Philip, do you not think you’re being a bit hard on Dr Pies? (I’m being sarcastic!)
POTENTIAL NEOLIBERALISM
EMAIL TO ME:
FROM THE HEALTH AND SAFETY EXECUTIVE, CONCERNS OFFICER
20 January 2021 at 16.27
Subject: Re Possibility of Exposure to Asbestos
Dear Mr Xxxxx
Health and Safety at Work etc Act 1974
You recently contacted the Health and Safety Executive (HSE) with concerns about work you conducted on an artex ceiling, and thank you for the additional information/photographs provided.
The primary legislation that covers working with asbestos is the Control of Asbestos Regulations. The risk from asbestos arises when asbestos fibres released into the air are breathed in. Whilst there is no “safe “level we do publish control limits for the maximum concentration of fibres that those working with asbestos should be exposed to. Work with asbestos that is likely to result in exposures at above the control limit should only be carried out by a contractor licensed by HSE.
Some asbestos-containing-materials (ACMS) are less friable and therefore much less likely to give rise to airborne asbestos fibres; this is because the fibres are held firmly within a solid non –asbestos substrate. In non-coatings- friable materials such as asbestos cement, textured coatings such as artex, and vinyl floor tiles, the asbestos fibres are held firmly within a dense, rigid, on-asbestos substrate and there is much less risk of them becoming air-borne. Artex is in the category of the lowest risk asbestos containing materials.
In conclusion, I do not consider that there is sufficient evidence of risk to prompt the intervention of HSE.
Further guidance can be found on our website Asbestos.
Yours sincerely
Xxxxx Xxxxxx Concerns Officer
30-watt-lightbulb,
I reckon theres probably quite a few people that had these drugs in the womb and don’t feel at all okay in the world, and can’t understand why.
I believe I’ve met people like this – who certainly did find a way out of the predicament.
Hi Sam, I second that. It’s a fantastic interview that explains what the ‘misunderstandings’ are.
I notice that the UK is probably the most advanced country in the World in turning the tables on the “chemical solution”, and has been for a while!
“Schizophrenia” is no longer guaranteed.
Hi Philip,
I believe “psychiatry” is in a sense going out of business, as there are less and less doctors interested in practising it!
Richard, “Killing For Profit” couldn’t be written about enough.
Theres a complete “Lockdown” in Medical, Pharmaceutical, Governmental swindling. The Pharmaceutical Industry practically controls even elected Governments.
“….But here is the uncomfortable conundrum. Wherever you find mental health services to have expanded with more people receiving what is considered to be mental health treatments (whether these are psychological or drugs) you find a parallel increase in the numbers who have been classed as disabled due to a mental health disorder…”
DISABLED
My psychiatrists main problem with me, when I was a young man, was my inability to work. He told me that if I could hold down a job for 3 months he would take me off all “medications”.
When I challenged him on the side effects of the “medication”(involuntary movements), and he tried to do something about this, but was unable – he offered to take me off the Modecate injection completely.
When I came off the modecate depot injection, I had several hospitalizations, a suicide attempt, and a near suicide attempt.
I then put myself on a Longterm Drug Taper with Oral “medication” (and discovered how to manage the psychological withdrawal problems).
…And I was no longer Disabled.
Thanks Peter,
When the Richest People in the world want to stop drinking they go to Anonymous Peer Fellowships.
The reason they do this is because the Peer Fellowships are the most successful.
The Fellowships are successful, because they contain people with longterm successful experience of substance withdrawal.
Also, peers can back a person up (24 hrs) when medical people are not available.
I don’t believe in Mental Illness.
“…There is no other medical specialty like psychiatry where its theoretical underpinnings result in patients dying over 20 years earlier than the national average, for “disorders” like schizophrenia, bipolar, and ADHD that themselves present no fatal biological disease! ….”
“…..A good case can be made that many of the difficulties he had in the 1980s stemmed from the medication he was put on for a possible schizophrenia or schizoaffective disorder. ..”
From one of the last Doctors to see me in the 1980s.
Thank you Dr Timimi,
“…Diagnoses in psychiatry are not diagnoses..”
After 65 years of Neuroleptics (and “Longterm Schizophrenia”) researchers like Professor Robin Murray are now “promoting an idea” that it’s possible to carefully withdraw from Neuroleptics and improve as a result.
