Monday, November 20, 2017

Comments by _Anonymous

Showing 67 of 67 comments.

  • Good advice Diana. We need to get out there and make the case for bodily ownership equality. People with psychiatric labels deserve to own their own bodies just like the unlabeled do.

  • ” The soldiers rejoiced in relief at being able to confidently say that the mood states they were in, depression, anxiety, etc., were not”

    I don’t think a CAT scan proves that at all. They are also still veterans. Their ‘combat fatigue’ could just as easily, is probably just environmental like that of their comrades. Especially considering the implausibility of their brain injuries damaging no objective bodily system, they can still walk, talk, eat, etc, but their injury is alleged to ’cause’ identical life problems as that of their non brain injured fellow combatants? Forgive the dysphagia analogy but that is hard to swallow.

    You use the word ‘function’ a lot, the ‘functioning’ of a human being in a mass society is just life, sometimes it is hard sometimes it is easy. Approaching it from a machine-like angle, as if ‘reality’ is some objective stone cold fact, an indicator of health as clear as a beating or dead heart, is IMO not the ideal way of looking at it.

    And it is not that ‘science is in its infancy’. Science isn’t an appropriate tool for for these problems. Looking to false experts on states of mind that the experts haven’t even experienced, is folly IMO.

    It isn’t the tranquilizer drugging on its own that ‘changes reality back to’ your previously preferred way of making your way in the world, there are many other factors you may be forgetting, the passing of time, the place of asylum and the concern of others, the persuasion society’s response to your state of mind engendered in you concurrent with the period of drugging, yet you attribute it all to the drugging. Don’t discount your own role in stepping back from the abyss. This was your reality for a while, this was a part of your life, I know some people get very, very, fearful of it, my position is that the more you see yourself as the ‘passive victim of an active disease’ (Rufus May), the more fearful people are, and the less self mastery and acknowledgement of the degree of their own control over their lives over their entire lifespan they will take responsibility for. Some weeks less control than others, but always, some control.

    How many generations have lived and died waiting for ‘psychiatric science’ breakthroughs that never come? I refuse to be a helpless victim waiting for the technics and ‘expertise’ of others to master my own mind for me. I mastered my mind. I achieved a solidity to my way of making my way in the world and I will retain it. Everything past has made my mind stronger.

  • http://behavenet.com/communication-deviance

    I had to look it up too, which means it is obscure garbage from the 1970s that rarely comes up internet-wide.

    It’s just a label slapped on the difficult family relationships with parents common amongst troubled people.

    The word magic and neologisms developed by the class of ‘experts on states of mind they’ve never experienced themselves’ never ceases to amaze.

    Because simply noting that a lot of people forced into the mental patient role have troubled relationships with their parents, would sound, God forbid, unscientific. So they build walls of crap, sand castles of phrases like ‘communication deviance’ to augment the childish chemistry sets they like to play with.

    Our owners and definers are very immature.

  • Thank you Francesca. I like your posts too. Together we all continue the fight for bodily ownership equality.

    *That’s my new phrase. It’s mean to roll off the tongue as easily as marriage equality does.

    I am still working on it.

    Others include bodily integrity equality, medical consent rights equality, consent refusal equality…. etc.

    Still market testing it.

  • Jonah I concur with your analysis. The inferential leap from head banging to brain disease is about the speed we have come to expect in this corner of MIA. Personally I’ve started to find it vulgar and crass when people attempt to show their ‘crazy anecdote’ chops. As in, he banged his head on the wall.

    Elsewhere the author has said:

    “With regard to all they need is support, people who are acutely schizophrenic usually don’t pay any attention to you, however, supportive you are. They are too distracted by the internal stimuli.”

    I draw everybody’s attention, now and forever to the minimizing language deployed by all biological psychiatry explainers, who when faced with common sense or non biological explanations of madness cannot resist resorting to words like ‘just’, ‘only’, ‘all’, as in ‘you can’t be serious these people are merely, just, only, all they are is, all they need is, are just overwhelmed in life, are just going through a crisis, are just thinking differently to us, are just confused, are just….’

    Whatever the interpretation proffered by the nonbiological claimant, it will never be enough for the brain blamers who lust to reduce humankind to molecules. It will sound ludicrous to the brain disease blamer to offer nonbiological interpretations of ‘crazy thoughts and crazy behavior’. It is just beyond credulity to them, for someone else to suggest that anyone could ever, anywhere on earth, in the history of man, ever, ever, believe strange things (delusions), or do strange things, without them being walking brain diseases. So every critic of the medical model should get used to hearing the ‘just’, ‘all’, etc minimizing language, as the author uses when she says:

    “With regard to all they need is support, people who are acutely schizophrenic usually don’t pay any attention to you, however, supportive you are. They are too distracted by the internal stimuli.”

    Feminists have a term called mansplaining:

    A term which Urban Dictionary defines as:

    “delighting in condescending, inaccurate explanations delivered with rock solid confidence of rightness and that slimy certainty that of course he is right, because he is the man in this conversation.

    I posit a new term, psychsplaining where a masters degree in biology gives you the right to declare the content of my consciousness to be “internal stimuli”, as though my beliefs, my thoughts and my feelings are analogous to a case of jock itch.

    Of course with ‘psychsplaining’ nobody’s biology need be examined on the ground, not least the gentlemen in the ‘crazy behavior anecdotes’ of head banging. A wheelbarrow filled with unreplicated biological studies poured over the situation liberally, will suffice.

    As with all of psychiatry, if bio-bio-bio talk is repeated often enough, if studies are cut and pasted enough, the hope is nobody will notice that today, just as in Bleuler’s time 100 years ago, the “diagnosis” of the “biological disease” of “being crazy” is made by someone seeing someone banging their head and pointing a finger at them, and unilaterally declaring something has “gone awry” with their brains.

    Detainees who won’t speak to you when you are employed as their jailer, are assumed to be incapable of paying attention to you. Detainees for whom life has become very overwhelming become the allegedly powerless vessels of “internal stimuli”.

    The psychsplaining of our never-examined dopaminergic systems aside, I see nothing much to see here.

  • The existence of a world full of people who would use the following sentence “has implications for understanding social exclusion of individuals with the disorder.” has implications for understanding the social exclusion of individuals labeled out of order by people who believe labeling people out of order is a worthwhile thing to do. I think every sentence that ends with “individuals with the disorder” is a sentence that ends abnormally.

  • The people in society who have the most motivation and reason to eat well, exercise, etc, are the people who have full equality and are not a hated, tortured minority living in a world where there are laws that legalize them being rounded up and treated like animals.

    I will also note, as I do whenever I see studies that draw upon the Nordic data, that the people that make up the data points in the study, are people involuntarily labeled Schizophrenic or Bipolar by government psychiatrists by force, in forced detentions in a ‘hospital’. If you get locked up and labeled in the Nordic countries, a few alleged ‘facts’ about you, such as the label slapped on you in an environment where you were denied a second opinion, could wind up in a study like this, and you will have no say in the matter. At root, these studies would not possible if consent was respected.

    The study is based on recorded cause of death on birth certificate, and recorded label slapped on the detainee during their internment in a Nordic forced psychiatry facility. That is it. No surveys were done for this study of specific lifestyle factors, the conclusions of other studies in this regard were simply mentioned.

    Useful only in proving psychiatry isn’t improving outcomes. Useless in every other regard.

  • Doctors,

    Or, people who believe they are doctors, addicted to the word clinical, who believe any human activity, even talking, can be labeled a treatment, who believe they are bona fide medical people working with people they label patients.

