those that had gifts unseen and unheard will never make their mark and help change the world.

  • Thanks Kat and I am sorry for you and all of us harmed by so called “helpers”.
    Although trauma has been known as an issue it has gotten trampled on time and time again. To acknowledge the extent of how trauma has impacted our society and most importantly how offenders in all professions have used heir radar sense to make malignant use of trauma to empower themselves and their minion is difficult. This is not just a psych issue- this is societal at many, many levels.
    Read the tactics used by rich offenders to stop the victims in their tracks.
    Not only Big Pharma but other for profit organizations – their tactics and toxicity. How can they ever sleep at night?
    Roxanne guy has a new memoir that is spot on describing trauma. Read it in pieces that fit. I found it helpful. Krista tipped On Being podcast deals with trauma at times and other areas that I have found helpful .Suppossedly there is a Holocaust Trauma Clinic? If so it should be a generalized one for psych trauma survivors paid for by Big Pharma instead of Advertising and PR the profit stream goes to these centers. And 20% of all psychiatrist’s income who have been named as a non- helpful traumatizing physicians – go to funding for a ten year period.
    Not great but I would take it.

  • Pia, This is in some ways a large can of worms but I think the time has come to talk and begin discussions. I have knowledge coming from multiple side of the issue from both a personal and professional stand point.
    US Primate Centers – PETA heavily protested these centers and found issues. At the same time, these centers worked on cutting edge AIDS research during the awful epidemic. Some primate centers have now been closed.
    Most medical researchers have used animals because they thought it was better than say the use of research on unknowing or uninformed human subjects. Look up Tuskegee Institute history of horror.
    The Nazis used concentration camp children for medical research look up the accounts of the survivors of the twin research.
    Read “Refuge” by Terry Tempest Williams and her account of the effects of nuclear testing on her extended family members.
    Check out the movie “Lorenzo’s Oil” a film version of a true account on how a father helped find a solution to his son’s genetic disease.
    The urge to find help, to find a cure, to find the proverbial bullet runs deep for family members.
    The urge to find better ways of fighting protecting the country runs deep in governments.
    The urge to find more profit, more money runs deeps in for profit and even nonfood profit systems and research is then used upside down.
    The focus is on how to keep people addicted and profit flow not only flowing but more and more.
    With chemicals used by agriculture the research is on how to increase profits no matter what the chemicals are doing to the biomes and ecosystems.
    Read Rachel Carson’s “Silent Spring”
    Even a so called simple product like infant formula can create issues because it is given to developing countries therefore allowing innocent infants a portal for cholera and other diseases where water is not abled to be boiled.
    At one time medical researchers were transplanting heads of animals on to dogs. True. Names withheld.
    I also am aware of medical researchers who are good decent folks and are aware of the need of families and patients who are facing life long medical problems and pain. They can be forced into silence when they become aware of ethical issues. NDL’s and gag orders and threat of professional obliteration. See some of the Hollywood movies that centered on doctors caught in research nightmares.
    For decades state institutions and schools for the disabled were the perfect place for research. Silence and lack of power perfect place to work.
    Abuse and those who participate in it are bullies and act like typical offenders.
    Whenever their is lack of truth, the push for profit over ethics, bullying of whistleblowers or potential whistleblowers, whenever there is the smell of stink coming from CEO’s CFO’s lavish lifestyles and perks given to professionals to keep them quiet or aid and abet the goal of the corporation, institute, or system ` unethical thinking, and justifying is looming and looms large.
    In the eighties the hospital I worked for pushed research on all departments. It was voluntary but not voluntary. We did research projects that we had no heart or interest in and the results were compromised but put in because of the pressure.
    Small beans, but that aura of culture kept growing and growing.
    Check out how rabbits were killed for pregnancy tests. Check out research done by cosmetic industries.
    Some folks would say PETA over steps but I think they need to be listened to and respected for their viewpoint just as families members and patients need for help need to be listened to and respected.
    Ethics needs not to be sidelined as a pain but as a full partner at the table of medical research.
    Think tanks funded by neutral funding resources with all concerned folks dialoguing.
    Doctors need to hear parents, researchers need to hear and see patients face to face, funders need to talk to all involved.
    Profit should be taken off of the table of consideration.
    Good things have happened with medicine and to her sciences but just because good things have happened or are happening in no one removes the ethical onus for all involved to use ethics as a guiding light so that shadows can disappear or kept to a bare minimum until animals are never used.
    The use of cadavers, dead embryos, all need a long and deep conversation.
    We not fear dialogue and strong feelings and tiring thinking. We just need to do it and move on to a better way of acting and creating helpful information.
    As you can tell, the arts also need to be pulled in. There are great television episodes, novels, movies, plays, folktales that can provide perspective and guidance.
    An Ethics Profession using all of this could help.
    There are some and those who work or work in hospitals know about Tumor Boards and meetings trying to figure out what happened to a medical nightmares. The Ethical Review Boards that really are more show than anything else because they are considered dangerous and or superfluous.
    We are all humans, imperfect beings at best.
    We all need to listen to our better angels in every way. There will aways be issues, the having to take the better choice versus the best choice.
    But as long as that choice was well considered and worried on that is okay.The concept of trying is the true golden rule. We cannot ask anymore. Good and true caring ethical human effort.