Professor Robin Murray also “promotes an idea” that when a person comes off drugs quickly and goes mad – it’s the original presence of the drugs, that is more than likely causing the madness.
Even though It took me 6 years to go from 25mg of Modecate per month to 25mg of Mellaril per day. Anxiety was still a big thing with me. But thankfully I was able to find ways of dealing with it.
Twelve step fellowship supports an idea of “acceptance being the key” – “acceptance in terms of Equanamity” for me is definitely the key.
I was at a 12 step meeting last night and some people present related their experience of being raised on disadvantaged London council estates. They said their neighbour’s might be Drug Dealers or Bank Robbers – but the “Nutters” were the ones everyone was really frightened of.
But since most “Nutters” come off their drugs abruptly without the advice they should be given, then they cannot be held responsible for going mad. I went mad several times when I attempted to stop taking drugs abruptly, with medical support. I had to completely abandon the medical approach to recover.
Trick or Treat
“…A coalition of health bodies wrote to the Government urging it to update legislation to ensure medical workers do not feel ‘vulnerable to the risk of prosecution for unlawful killing’ when treating coronavirus patients ‘in circumstances beyond their control…”. Todays Daily Mail
I talked to you this morning about my concerns regarding the possibility that I had been exposed to asbestos while working on ceilings before and after Christmas at XXX.
This morning at your office you provided me with a large folder from which I had difficulty finding information. I was then provided with an emailed Asbestos Survey which you suggested might be more helpful.
I’ve since looked through the (emailed) Asbestos Survey and I don’t see any relevant samples taken from ceilings in rooms XX (XXX Room) and XX (XXX Room) (as you call them). But I do see photos towards the end of the Survey of ceilings with textured covering all identified as containing Asbestos.
I’m still concerned, as this Survey does not reassure me.
Please return to me on this.
Yours Sincerely
ME
Sent: 12 January 2021 08:22
REPLY FROM SITE MANAGER
Subject: RE: Possibility of Exposure to Asbestos
The survey is carried out by professional company, and they only take sample of material they suspect to contain ACM. So the 2 rooms in question did not have any material which required testing, so would not be logged to have samples taken and analysed.
KIND REGARDS, SITE MANAGER
12 Jan at 09:37
EMAIL TO ME FROM PROJECT MANAGER
Subject: RE: Possibility of Exposure to Asbestos
We also had the XXX surveyor on site yesterday as he is preparing the final report of the removal of all asbestos for information for the O&M manual for the XXX.
I showed him the two rooms and the ‘suspect’ materials you showed in your photos. He had no concerns that these were ACMs. He is a very experienced surveyor, and he carried out the initial survey – they only test or sample substances they deem necessary. The R&D survey was full and complete and all asbestos containing materials present were removed apart from in some underground duct areas, the basement and the 12 main xxxxrooms which have been encapsulated by over-boarding.
You really have no need to be concerned.
REGARDS, PROJECT MANAGER
SURVEY DISCLAIMER
XXX completed this survey on the basis of a specified program of work and terms and conditions agreed with the Client. All reasonable skill and care, bearing in mind the project objectives and the agreed scope of work, have been exercised during the preparation of this survey report.
Following the issue of this survey report, responsibility to any parties for any matters arising, which may be considered outside of the agreed scope of work, will not be accepted by XXX.
This survey report is confidential. XXX will accept liability to no parties with the exception of the Client. Without the written agreement of XXX, no one with the exception of the Client, may rely upon or have the benefit of this survey report.
XXX asserts and retains all copyright, and other intellectual property rights, in and over the survey report and its contents unless these rights were specifically assigned or transferred within the terms of the agreement.
Any questions or matters arising from this survey report should be addressed to XXX.
Thank you Dr Timimi
“…Anything that offers success in our unjust society without trying to change it is not revolutionary..”
“Mindfulness”
Most people I know are at the same economic or social level as I am, some of them work for a living and some of them don’t. If I can be at peace with my “internal situations” I can be happy and focus on my external situations.
Some people might be externally harassed all the time and anyone could end up like this; but a lot of other people aren’t, and can improve the quality of their lives from inside themselves.
The most successful psychotherapy I know of, comes from the completely free 12 Step Movement; which has a lot of internal change attached to it.