    The fact that common sense has to be telegraphed, signaled through the pseudoscience and laughably over-earnest formality of the people who actually believe putting the word clinical in every sentence they type turns them into real doctors.

  • The whole belief system in regard to the brain blaming cult is facile, and this debate about beliefs that get labeled ‘delusional’ as being beliefs that shrink the brain, is infantile.

    The people who believe this, are essentially saying that believing you are Jesus Christ, or believing that the CIA is out to get you, literally shrinks your brain. Literally damages your brain, to believe things the majority labels false beliefs.

    People who make claims that one particular thought is literally toxic to the brain, are not serious thinkers. And while I am not foolish enough to claim that people who believe in psychiatry’s stories are harming their own brains by believing in them, they are harming society.

  • The whole belief system in regard to the brain blaming cult is facile, and this debate about beliefs that get labeled ‘delusional’ as being beliefs that shrink the brain, is infantile.

    The people who believe this, are essentially saying that believing you are Jesus Christ, or believing that the CIA is out to get you, literally shrinks your brain. Literally damages your brain, to believe things the majority labels false beliefs.

    People who make claims that one particular thought is literally toxic to the brain, are not serious thinkers.

  • I don’t have a problem with something being horribly “gone awry” with regard to schizophrenia, although people are only guessing on what it could be. I would not make this case for depression and anxiety-which I regard as just part of being alive.

    You are just displaying you have already jumped to the conclusion that the brain is diseased, forget the fact you can’t prove it. You’re not making a case at all! You have a bias toward biological explanations for head wall banging, and labeling the lesser psychiatric labels just part of life. “which I regard as just part of being alive”…. so if an experience hasn’t been a part of your life, it is a brain disease then?

  • Cocaine and amphetamines which increase levels of dopamine in the Nucleus Accumbens reliably cause psychotic symptoms, as anyone who works in emergency rooms knows.

    Illicit drug stimulants are ASSOCIATED, correlated with extreme states of excitement etc that get labeled ‘psychosis’. A causal chain from molecule in drug to behavior labeled ‘psychotic’ has not been established, hence the appeal to ‘obvious to pole who’ve worked in ER’, appeal to ‘obviousness’. People who feel extremely stimulated sometimes go on to feel grandiose. Your alleged complete biological explanation for these states of mind just isn’t a full explanation at all.

    Your understanding the states of mind that get labeled ‘negative symptoms’ of ‘Schizophrenia’ and its relation to Ketamine is outrageously unsupported.

    “too much dopamine signaling.”

    If every post on this site even remotely approached the level of ridiculous biological speculation in this post I would not be here.

  • I think you do a good job of capturing why I want to vomit or worse, when I see what positivism is doing to our lives. Only a world where the majority feel disgust at the way mainstream research objectifies us and our fellow humans and our lives and our worth and our inherent dignity, can be safe from atrocities. In the current situation where people are just fine with viewing ‘problem people’ as objects, it is not a matter of will the next holocaust happen, but when. It may well be a neuro-holocaust.

    I think of all of it, the biggest canary in the coalmine, is the access parents give psychiatry to their own children’s bloodstreams, without a second thought. That might even be a more significant coalmine canary than even forced psychiatry.

    A modern home is filled with iPads and kids. Each of these objects is just awaiting a technological innovation and can be better than ever…. the mindset goes.

  • Exactly. Who could be against a Chaplain working on death row? He’s not putting needles into anyone. Same goes for the debate around government forced brain drugging.

    In fact I like the idea, a chaplain comes by to pray and offer words of solidarity with the condemned, right before the psych nurse goons come in and perform the take-down and forced injection of consciousness altering drugs.

  • Vermont not Virginia. Who cares. The so called ‘argument from medical emergency’ justification is invalid no matter what jurisdiction it is being made in. This is the 21st century. We are supposed to have certain inalienable rights. Brain freedom, bodily ownership equality, is the battleground in every state.

  • And I will say I agree with Jonah, anyone who has chosen to accept a role in government forced brain tinkering against strangers, is likely to be someone who does both some good and some harm. The good can be impressive, working within such a mangled system with very few ways to innovate, shows if nothing else a desire to help. The red lines crossed by forced brain entering are so profoundly extreme, they are the nuclear weapon or chemical weapon of bioethics, in my opinion that in being a forced psychiatry worker, one would always be in a situation of one step forward two steps back morally and ethically, and then some months three step forward, one step back, some months some other combination of steps, very uneven, very hard to gauge, creating some thankful fans out there, and some people who wish you were put in prison. It is a position I’d never want to be in. Which is why I don’t chose to put myself in it. It’s clear we have a long way to go before the ‘brains of mental patients’ get the same human rights protections as the brains of the people who forcibly enter the brains of ‘mental patients’.

    I guess it all comes down to what your brain is filled with:

    If your brain is:

    a) Filled with ‘facts’, knowledge, skills, authority, expertise, you get to keep your brain.

    If your brain is:

    b) Accused of being diseased/out of order, you lose the right to own your brain, or live under threat of being rounded up and brain altered, kidnapped from your home, sentenced in Kangaroo courts to long term brain alteration etc.

  • Let’s not forget also that forced psychiatric drugging depends on all of these:

    1. The decision maker on whether to enter bodies by force is a psychiatrist. Psychiatrists seem to have very unique beliefs about the human body that they can’t prove.
    2. The psychiatrist’s ‘expertise’ is what declares the citizen ‘dangerous’.
    3. The body being forcibly entered is orbiting around psychiatry’s endless 200 year propaganda campaign about something being wrong with the body of the designated ‘mental patient’.
    4. The obvious scapegoating and wagon-hitching to famous ‘dangerous mental patients’ that goes on. If lay public hear a psychiatrist say ‘oh we only do that to the DANGEROUS ones. Implicit in this is that forced emergency drugging is justified, deserved, proportionate to the danger the citizen poses.
    5. If they did it to you, it ‘must have’ been an emergency. It is a rare part of my job, happens ‘occasionally’, but so integral to it, that I cannot switch to only working with voluntary patients. etc etc etc.
    6. The citizen’s tax dollars purchasing handcuffs for cops, guns, tasers, leg irons, fortified rear seats of police vehicles, prisons, jails, prison vans, for the proven dangerous people in the world, should have added to it, syringes and psychiatric drugs, for people declared dangerous by fiat behind closed doors, by biological psychiatrists who believe in brain diseases nobody can prove exist.
    7. If frontal lobe neurotransmission alteration is such an acceptable form of social control, let’s see how it fares out in the light of day and not hidden behind closed doors. Let’s change the whole TV show ‘Cops’, to repeated scenes of cops stabbing syringes into drug dealer suspects, and watching them become limp drooling chemically lobotomized zombies. If it is an acceptable form of social control, lets have teachers arm their classrooms with syringes full of neuroleptics to tranquilize unruly kids that hit other kids. Instead of boxing matches, we could have two burly guys face each other in the ring, first to inject the other wins. And the crowd cheers.

    Only when all forced drugging perpetrators face the inherent affront to human dignity that is controlling other human beings by entering their brains by force, will they repent. Only when decoupled from the false authority of ‘hospitals’ and ‘doctors’ and ‘nurses’ does the cold, grisly reality of what forced drugging is, come into focus. This is the wholesale biological domination, of human beings’ living conscious brains, by others, and a moral atrocity of the highest order on par with involuntary labor relations and involuntary sexual relations. It’s framing as ‘the only thing we could do in an emergent situation’ is profoundly offensive and does not stand up to scrutiny. That is why this practice happens behind closed doors, under lock and key of medical privacy, stigma, and public reassurances of justification from officially state empowered psychiatrists as we have seen here.