I think, this late but eventual acknowledgement from ‘Horowitz, Murray, and Taylor’ is also extremely important
That it is possible to come off “antipsychotics” (and make recovery as a result) – but that coming off them abruptly can drive a person MAD.
It’s difficult to rely on people if everything is subterfuge! But it’s always been like this!
MISSD
Dr Wayne W Dyer said ‘Alcoholics Anonymous is where Jesus walks on Earth’. In my opinion Akathisia is where Hell exists on Earth.
The experience of Akathisia cannot be described.
‘Depression Delusion’ by Dr Terry Lynch was one of the best books I ever read. It was available on Amazon at a very reasonable price, and was ‘electric’ all the way through.
IMO the 1 percent of people at the top need good looking servants to look after them and other professionals to do their bidding and thats about it!
85 percent of the work people do, could be reorganised and automated – this work is preserved to keep people occupied.
It sounds like they want to have their cake and eat it!
Thank you for writing this credible account about your experience. I’m very sorry for your suffering, it was dreadful.
I used to think “Psychiatrists” were doctors that could be trusted.
I notice when children are out and about with their parents they often appear happy and good natured, but when they’re mixing with other children in a school setting they often appear small and weak.
Even in the aftermath of the “Haiti disaster” (years ago) the ‘poor’ Haiti child on television looked healthier (to me) than the average ‘European’ school child.
The basic needs in education are the 3 rs: Reading, Writing, and Arithmetic. After this anything else that’s needed can be self acquired.
Dr Timimi, this chapter is brilliant and very true.
I don’t personally believe that most people become rich through hard work, I believe that most people become rich through being connected.
When I was at school in the1970s in Ireland the French teacher (in her twenties) encouraged a very boisterous class. There was one particular boy who was extremely boisterous and I wouldn’t repeat (even now) some of the jokes he made in the class (and got away with).
I bumped into him again years ago, in a bar in Ireland. He was drinking beer and he was a lot bigger. He was very friendly and he told me he was living in New York and working in the Bronx as a teacher.
People also seem to be able to come off drugs like cannabis without too much difficulty. But attempting to come off psychiatric drugs can lead to all types of disasters.
If you look at all the people that Genuinely Recover from “terrible Psychiatric Illnesses” on this website – they all
Recover through abandoning Psychiatry.
“Schizophrenia”
Major Tranquillisers are very disabling. How does a person come off them?
Through very careful drug taper and the application of effective psychological techniques to deal with the High Anxiety the process causes.
Where can effective anti anxiety techniques be found?
From Books. From the Internet.
From Buddhist Temples
From Personal Stories
From personal observation.
From Self Help Groups.
From Psychologists
What works for Normal Anxiety – works for Extreme Anxiety.
Straightforward Psychotherapy:-
Most people can identify with “Emotional Reasoning” or “Catastrophisation” – getting stuck on a problem inside in the head, and not being able to work it out, or to put it down.
On withdrawal from strong psychiatric drugs “Emotional Reasoning” can take over.
Straightforward Psychotherapy would be about learning how to put a problem down, until the head levels off, and the problem becomes manageable.
What More Do You Want:-
“Schizophrenia” (which I don’t believe in) is the Big Psychiatric Diagnosis.
I was treated in the Famous Maudsley Hospital 1980, Kings College, London and the Ground Breaking Research NUIG (Regional)
Hospital Ireland 1980/1.
I recovered as a result of responsibly stopping treatment and straightforward Psychotherapy (and have remained well for the past 36 years).
Heavy alcohol use and heavy cocaine use can be linked to “funny thinking” as well as can too much McDonalds.
Heavy Cannabis use might be linked to Cannabis “funny thinking”. But this is NOT “Schizophrenia” its Cannabis “funny thinking”.
The vast majority of “doctors” in “Mental Health” (from what I can see) are doing more harm than good (through ignorance); with most “doctors” in other medicines supporting them.
Major Tranquillisers AKA “Antipsychotics” don’t show any efficacy either. “Antipsychotics” disable people and disable everything else belonging to them.
“…The origins of the dominant mental health care paradigm of the antidepressant era were identified in multiple forms: fraudulent promotion, biased education by drug companies, captured regulators, institutional ideologies, ghost-written clinical practice guidelines, poor quality product information and drug approval procedures that ensured neither safety nor efficacy….”
A Semantic Quibble? He’s telling lies!
I would imagine, what you have in Toronto is a large anonymous city and “patients in the community” with diagnoses like “Schizophrenia”.
I don’t think Ireland has any law forcing people to take medication outside of hospital; and I’ve often remarked on how in the 1980s it was very uncommon for anyone in crisis to meet police. But at that time everyone (to a certain extent) knew everyone and staff were very diplomatic.
All my hospitalizations bar the first at Ireland, were voluntary – and I made recovery as a result of carefully reducing medication and eventually stopping.
But I also noticed the very high dependency in Ireland (among young men) – on long term injections that eventually turn everyone who takes them into psychiatric patients.
I’m 60 now and most of the “young male patients” I knew in the 1980s have been dead for a long time.
Actually, a lot of the work can now be done by IT and robots. The only reason we need to work is to keep us busy!
“Medication” didn’t work for me.
I remember being amazed when this famous “Psychiatrist”
Brendan Kelly & Muiris Houston
“Psychiatrist in the Chair The Official Biography of Anthony Clare”
4.0 out of 5 stars (13)
…its claimed Dr Anthony Clare (towards the end) had suffered from “Depression”. I wonder if “medications” might have caused his heart attack at 64 years of age.
(As I got older myself I had to stop taking even minuscule “medication”, because of the heart rhythm problems the “medication” was causing).
The “Antipsychotics” have nearly killed me a few times.
I’d imagine in the UK that the emergency services cannot deal with the amount of people in distress begging for help; and I wonder why, at the same time, doctors put so much emphasis on minor indisgressions of “well” people. It’s a conundrum.
11.35 minutes into this clip a man speaks in a straightforward tone of his daughter being safe, but his son being still trapped in the rubble (while bodies are being removed).
Politicians today, talking about other peoples tragedies often wipe a tear from their eyes.
I agree completely.
Thank You Dana for your Informative Article, I’m very interested in the airing of this subject.
James, Is the Council of Evidence based Psychiatry limited to ‘Professionals’?
Dr Timimi (correction of Above)
Tranquillisers will always fail over time:-
“…Seeman, in his studies of drug-induced dopamine supersensitivity, concluded in 2007 that this was why antipsychotics fail over time….”
I know a chap in London who gets a decent rate for being “mentally ill”, he’s prescribed medication which he can take or not take – and the doctor is happy as well!
James,
As someone thats successfully withdrawn from Neuroleptic Depot Injections and made Longterm Recovery as a result (and can substantiate this), can I become active in the Council and attend your Meetings?
For me Recovery from “Schizophrenia” involved coming off the strong psychiatric drugs very carefully; and learning how to deal with the “High Anxiety”, the exposure to these drugs had caused!
That’s my experience!
When I came back to London in 1986 the ‘Irish Social Worker’ I had seen in 1980 asked me if I still took drugs, and I told him I did take a little prescribed medication; he shook his head and said “no, I mean street drugs”.
He was 100% convinced I had been under the influence of illicit substance when I visited him in 1980. “Schizophrenia” had not at all been on his Radar.
We all know that attacking “witches” in the “middle ages” was ignorant and wrong, but it seems the same thing is going on today and “everyone” accepts it, and its “legally” promoted.
(In the Middle Ages the Witchfinders even had a Special Book they could refer to to prove that the person really was a Witch).
If there’s ‘no such thing’ as Autism then where do the Doctors promoting Autism go? They have no ‘skills’ in any other area.
I wouldn’t (myself) argue with the term Dual Diagnosis, but I would argue with Psychologists mixing themselves up with peer groups.
The Hearing Voices “peer” groups in London are all run by “officials” and are mostly only open during normal working hours. In whose benefit is this?
SpellBinding
One thing that people that take “medication” often recognize is – that when they try to stop taking the “medication” they immediately run into trouble. But this phenomenon can now be scientifically explained :-
The only requirement for membership to the AA (as far as I know) – is a desire to stop drinking.
Thank you Dr Timimi,
What I noticed in the Maudsley Hospital in London in 1980 was that it was full of young people who looked like they had nothing wrong with them, describing themselves as “Schizophrenic” and “Manic Depressive”.