  • I understand that the dangerousness criteria are problematic since it often relies on future predictions and we know we are not good at making those predictions.

    This is not the point. Even if you had a time machine and could stop Hitler, entering his body by force would still be a human rights abuse. It’s an accusation, too, not merely a criteria. It’s a government accusation that a citizen is a dangerous citizen. It happens behind closed doors with no court hearing, and the penalty is higher than even a supermax prison, prisons which, incidentally, control the most violent offenders in society using procedures, rooms, shackles and bars. Not with needles.

    The point is, the leading cause of provocation to outrage in an emergency room setting is being forced to interact with your profession against people’s will. This outrage then leads to members of your profession labeling the person dangerous, and we all know it is a fait accompli apparently, that ‘dangerous’ people should lose the right to own the inside of their brains. The fact of the matter is no matter the ‘dangerous’ actions of an ’emergency room’s’ spontaneous prisoner, (they are supposed to be happy about this and keep their cool apparently), the most dangerous actions to humanity taking place in an emergency room are forced drugging. It is an escalation of violence, and an act of violence. An act of hate toward the ‘mental patient’ declared human body. It is declaring that an individual’s consciousness, their inner world, has no right to exist. Therefore it snuffed out.

    It is not hypocritical to condemn those who choose to work in forced psychiatry. Working in forced psychiatry is always a choice. There are people I know who choose to work in only voluntary psychiatry and I have limitless respect for them just solely on this ethical fact.

    In VT, a person can be held in a hospital but this does not allow the hospital to forcibly drug the person unless there is an emergency

    It is not a ‘hospital’ forcibly drugging humans to control them, it is people. People who choose to accept this as an acceptable part of their job, people who see no red line being crossed when brains are altered by force.

  • In VT, a person can be held in a hospital but this does not allow the hospital to forcibly drug the person unless there is an emergency in which the person is considered to be a danger to himself or others in that instance.

    If the person empowered by the government says it is an emergency, than it is an emergency?. There is no excuse for entering bodies. Police have been able to arrest unarmed people without shooting bullets or drugs into their bodies for centuries. There is no reason why people should have their behavior declared a ‘medical emergency’ and then have their bodies entered, their consciousness deleted by forced drugging. In labeling someone’s conduct a bodily ownership forfeiting ’emergency’, or in engaging in the emergencization, of the situation, psychiatry piggy backs on the public’s understanding of real medical emergencies, such as people being in cardiac arrest, and therefore whitewashes the reality of forced drugging. The situation of government empowered agents, and it is the government forced psychiatry legislation that gives you your power, declaring things an ’emergency’, behind closed doors, under cover of both stigma and medical privacy, and then ‘going in’ to the body, is pretty much the same in the majority of jurisdictions. The declaring of a situation an ’emergency’ is subject to no checks and balances, the person has no right of appeal, it is essentially one of the most discriminatory and controversial government powers in existence, and exists only because of a multi-century long tradition of the ‘mental patient’s’ body being treated as less sacrosanct than the physical medicine patient’s body.

    So it’s essentially be detained without charge or trial in a building on the authority of government power, called a ‘hospital’ or whatever the coercers wish to label the building, if you dare get outraged, bang. They can label you an angry ‘dangerous to self or others’ person and bang. The needle goes in. That’s the reality, and there is no scrutiny on psychiatry’s labeling of danger, it happens behind closed doors, subject to zero oversight, and is an example of Nostradamus risk prediction , one in which people lose more rights, the right to own their own body, than even a convicted murderer sitting in a cell in a supermax prison loses. In the end there is nowhere to run, nowhere to move, in this debate. Defenders of forced so called ’emergency’ forced drugging, are treating, living, conscious, many times innocent, human beings, as if they were wild animals to be shot up with tranquilizer darts on safari. That truth is inescapable. So, to recap, if you’re in Virginia, and you get angry that you’ve been imprisoned in an ’emergency room’, you can be declared by psychiatric fiat to be ‘dangerous’ and then you get put in the category that only mental patients and those on death row get put in, those who ‘get the needle’. For expediency, the perps become human rights abusers.

  • The psychiatric survivor community — and certainly the medical community — offers no support or comfort to these people. They are on their own.

    Like I said, people can be harmed by toxic drugs we have plenty of evidence for things like liver damage, kidney damage, permanent TD etc, as I said in my original comment.

    The complete falsehood that the psychiatric survivor community ‘offers no support’ and ‘blames’ people for being harmed by drugs, isn’t helpful.

    Your link to your website offers nothing but an index, if you have some specific drug induced damage from stopping drugs you’d like to point to, that you wish me to read please post a more specific link. I am not about to read an entire index of stories.

    I think it is important to remember that there are many ways to free oneself of psychiatric drugs. Good luck every body.

  • The above response was directed towards a specific comment from Jonah on my “silence” here. I am just not sure where to put the response since there are no reply buttons. I was just trying to not ignore him.

    I know Dr. Steingard. I just felt the need to reiterate why I commented on coercion n the first instance, Intl. day of torture context, and respond that nobody wantonly labeled all psychiatrists Nazis or KKK.

    Thank you for your response. Your contributions, particularly remembering the response to the Anosognosia propaganda of the forced drugging lobby, Torrey et al, will be useful in the fight against them. Give it enough time, maybe you will be convinced of the case for bodily ownership equality.

  • I think the point is not so much that they are lying about the finer points of their broken brain theories, the point is these people live a simplistic philosophy of mind that views humankind and as a neuronal machine, they might not be able to prove their claims about various neurotransmitters, but they have no doubt, none, that they are ‘on the right track’, ‘in the right ballpark’, by claiming to the person labeled ‘patient’, that their problems in life are caused by ‘sick biology’. They believe this with a messianic fervor. Through and through. Just as they believe people who don’t do awesome on IQ tests are specimens of inferior biology to people who do. It’s a biodeterminist cult. If you’re unhappy, you’re a suboptimal brain, if you’re unproductive, you’re a suboptimal brain, all that’s left for the next thousand years, is for their god of ‘peer review’ to flesh out the details. The overarching creation story of humankind’s problems was set in stone by them generations ago, if you’re not ‘normal’ you’re a biological problem to be studied, solved, fixed, and they believe life is just the human brain, and if they’ve got good jobs it is because they are finer examples of the biological brain than the homeless guy. This is what they believe. While they might actively lie on some of the finer points of the serotonin theory crap, underlying this, they have about as much doubt in their biodeterminist worldview as a member of al Qaeda has of meeting the virgins in heaven. This is why they can sleep at night after working in the state hospital forcibly altering all the allegedly defective brains aka former human beings, after all, in their minds by working in a state hospital they are not doing anything to members of their own class, the ‘intact human brains’. They see people with psychiatric labels are just diseased brains, and see science as on a one way trajectory to proving what they already believe, so that the alleged alleles that ’cause’ inferior brains, supposed ‘unintelligent’ brains, ‘weak’ brains, can be destroyed at the embryo stage and never come into existence.

    They see the suffering in he human world, all mental suffering, as a curse inflicted upon humankind from the depth of the bowels of nature, just like diabetes, as thy love to say, just like diabetes, just like diabetes, just like diabetes.

    And they have ultimate faith that in future centuries, the people weak and inferior enough to have the ‘out of order’ responses to life stress, will be weeded from the human race by the god of technology.

  • I thought that with the Coercion post and subsequent comments, I did my best the address that topic. I honestly was not sure what else I could add.

    I don’t think there is anything you can add. I restate that the rationale for me mentioning it in the first instance was, that you wrote about what you were ‘mad at’ about psychiatry on International torture day, in a post published side by side with 4 other articles by others that mentioned torture and coercion and force, but your post mentioned it not at all. This is why I left a comment at all. Jonah may have been expecting some response, but I was not fussed about any response myself.

    In my current position, I am called to an emergency room where I sometimes am asked to make a decision about whether an individual can be held against his will.

    If you’re just ‘holding’ people, you’re not ordering, petitioning, rubber stamping, decision making, on forced drugging at all, merely being called to psychiatric facility to make a decision on detention, and not entering people’s bodies against their will, then your invasiveness in the lives and bodies of strangers just got 10,000 times lighter in my eyes. I somehow doubt that this is what you meant by only mentioning the aspect of your power and where people are ‘held’. I think you are using language like ‘held in hospital’, language that sounds like a decision merely on where the person will ‘be’, you’re leaving out what is being done to that person’s body by force.

    But I admit that I do not have an answer. I have struggled with this my whole career and I just do not know what is the best solution.

    Liberty is the answer. People being able to own their own bodies without fear of bodily invasion is the answer. People who undergo mental or emotional crises having their body treated with respect, is the answer. Brains being inviolable, is the answer.

    “I applaud having alternatives to hospitalization for those who are experiencing extreme states”

    When forced drugging happens to somebody, ‘hospital’ didn’t happen to them. Please don’t ever confuse opposition to forced drugging as some opposition to the building people are in. I am much less concerned about someone being in a ‘hospital’ than I am with someone being inside a stranger’s body by force. These may be the euphemisms you use for forced drugging, wording centered around not what is being done to someone’s body, but the kind of building they are in? I don’t know.

    “but even where I work, those programs do not accept individuals who are violent and they still rely on the emergency rooms.”

    Forced drugging is an act of escalated, aggravated violence against any violent person, unless of course, the person’s violence was to walk into an emergency room wielding a syringe threatening to inject the staff by force, in which case it would be an equal act of violence. We don’t have any adequate explanation of why ‘violence’ is a ‘medical’ problem, or a ‘medical emergency’ requiring a ‘medical emergency room’, and again, for the third time in this comment I am going to relay we are very much less concerned about what room someone is in, and more concerned about them losing their right to own their own body which is a far and away exponentially orders of magnitude aggravatingly invasive response, irreconcilable, with any modern conception of human rights, when one considers the only other people who the state puts needles in by force, are those on death row.

    I was at a loss at how to respond to comments that equate what I do with the KKK and Nazi’s.

    When I engaged in light hearted banter with other commenters, referring obviously and clearly to the President of the APA, as a ‘grand wizard’ of psychiatry, I was referring to people who hold the position President of the APA. When I referred to Israel hunting down war criminals, I was making an analogy to medical human rights crimes, on the International Day In Support of Victims of Torture no less. I even made several comments within my comments that I was speaking broadly to psychiatry and not specifically about the author, you.

    Everything I’ve just said is verifiable from my other comments. I didn’t wantonly call all psychiatrists Nazis or members of the KKK, and that will be clear to everybody.

    I reiterate, it is only marginally an impetus for concern what kind of building someone is in. It’s all about entering bodies by force, tinkering with living conscious human brains by force, and the unmitigated horror that this represents to all defenders of the human right to bodily integrity and bodily ownership equality.

    Forget case studies, forget composites, there is not a single story of a particularly bad criminal that can sway people who are opposed to the death penalty, and there is not a single case where it is not absolutely disproportionate to forcibly enter a stranger’s brain and chemically meddle in the flow of their higher order human functions, their frontal lobes choked out, partially disabled by drugs, in response to what? unruly behavior? Nobody in society gets forced needles but those labeled ‘mentally ill’ by your profession, and those executed in death penalty states, by executioners. There is simply no ‘mental patient’ behavior in a controlled environment like a facility, where the individual is outgunned, out-muscled by the staff, that can’t be controlled without going five alarm invasive on the situation and crossing the holy of holies, the blood brain barrier by force. The argument for bodily integrity and the brain being inviolable from a legal human rights perspective is utterly unassailable. Water tight, iron clad, I and many others have thought about every avenue of the issue for years and there is just nowhere to go but stop, don’t enter the body by force, and abolish this sickening practice that has no right to exist.

    Either you’re being called to the emergency to OK mere detention, or you’re signing off on the entering of that person’s body. When you use language that makes you look like you are just making decisions on where a person is ‘held’, you leave out a lot of the story. The bit involving human bodies.

  • Anonymous

    Your writings on forced drugging (as they go deeper with each posting) have provided the most devastating and comprehensive critique of this form of psychiatric oppression that I have read anywhere. You have provided greater depth to my evolving belief system; keep writing.

    Thank you Richard very kind of you. I just give a few off the cuff remarks here on MIA and I enjoy the discussions here for the most part. I agree, the internet has wounded psychiatry. Psychiatry has cancer, it may take a long time to die but the cancer is terminal. I relish shoveling soil on its grave God knows it has put millions of people in the grave either immediately, early, or with diminished dehumanized lives blighted by its lies.

  • Altostrata said: I really, really wish the psychiatric survivor community would take this issue seriously. People who have quit their drugs with little difficulty tend to dismiss or even deny the grievous injury suffered by others. Bad advice to do it whatever way you want keeps going around and around.

    Nobody can deny there are people who suffer demonstrable injury from psychiatric drugs and all sorts of drugs. There is tardive dyskinesia, liver damage, weight gain, all sorts of things we know can prove happen with these dangerous drugs. I quit cold turkey and I am glad I did. I’d do it again. I don’t recommend or not recommend any particular way of ending reliance on psychiatric drugs to anybody. I don’t believe anybody has discovered the one true way to do it. Perhaps it is best to take a cautious slow approach, perhaps it is best to get it over with faster. People will find their own path. I think people who have quit cold turkey have a lot to add to the debate and shouldn’t be dismissed or condescended to with unproven assertions like ‘they were just lucky’. In fact in all human endeavors, those who actually have completed a task have a lot to teach those who haven’t completed a task yet.

  • Nice article Patrick,

    ” I argue that cases similar to the teacup deception cited above are actually hidden in plain sight. ”

    I think all of psychiatry’s hypothesized creation stories about what their drugs ‘fix’ are fraud clearly, but I think it is important to remember that those pushing these stories do believe them or some approximation of them, with the fanaticism of a 9/11 terrorist. They believe human life’s problems are bodily malfunctions, even if the exact stories they sell to the public are inexact, they have supreme, fanatical faith that the one true biological truth will be elucidated in the coming decades or centuries. They will be vindicated for hundreds of years of somatic tinkering, is what they believe.

    I think the plague of ‘bioethicists’ in recent decades is terrifying to the future of mankind.

    Drugging someone’s tea, is forced drugging, similar to raping a sleeping drugged woman. It is outrageous that the ‘ethicist’ said that someone should lose their human right to own their own brain, for daring to become ‘unruly’.

    The scientism religion of psychiatry’s central tenet, that your body is broken if life gets hard, is piped into living rooms, ‘ask your doctor’, more as a religious edict than a willful lie.

    Interesting to read your bio there, and your MA in psychiatry’s creation story regarding unhappiness and the alleged despair brain disease. Everything you learned in your analysis of psychiatry’s creation story about despair also applies to psychiatry’s ‘antipsychotic’ stories.