I could do without medication in 1980. But when I tried to come off medication in 1983, I found myself running into serious trouble:-
Up to $7,000 per month equalling (up to) $84,000 per year – Who Pays??
I thought it was common knowledge that ‘antipsychotics’ often ‘masked’ the symptoms of Tardive Dyskinesia until the drug was withdrawn. Do the new “TD drugs” operate in the same way?
I notice a lot of focus on loneliness these days and it’s a bit like when famous people claim to be BiPolar. The famous people are lovable for having it but an ordinary person might be inferior.
“…While social isolation is a physical and social reality, it does not necessitate that the experience of loneliness ensues….” This is true.
“…The state of agitation that sudden or too-fast withdrawal of the stimulant can induce will look like the “ADHD” coming back with a vengeance, convincing all, including the doctors—few of whom seem to understand the above process—that the child really does need the amphetamine for more “normal” functioning…”
“…Neurobiology
The researchers explain that “relapse” of psychotic experiences after discontinuing antipsychotics, especially very soon after stopping the drug, is likely due to withdrawal effects. One strong piece of evidence for this is that people who don’t have psychotic experiences but who are given antipsychotics for other, unrelated conditions (like nausea or lactation problems) sometimes end up experiencing psychosis after stopping the drugs…”
Is it possible that ‘legitimate’ medical practice has been the problem here.
Thank you Dr Tamimi,
You explain things very well.
Thank you for this Article,
“…Throughout these writings, she has challenged many assertions of mainstream psychiatry, often to the annoyance of leading figures in the field…”
I can identify!
Thanks,
This is very good information!
It would mean that Black People were NOT 10 times more likely to be diagnosed “Schizophrenic” as white people.
“….In 2006, ÆSOP reported a ninefold increase in the risk of developing schizophrenia in black Caribbeans when compared with the white British population:….”
But “Mental Health Care” (IMO) is a load of Bo**ocks, anyway!
“…..indeed probably most of modern medicine is manufactured and shaped and spun by experts….”
If you factor for, infant mortality infectious disease, and accidents you would probably find life expectancy to be better among basic people, 100 years ago, than it is now.
Brilliant Altostrata,
Using the Internet to provide what people need!
Thank you Dr Emaline, I hope I’m not too far off topic.
When I came off Drugs “suitable for Schizophrenia” I still had to learn how to cope with the Disabling Anxiety the exposure to the drugs had caused*.
I learned to cope with the Disabling Anxiety in the same way as someone might learn to cope with Normal Anxiety. So I think “Schizophrenia” might be considered a condition of “Disabling Anxiety” – that easily falls within the scope of human assistance.
..advises “Schizophrenics” in distress – his advice is often very simple and straightforward (but maybe not obvious to the distressed person at the time).
When medical doctor and Psychotherapist, Dr Terry Lynch brings a terminal “Schizophrenic” “back to life”, he cheerfully helps the person to gradually build themselves up with tasks, to demonstrate their real ability to them.
*I initially refused strong Psychiatric Drugs (and remained non functional for the years I consumed them, costing the Irish taxpayer a Lot of Money).
“…Walden who lost a son to opioids . . “. They killed lots and lots of people; but if they go to prison – who else might eventually go to prison?
Medically Psychopathic Behaviour
“….An inquest in 2018 ruled that the use of olanzapine was appropriate …”
What the Inquest says is “..if necessary a doctor can kill a patient in MH..”
This is a case that Doctors have been ‘found out’ in, but the reality could be – that they regularly Kill within ‘Mental Health’, and consider it to be their right to do so.
I have presented my own experience previously on Mad In America.
The ‘Elephant in the Living Room’ here, has got to be that most “Schizophrenics” that “Act Out” in the Community have recently come off “medication” (and are not suffering from “Insanity” but from “Drug Induced Withdrawal Syndrome” i.e. They Are Innocent).
There are no vitamins in the supermarket!
Thanks Karen,
The whole thing about this “form of medicine”, is to gain “co operation” from the patient.
Schizophrenia is treatable isnt it? So if the person gets treatment they get on with their lives don’t they?
Thank You Dr Timimi,
I’ll need to read this article carefully.
Macdonaldisation:- about 2 million people are in jail in America, 1% percent of people in America are estimated ‘Schizophrenic’ , 1% estimated Autistic, up to 10% with ADHD, several per cent estimated Bipolar, and several per cent Depressed and Anxious. So theres lots of ‘unreliable’ people in the Country.
Once a person processed as a Psychiatric Patient tries to come off their “antipsychotics” they will more than likely go MAD.
When a “Schizophrenic” stops taking his “medication” he generally “relapses” – as does a person misdiagnosed with “Schizophrenia” (and put on “medication”).
“…Neurobiology
The researchers explain that “relapse” of psychotic experiences after discontinuing antipsychotics, especially very soon after stopping the drug, is likely due to withdrawal effects. One strong piece of evidence for this is that people who don’t have psychotic experiences but who are given antipsychotics for other, unrelated conditions (like nausea or lactation problems) sometimes end up experiencing psychosis after stopping the drugs…”
Apologies if I’m slightly off topic above.
I never really got to sample the “new wonder drugs” because by the time these drugs came to the market I had cut mysdlf down to miniscule non intrusive doses of the really old drugs, and that was good enough for me.
Then the old drugs were removed and I did try miniscule doses of the new drugs.
Ultimately my GPs tried to make out I must be severely unwell mentally because I was prepared to consume very small doses of these new drugs, so I stopped taking the new drugs, but when I did I also discovered that they had no psychiatric effect whatsoever, at the level I had consumed them.
I wondered why my UK GP s were so keen to attempt to discredit me – but as it happens I can see issues in my history that would provide reasons for their behaviour.
Thank you Alex,
CTO’S
A recent Article in Jama Psychiatry from Mark Howoritz, (Sir) Robin Murray, and David Taylor, Scientifically contradicts in my opinion – the use of CTOs.
VERY SLOW AS OPPOSED TO ABRUPT TAPER
The article recommends a Slow Neuroleptic Tapering approach. And “Neuroleptic Withdrawal Induced Psychosis” is acknowledged as a problem / as opposed to “Abrupt Medication Discontinuation Relapse”.
CTO ABRUPT NEUROLEPTIC TAPER
Since most attempted Neuroleptic Withdrawals fall into an Abrupt Category, then these failed Withdrawals do not indicate “Relapse or Return of Illness” but “Problems with Drug Withdrawal”.
“…As there is some evidence that not all patients need lifelong antipsychotic treatment and some may have improved social functioning when taking less or no antipsychotic, cautious deprescribing should be a component of high-quality prescribing practice….”
ABRUPT TAPER VERSUS VERY SLOW TAPER
My own MH Records reflect:- 4 Hospitalizations a Suicide Attempt and “A Near Miss” in 5 Months, following the Permission to withdraw Abruptly from a Fluphenazine Depot Injection ; and 36 Years of Continual Wellness following my own decision to Taper Very Carefully.
ALSO NEEDED…
In my own case a Very Careful Neuroleptic Taper wasn’t enough, I still need to gain an understanding of how my “Neuroleptic Withdrawal High Anxiety” “Worked” and “What I could do about it”.
The Heading says it!
(I consider “mental health” to be a law into itself -)…
Steve, I notice that I have more or less disappeared from the Discussion section. Is there any reason for this?
Everything useful presented in this Research, by the World Experts on the Subject, has already been presented on Mad in America (by the “independently recovered”) – but the professional acknowledgement (IMO) is also very worthwhile.
(I consider “Mental Health” to be a law unto itself .
When I complained at a GP Surgery some years ago about genuine misuse of information:- a “doctor” by way of comment recorded to my notes: “…mildly agitated but no sign of thought disorder..”. Which would be like me saying: “..I have full confidence that Dr xxx has not engaged in shoplifting in the past six months..” )
Hi Ted, Scary Stuff.
Singer Bob Geldoff confided that after his wife’s tragic death some years ago he seriously considered suicide as an option – but he wasn’t incarcerated for this.
UK Comedian Russell Brand supposedly has a diagnosis of “Bipolar” and Singer Elton John’s behaviour was supposedly erratic at one time – but neither of these stars were conferred with a (UK type) “Conservativeship”.
Sponging off the Welfare State
Since the Psychiatric system has little success anyway, I believe the genuine “Experts” are the people that reject the Psychiatric system.
I was diagnosed as a relapsing “Schizophrenic” in Western Ireland, until I made Recovery 30 plus years ago as a result of stopping Psychiatric treatment.