    The whole thing is a naked emperor. Even when its subject matter is the ‘most disturbed people’. Welcome to MIA, nice photo. I like it when the men wear suits in their photos.

  • Hi Patrick, interesting NEED to join in the group think here, and enable your psychological-blindness, perhaps?

    So you’re doing it to everyone today? not just me. OK. You know sometimes we all write comments that are a little long, but the way to get people to read them is to not kick it off with an insult. I didn’t read your post, and let me tell you something, I’ve started to just blur my eyes, go cross eyed, whenever I see your large chunks of text. It is because your communication style needs improvement if you’re going to get people to actually invest the time in reading them.

  • As a counterpoint to your usual paranoid, inflated generalizations, please read this and maybe we could a real-life discussion”

    The subject matter of the article and three others yesterday was torture and coercion. The subject matter was not ‘what happens to most people’. I fail to see how your pasted anecdote of co-operation with the staff during your detention reflects a broad understanding of trends in the area of forced psychiatry.

    Your website seems to be concerned with the study of something other than forced psychiatry, from what I can gather your whole focus is your idea of the ‘the real source of our motivations’ as defined by you. While you’ve been busy finding the real source of human emotions, and spent a lot of time reading about the real source of our motivations, I’ve been reading a lot about forced psychiatry and when I make a statement about it, a pasted anecdote that isn’t even about violent coercion in mental hospitals, but about some cordial chat you had while you were complying at every turn during your incarceration, doesn’t prove I’m a ‘paranoid generalizer’. At all.

    You seem to be someone interested in communicating your ideas to the world. You’ve started a large website with lots of content. You leave a lot of comments in this community. I offer the following, because it is more decent than just ignoring you. The following is this: I recommend you find or pay even, just ten strangers, to read even just one page of your website and critique your writing communication style. Ask them if they can understand it. I find it impenetrable, tangential, and in need of vast, wholesale simplification. Try perhaps, to put yourself in the shoes of someone who hasn’t discovered the one true truth about our unconscious motivation, or whatever it is your believe you’ve discovered. Explain it to me in a succinct way that values the reader’s finite time and doesn’t extend to thousands of words. I am open to trying to understand what you’ve been saying all this time, I haven’t yet, and I blame your writing style at this point. Please avoid calling me a paranoid generalizer again its not all that nice.

  • “As you say, it’s time for these oppressors to have to begin looking over their shoulders to see if any of us are present at their meeting. ”

    The internet is killing psychiatry. It’s split the myths wide open. As a false, yet recognized as legitimate part of the establishment for the entire 19th and 20th centuries, the mad doctors used to have control of the narrative. It is a remarkable testament to their weakness right now, that even with the LIMITLESS OCEAN of cash that big pharma has on their side, they still can’t stop countless people losing faith in psychiatry week on week.

    When the actual leader, the Grand Wizard of the APA, is worried about an unfunded movement of critics, in the face of his products being sold in billions of dollars worth of TV ads, you know how weak psychiatry’s standing is becoming.

    Trust in institutions isn’t coming back. We can ride the wave of distrust in government, right into developing a widespread bodily integrity equality message, just like gays, we just want equality, except instead of a marriage license we want the world to stop raping our brains and scapegoating us as killers.

  • “and you have to wonder why the world is so worried about Islamism.”

    I’ll elaborate on that briefly.

    The world is scared of Islamism and thinks it is the greatest security threat facing the modern world.

    I think psychiatrism is.

    Psychiatrism, or al Qhiatry, is a radical interpretation of the hippocratic oath that has declared medicalized holy war on responsibility and common sense worldwide.

    The former leader of al Qhiatry, is hiding in San Diego in a cave speaking out against the new book of fatwas, DSM 5. He likes the DSM 4 book that he led.

  • “you can’t negotiate with terrorists.” Exactly!

    We can give a little of a pass to a concentration camp guard who shows a little mercy, spares the occasional child, gives you two bowls of rice, but in the end Israel still hunts down 94 year old ex guards. Maybe we need a new psychiatric survivor homeland. I think the only good thing about Somalia is it only has like 2 psychiatrists.

    When I said the L Ron Hubbard thing I meant in terms of the grand narrative stretching back across space and time.

  • Indeed. It is actually a testament to our movement’s nonviolence that we restrain ourselves from retaliating to such a large degree. I’d like to see them dealt with the legal way. After a fair trial, a prison cell, restitution paid from their own assets not insurance.

  • Exactly. Steingard makes the error of separately personifying ‘his voices’ here. Part and parecel of being an ‘expert on states of mind you’ve never experienced yourself’. If someone is talking to himself, he doesn’t forfeit his right to own his own body.

    In the criminal justice system they reserve the needle for serious crimes like murder.

    In the forced psychiatry system the needle is the first resort of the STFU and stop thinking, saying, doing, things we don’t like brigade. It’s inhumane. Torture.

    The key giveaway in the phrase ‘screaming obscenities’, is that the speaker is actually proposing a human rights obscenity in response. What is more obscene? The domination of the stranger’s biology by the forced psychiatrist? Or curse words?

  • I agree. Ranch it is! good idea.

    A ranch run by people who don’t view these kids as nature’s mistake personified. That’s the real problem here. Viewing these kids as defective.

    As someone else said…

    ‘if your kid needs drugs to get through his day maybe there is something wrong with his day’

  • That is an amazing record. Total Guantanamo Bay level stuff. Sorry to hear it.

    In Australia and the UK ‘rapid tranquilization’, that is giant doses of neuroleptics forced on physically held down victims, that bring rapid complete unconsciousness, replaced restraints. I just generally sense on my radar all the time this feeling among the staff than touching the inside of the body is somehow OK.

    I’ve said in the past I think there is a psychological dynamic at play where restraints look nasty, but forced drugging (after the initial take down and forced injection assault), has no visuals, its all taking place inside the target’s skull, so outsiders tend to be less revolted by it. I hope that one day forced drugging’s reality can be articulated widely.

  • I have seen numerous governments across the globe say they are going to reduce restraints. The trouble is they often just replace restraints with forced drugging. Forced drugging is 10,000 times the human rights abuse that restraints are, and I hope we don’t see physical restraints merely replaced with brain disabling drug based chemical restraints in Ohio. Decreasing touching the outside of a child’s body by force, in favor of touching and meddling with the inside of a child’s brain by force, is no improvement. It is a hyperinflation of aggravated human rights breaches. There seems to be a belief that has affected people who work in the system worldwide that drugs are somehow less violent and invasive than restraints. It simply doesn’t hold up to scrutiny. I hope such an ethos doesn’t take a hold of Ohio. I don’t have any information that it has, I’m just saying.

    I speak as a first hand survivor forced drugging, seclusion and restraint, and childhood.

    This is a remarkably well written article in terms of structure and pacing. You are a good writer. Welcome to MIA.

  • I’m going to respond to the actual Steingard article on this page now.

    But Dr. Lieberman finds hope for the profession. He states, “The emergence of psychopharmacology, neuroimaging, molecular genetics and biology, and the disciplines of neuroscience and cognitive psychology have launched us into the mainstream of medicine.”

    Notice how they lust, literally lust to be putting their scans up on a screen, pointing to a lesion, and correcting it, just like the real doctors do, you know those ones that get respect. The pesky identities, voices, and human rights of the bodies they seek to ‘fix’, are just noise. The crowded din of the ‘patients’ and what they have to say about their lives, completely irrelevant, it needs to be listened to in their eyes about as much as the survivors of forced psychiatry need to be listened to, not at all. Just a barrier to being seen as the wizards of brains.

    Psychiatry, particularly the Grandmaster of the APA, would qualify for Southern Poverty Law Center hate group status with what it says about those it labels ‘anti psychiatry’.

    Like the late Tony Soprano said ‘Those who want respect, show respect’. Psychiatry not only carried out and continues to carry out human rights atrocities against millions, it actually lied to Billions. Combine that with the fact it hasn’t made a single objective discovery about its principle object of investigation, and how does this profession deserve any respect? For the mere sake of politeness? custom? cultural tradition of reverence for white coats?

    They talk a good game. That’s it.

    “neuroimaging, molecular genetics and biology, and the disciplines of neuroscience”

    Neuroimaging: not in clinical use. In quack research use only.

    Molecular Genetics: not in clinical use. In quack research use only.

    Biology: No patient’s biology gets examined. Talk of biology exists in psychiatry’s mouth only.

    Neuroscience: Not in clinical use. Quack research only.

    60 odd years of drugging people whom they call names. 200 years of somatic tinkering. Zero evidence that distressed humans are the biological defectives they believe they are.

    I think most of psychiatry has become nothing but a brain blaming cult. In the 19th century a mere appearance of science was enough to confirm racist suspicions about the skull size of then hated races. Psychiatrists cling to the idea that the brains of people like me are diseased and defective with the fanaticism of a 19th century scientific racist. That is what makes it possible for them to carry out forced drugging and then pat their dog and sleep at night. It was what made it possible for the Nazi T4 euthanasia program psych nurses to gas us, it is what made it possible for the eugenic forced sterilization program psychiatrists to rubber stamp forced sterilization, and it is what makes the world knee-jerk and brain blame with every new gun massacre, every teenage mood, every human weakness, every bad habit, psychiatry has created a global nightmare of mass dehumanization, creation stories of pat brain blaming explanations for every negative event in human life, and the Grandmaster of the APA is one of the most delusional human beings alive on planet Earth at this moment if he thinks his profession has earned respect. And you know the hundreds of thousands of researchers who mindlessly perpetuate the foolish notion that irrational thoughts = a brain disease? Those hundreds of thousands of researchers, the people who hold these ‘rational’ beliefs about blaming bad brains and bad genes for human lives, they actually believe they themselves are pictures of normality, and ‘health’. Whatever the scientific sounding elites of the day say is the current ‘rational’ worldview, shall rule the day. And then the world found out that the ‘rationality police’ themselves, where in fact suffering from top to bottom with irrationality. Who watches the watchers? And who checks the rationality of the rationality arbiters? The profession charged with dealing with delusion was founded on a delusion 200 years ago and continues to live in delusion. That delusion is that the big bang, evolution, and the human body, somehow conspired to create all the bad irrational thoughts individuals exhibit in a modern mass society, that when a gun goes off in a school that’s a twist of the cellular world, the molecular inner universe of the body displaying a ‘symptom’ just as a pancreatic tumor is generated by nature. Utterly childish and ridiculous. Every single thing about it is hiding behind arguments from authority, credentials, and blind deference of the masses to false expertise. There is nothing there.

    Did you know Mozart wasn’t a talented composer? He was just nature playing the right molecular notes in Mozart’s brain’s neuromechanics?

    And did you know James Holmes wasn’t an angry young man, he was a molecular automaton sent from the primordial soup of early Earth, through evolution, up through hundreds of thousands of generations of genetic mutations, to 2012, where this force of nature taught itself to make bombs and buy body armor online and rampage through a theater at midnight. Just like breast cancer. Just like diabetes.

    That’s what psychiatry believes. It sounds like something from the mind of L Ron Hubbard. Combine psychiatry’s psychotic beliefs with psychiatry’s power to forcibly enter your body, and you have to wonder why the world is so worried about Islamism.

  • The 50 year thought experiment allowed for society to change and be exposed to the critiques of psychiatry it needs to take on board. With the legal powers psychiatrists have today, they either wait until retirement to stop coercing people, or quit today and cleanse their conscience. That’s how I see it. Everything else is just lipstick on a pig, ‘prettifying the slave plantations’ as Szasz used to call it. I think the tinkering, the piecemeal so called ‘harm reduction’ and all this, is a position one can adopt for sure, but like tiny bits of tinkering in a vast problem, like sending arms to Syria, there will always be those who say the interventionists should just go home, retire. I won’t condemn your faith in the internal reformist approach, and I don’t think anybody else should condemn people like me and our faithlessness in it. There are many schools of thought.

    It depends on your perspective. Some would say ‘alternative minded’ people who work in the system today are doing more good than harm or have the scope if they get ‘innovative’ to do more good than harm. There are many good reasons why I chose not to go work in the system. If I had faith that I could help people within the system without completely compromising my values I’d be doing it.

    There is a reason I know even just personally people who have pledged to commit suicide if forced psychiatry ever touches them again. I would never confirm or deny in writing whether I hold such a position about my own future should I be forced into psychiatry again. This is more than just an oppressive system, it’s a grenade pin in many peoples’ lives, and if hey get hit once more, it’s game over. Life would become untenable.

    Even understanding how that sort of violence can be part of someone’s day planner and something they leave at work when they put the car keys and change in a bowl once they get in the door of an evening, is absolutely almost beyond my comprehension.

  • The leap from restless agitation side effect to well planned murder, is ludicrous crap, and Healy and his acolytes embarrass themselves every time they try it on. Every school shooting has been expertly carried out with paramilitary precision, it is foolish to believe the molecules in a pill are causing such well planned crimes. Drug blaming is the reverse side of the coin of brain blaming, neither side can prove their assertions, and drug blaming is the greatest cancer growing on our movement. Anybody who would type the words ‘drugs caused’ instead of ‘drugs may have contributed to’, is irresponsible. Healy does this, and I label him irresponsible.

  • “Bush believes he helped Iraq and the hundred thousand dead Iraqis was worth it.”

    Further on this… if you’re one of the hundred thousand dead, you’re just a skeleton in a grave, you’ve got no voice. Just like the pro war neocons only want to hear from the Iraqis happy to tear down Saddam’s statue and rejoice, forced psychiatry only wants to hear from the people who are happy they were blasted with neuroleptics and put on ice for a while. If you’re in the grave of forced psychiatry, or your life post psychiatry feels about as safe as Iraqi feels today, then the interventionists, the preemptionists, well it’s
    ‘talk to the hand’ might makes right and look over here, don’t look over there, look at the happy little mental patients who are ‘alive today’. Don’t look at the people who live in constant fear of being ‘helped’ against their will. Don’t look at those asphyxiated to death during forced drugging take downs. Look at the happy Saddam statue tearing down Iraqis. Forced psychiatry apologists are like Bush posing in front of the ‘Mission Accomplished’ sign on the aircraft carrier.

    Forced psychiatry as an idea, is so hateful, so bigoted, that it stands alone in its depravity and condescension.

    Let’s break it down:

    1. Society wouldn’t dare, dare, hold up thankful poster boys, the ‘thankful coerced’, the ‘success stories’, as a justification for a forced wide-scale system of government intervention in the economic lives of people based on race.

    2. Society wouldn’t dare, dare, hold up thankful poster boys, the ‘thankful coerced’, the ‘success stories’, as a justification for a forced wide-scale system of government forced surgical intervention in the stomach size of people based on weight.

    Society wouldn’t dare, dare, hold up thankful poster boys, the ‘thankful coerced’, the ‘success stories’, as a justification for a forced wide-scale system of government intervention in the bedrooms of people based on sexual orientation.

    Society wouldn’t dare, dare, hold up thankful poster boys, the ‘thankful coerced’, the ‘success stories’, as a justification for a forced wide-scale system of government auditing of the ability of all visitors to Las Vegas to handle gambling losses. Can’t gamble til you prove you’re rich enough to play.

    Society wouldn’t dare, dare, hold up thankful poster boys, the ‘thankful coerced’, the ‘success stories’, as a justification for a forced wide-scale system of government intervention in the garments women wear. Iran or Saudi Arabia would.

    Society DOESN’T BLINK when psychiatrists hold up thankful poster boys, the ‘thankful coerced’, the ‘success stories’, as a justification for a forced wide-scale system of government intervention in the LIVING BRAINS of people based on psychiatric labels.

    AND psychiatry can’t prove a thing is diseased about the brains of living people it forcibly invades. That is the definition of insanity.

    It is only acceptable because society has been trained, by psychiatrists, to see those labeled mentally ill as disposable garbage people, less than, unworthy of basic human rights, and for in excess of 200 years your profession has been carving up our living bodies, hacking into our skulls, our bloodstreams, jacking this or that chemical up or down, like a bull in a china shop, and your profession has the hubris to point to the ‘thankful coerced’.

    Like the fat guy happy he got forced Lap Band surgery. The Iranian woman happy she is dressed modestly according to Islam. The Saudi Arabian woman happy she is protected from car accidents. The Las Vegas gambler happy the government vetted his bank account before letting him play poker, the citizen in the police state happy the government forced him to wear a condom, so long as the coercers can point to at least a few people who are happy to be pushed around, the pushing around system is ‘justified’.

    The only group of people who are denied the right to own their own body based on who they are (said to be) not what they do, are those labeled ‘mentally ill’.

    And it is group who takes away the other group’s freedom that gets define what the unfree group is. The unfree group is whatever psychiatry says it is. If psychiatry says they are brain diseased, by fiat, than as sure as the Federal Reserve declaring the face value of a 1 dollar note, the cultural fiction becomes reality. Your brain is diseased if psychiatry says your brain is diseased.

    The poor, scared, disheveled, overwhelmed mere citizen, the ‘non expert’, stands before a judge, the ‘expert’ on hypothetical ‘brain diseases’ petitions the judge that the citizen should lose the right to own their own body. The judge, bamboozled by all the quack talk about brains, hands over the living brain of the citizen to the ‘expert’. Because the state owns our bodies. The needle goes in.

  • Perhaps in another post I can address why we disagree.

    If there is going to be some future post. I think it should be about what you’d like to see in 50 years.

    People will always become mentally or emotionally distressed and there should be places for them to go if they want to go there. Your medical knowledge, of poisons, that the consenting, might find useful for a while in risk/benefit trade-off, is useful, to people who want the drugs. To know how much of a drug is going to kill a man of a certain size and weight, and all this, is a useful skill, if you are working for the person who has consented to a relationship with you, in which case he’d right be called ‘patient’.

    Having a skill-set, and who you work for, is significant. A demolition expert, knows how to knock down a house with a wrecking ball on a crane. He is useful to the person who bought a house and wants to knock the house down and redevelop it. His skills are also useful to the Chinese government when they want to forcibly destroy people’s homes for the ‘good of the nation’ to build the Beijing Olympic village.

    If a psychiatrist is using force, they are working for the state. If a psychiatrist is controlling crime, or orwellian pre-crime, they are working for the state. If in the future model system the distressed individual wants to numbed out with Thorazine, they need the skill-set of someone who knows how to administer that drugs without killing them with an overdose. But any system, any model, premised on reaching in and not reaching out, premised on blind assumptions of ‘they’ll thank us later’, is going to be steamrolled into the ground by the argument for human rights and the countervailing collateral damage that such policies create.

    Just the pleading, heartwarming, incredibly viscerally moving tears of joy and thankfulness of the wife of an ex fat man whose ‘life was saved’ by a theoretical total therapeutic state, FORCED bariatric surgery, would not be justification for every fat person being forced to live in terror of being rounded up and having a Lap-Band forcibly installed. No amount of focus on the ‘thankful coerced’ is going to change the fact that these violent and invasive policies always destroy some, terrorize many, to ‘help’ a few. It is an iron clad, water tight argument as tight as any four point restraints. People who don’t have the stomach to see a few people at liberty to harm themselves are WILLFULLY blind to the compounded harm caused by a wide scale bull in a china shop social engineering. No model whereupon psychiatry retains the reserve power to enter the body of anybody it declares a fair game target will ever be acceptable.

    And just as it sounds absurd to introduce forced bariatric surgery today, the clinicians who worked in such a system of brutal involuntary obesity treatment, would have minds filled with memories of ‘cases they can’t talk about’, that amount to nothing but clinician’s illusion bias. Just think about it, the Sopranos actor died of a heart attack, in such a system of forced bariatric surgery, the forced Lap Band surgeons would have all these case histories in their minds of enormously moving, thankful, tears of joy wives of ex fat guys saved from heart attacks, saaaavvvedd, oh its so beautiful, saving lives, yes, the ‘serious’ business that ‘isn’t taken lightly’ of forced bariatric surgery. And that fat guys on the run from the authorities, sleeping in their cars, living in fear of being rounded up, be damned, for the forced bariatric surgery clinician has got fresh memories of the ‘lives saved’.

    If forced psychiatry didn’t exist, and it was being proposed for the first time today, psychiatry would be laughed out of the room. You want to do what? establish a system of forced brain drugging in every city in the world? and you can’t prove anybody’s brain is diseased? Hahahaha Laughed out of the room, is what would happen if forced psychiatry were to be instated for the first time today.

    It would be like chiropractors asking for the power to SWAT team their way into anybody’s home and give them a remedial massage by force. Forced psychiatry is utterly logically, ethically, morally, untenable.

  • I know that one place where Anonymous and I have a disagreement is that he would prefer people in jail than in hospitals.

    I hold the position that numerous abolitionists of forced psychiatry have held over the decades. That locked buildings, are carceral in nature, and that the label you slap on them, ‘hospital’ or ‘jail’, is really just window dressing. If the government locks you in a building and calls it a hospital, does that make it a hospital? Even historical and half of the present day facilities around the globe, mark the distinction between bona fide hospitals and mental hospitals by building them separately.

    We know that when psychiatry talks of its ‘hospitals’ and how many ‘beds’ they have, we are not talking about people laid up in hospital beds convalescing, accepting well wishing visitors, hooked up to vital sign monitors, being visited and consulting in an equal consensual relationship with physical medicine doctors who are detecting, and treating bona fide medical disease in their bodies. No they are talking about places where the alleged doctors and nurses within such ‘hospitals’ talks a good game about the inside of the ‘patient’s’ bodies but conspicuously don’t even examine or prove disease inside anybody’s body. Hospitals in name only.

    Hospitals have flowers, get well soon cards. Mental hospitals have men asking permission like five year olds for a safety razor to have their daily shave.

    My rationale, my logic, is not original on this, many others have said it, in prison, even the terrorist, can read his Koran, write some letters, sit in his cell unmolested. Society is safe. He’s behind high walls.

    In a psychiatric facility his entire neuronal connectome, is the playground of guesswork quacks with their chemistry set of uppers and downers, his torment never sleeps, with every beat of his heart forced drugging pumps society’s contempt for his human right to own his own body into every cell of his nervous system. Biological violence.

    The argument from how many human rights are lost, the argument that lays out that the person denied freedom of movement in society is better off than the person denied of movement PLUS denied freedom of bodily integrity, is fundamentally, wholly, completely, unassailable and will in the end, forced psychiatry versus criminal justice system, as interventions compared side by side, the brain altering intervention of the two, always comes off looking like an intervention with aggravating factors, and is so sickening and invasive, revolting, really to the general public once understood, that in the end forced psychiatry can be defeated on human rights grounds.

    It is not liberal, it is not progressive, it is not kind, it is not humane, to subject the misbehaving to forced brain alteration in place of jail and claim in jail they would be harangued nearly as much they would be if the contents of their living skull were owned by state psychiatry.

    If the concern is criminal records for nuisance offenses, consider the stigma of involuntary mental patienthood often eclipses the stigma of being a convicted felon. If people want psychiatry in prison give them psychiatry in prison. Just as if they want a snickers bar in prison. Just don’t force it down their throats.

    If the political project is to somehow craft some special doublespeak new age happy go lucky ‘non prison’ with high walls and locked doors and bean bags and dream catchers and pipe organ nature music, and have this be society’s response to minor criminals than so be it.

    But in the end I prefer people who have not harmed another to be free. Free. Free to harm themselves just as you are happy to allow the wire walker to walk across the grand canyon without feeling it is your right to intervene. Free to climb Everest just as you allow these people to do that. Free to eat themselves to an early diabetes heart disease grave just as hundreds of millions are. Equality. Freedom. Non-discrimination. An end to the unbearable hubris that says psychiatry! of all professions, a profession that has not made a single discovery about a single thing, somehow has earned the right to be a social control arm of the state. It hasn’t. Psychiatry’s legal power is nothing but a convenient legacy power left over from the days where it was ok to shove ice picks into our brains and win the Nobel Prize for doing so. It must go, and the political project has begun. We are on the right side, medicalizers of human behavior are on the creepy Dr. Mengele side, and I am confident that society can eventually be made so revolted by the massive number psychiatry is going to do on hundreds of millions of children and adults this century, that society will finally smack psychiatry down and strip it of its ill-deserved power to enter the bodies of non-consenting strangers. There will dawn a day on this earth, when people no longer have to fear psychiatry. Carceral total institutions are carceral total insitutions whether they are labeled jails, prisons, Japanese American internment camps, FEMA camps, Gulag archipelagos, the back of a police car, Joseph Frtizl’s basement, the Tower of London, the island of St. Helena, or a ‘hospital’.

  • Yet, I am truly glad that Dr. Steingard blogs here; she’s doing good — e.g., by standing up against the likes of Dr. Jeffrey Lieberman and others, who work, apparently without shame, flatly denying the harms caused by their profession.

    I am glad that Steingard blogs here too and I agree with what you said. The reason I left the comment was, there was a post, conspicuously ‘mad at’ psychiatry, on the International torture day at that, conspicuously absent was any mention of psychiatry and human rights or coercion. That’s like an ‘Anonymous’ magnet. We must never forget, and I think this what the entire general public forgets in their pally relationships with voluntary psychiatry, the same psychiatrists tens of millions of people find compelling and nice, and helpful, also have ‘relationships’ where they are the face of absolute unmitigated terror for the people they coerce. This must never be forgotten.

    No matter who your psychiatrist is, the nicest one you’ve ever met, whoever it is, they could just as easily have spent the previous day excusing murderers in court, or petitioning for innocent people to lose the right to own their own bodies. This is why coercion mangles the ethics and face, of all who choose to accept this power.

    We know there is a bizarre mangled ‘coercive psychiatry’ flavor of the clinician’s illusion in play that seems to make forced psychiatry practitioners thoroughly remember the actions they prevented via forced brain disablement tranquilizer drugging, whether snuffing out the blood flow to the frontal lobe of an innocent yet deeply despairing suicidal person ‘prevented’ an action, or whatnot, they’ve participated and done these things in their careers, and the forced psychiatry clinician’s illusion prevents them from noticing the multitudes of ex detainees aka ‘patients’ who wouldn’t even speak to them or make contact with them if they saw them on the street, the lifetime of rage inspired by the lines forced psychiatry crosses, clinicians actively deny the collateral damage and much like foreign policy, people who believe in using force and preemption see what they want to see.

    Bush believes he helped Iraq and the hundred thousand dead Iraqis was worth it. Forced psychiatry clinicians believe transferring quality of life from the psychiatric survivor to the thankful consumer side of the ledger is a job well done. A few lives destroyed in order to create a few lives ‘saved’ and success story poster boys for forced psychiatry. That’s how forced psychiatry works we know this by now. It’s a shell game where the extreme anecdotes and stories of lives saved, are showcased in a shiny golden treasure chest on a mountain, with double rainbows and a happy moon face moon shining down on psychiatry’s grand creation, the ‘lives saved by involuntary psychiatry’. The mountain is lush and green with beautiful flowing grass. Of course out of sight, millions of forced psychiatry’s dead or destroyed lives are the fertilizer upon which the lush grass grows. The mise-en-scène psychiatry has created for the public about forced psychiatry, actively hides the lives destroyed by forced psychiatry, effectively sending the message that it is ok to break innocent strangers on the wheel in North Los Angeles, destroy their lives, smash their credibility and dignity and humanity for life, provided we prevent someone else’s suicide in West LA. It’s forced psychiatry’s whack-a-mole justification of bull in a china shop terror, and the powerful rule the narrative. And in the end, no one pays but the people destroyed by forced psychiatry, the 401k still fills up, the house and car payments get made, and the psych survivors get “I’m sorry you had such a bad experience”.

    That was directed at all of psychiatry not the author in particular, as I said, I’m glad the author blogs here, and it does do some good that she does blog here.

  • I spend a lot of my time talking to people who see things in their world that others do not see.

    People who see things in their world like judges, court rooms, and you, petitioning to force drugs into their brains.

    https://www.madinamerica.com/2012/05/coercion/

    Today is June 26. International Day In Support of Victims of Torture. Let’s hope that one day you get mad enough to eschew coercion.

  • When I read the U.S. Supreme Court cases on civil commitment and forced psychiatry I had to fortify myself with a drink to dull the edges of pain. How does it feel to read casual descriptions of torture that read like “how many angels on the head of a pin?” – abstruse irrelevant scholastic figures justifying what they cannot begin to understand.

    I totally understand this Tina. The survivors of psychiatry’s violence are expected to play by their rules, be staid and calm and never raise our voices, never get ‘too’ angry, always be willing to ‘sit at the table’ with UNREPENTANT human rights criminals, expected to step in line with piecemeal reforms when only wholesale abolition of torture will do, and then while the perpetrators go to the ATM and withdraw the blood money they earned carrying out forced injections, we are left shaking, on edge, frazzled, just trying our hardest to even sit at the keyboard and put into words to communicate across the divide to those who don’t understand what psychiatry’s violence means.

    You are right. It isn’t fair, it isn’t just. And any reparations we would ever get in some fantasy world of justice, should come out of forced psychiatry worker’s wallets. I want ever forced psychiatry worker who reads this to go to the ATM and take a good look at the blood money that comes out, have a hard think about yourself and your decisions in life. It’s not honest way to make a living, and survivors of human rights atrocities are under NO ONUS to respect people who do this for a living. If you all refused to go to work, nobody would be tortured today.

  • Two great articles here on Mad in America about torture on the international day dedicated to thinking about torture.

    I think the above is great and I think Faith’s other article is great. In the end I could only leave a proper comment on one of them about torture, here is the link to that comment please click here if you’d like to read it. Trigger Warning.

    https://www.madinamerica.com/2013/06/why-is-it-so-hard-to-think-about-torture/#comment-26648