At this time 30 plus years ago: My Psychiatrist (a University Researcher) was on the examining board of the Royal College of Psychiatrists; and the Professor of Pharmacology (at the local University), was President of the British Association of Psychopharmacologists.
Psychiatry today is still useless
Another 1st Class exposure, Lawrence.
It’s even possible to develop withdrawal syndrome while consuming drugs like Xanax.
I’d imagine most normal people experience positive and negative social thoughts inside their heads, as people are social beings and life is socially competitive.
In my experience very few qualified doctors are capable of distinguishing between a social thought inside a person’s head and the hearing of Voices outside a person’s head.
…It is possible for people diagnosed with “Schizophrenia” to survive successfully without “medication” but it would be recommended they withdraw very carefully from neuroleptics, as these drugs can cause weaknesses in the brains systems.
As far as I know the authors don’t recommend any methods for dealing with the “Neuroleptic Exposure High Anxiety”
– this is what’s missing from the paper.
The solutions can be found in Straightforward Psychology.
Sam,
Its amazing how successful the ‘information block’ (in these times) can be. People that ‘rock the boat’ can find themselves permanently unemployable.
“Peer” has got to be mutual support from others with similar experience. The Hearing Voices Network in London is only open during normal working hours, and I believe mostly supervised by non voice hearers. Can this be “peer” support?
Steve
Your account reminds me of my “Rehabilitation” many years ago, when a nurse explained to me that the way to get into work, was to start with half days and extend to full days.
I remember visiting a friend of mind (a shrewd psychiatric survivor) at the time, who advised me to go back to my Specialist and get my restlesness sorted out.
Once the restlessness was sorted out, I didn’t need rehabilitation .
Akithisia is “Stereotypical” – All Psychiatric staff should be able to identify it; and should be prepared to approach doctors neglecting their professional duties.
The main expressed problem my Consultant Psychiatrist had with me (many years ago) was my “inability to maintain routine” – but it was him that was sponging off the Welfare State – NOT me.
Philip, do you not think you’re being a bit hard on Dr Pies? (I’m being sarcastic!)
POTENTIAL NEOLIBERALISM
EMAIL TO ME:
FROM THE HEALTH AND SAFETY EXECUTIVE, CONCERNS OFFICER
20 January 2021 at 16.27
Subject: Re Possibility of Exposure to Asbestos
Dear Mr Xxxxx
Health and Safety at Work etc Act 1974
You recently contacted the Health and Safety Executive (HSE) with concerns about work you conducted on an artex ceiling, and thank you for the additional information/photographs provided.
The primary legislation that covers working with asbestos is the Control of Asbestos Regulations. The risk from asbestos arises when asbestos fibres released into the air are breathed in. Whilst there is no “safe “level we do publish control limits for the maximum concentration of fibres that those working with asbestos should be exposed to. Work with asbestos that is likely to result in exposures at above the control limit should only be carried out by a contractor licensed by HSE.
Some asbestos-containing-materials (ACMS) are less friable and therefore much less likely to give rise to airborne asbestos fibres; this is because the fibres are held firmly within a solid non –asbestos substrate. In non-coatings- friable materials such as asbestos cement, textured coatings such as artex, and vinyl floor tiles, the asbestos fibres are held firmly within a dense, rigid, on-asbestos substrate and there is much less risk of them becoming air-borne. Artex is in the category of the lowest risk asbestos containing materials.
In conclusion, I do not consider that there is sufficient evidence of risk to prompt the intervention of HSE.
Further guidance can be found on our website Asbestos.
Yours sincerely
Xxxxx Xxxxxx Concerns Officer
30-watt-lightbulb,
I reckon theres probably quite a few people that had these drugs in the womb and don’t feel at all okay in the world, and can’t understand why.
I believe I’ve met people like this – who certainly did find a way out of the predicament.
Hi Sam, I second that. It’s a fantastic interview that explains what the ‘misunderstandings’ are.
I notice that the UK is probably the most advanced country in the World in turning the tables on the “chemical solution”, and has been for a while!
“Schizophrenia” is no longer guaranteed.
Hi Philip,
I believe “psychiatry” is in a sense going out of business, as there are less and less doctors interested in practising it!
Richard, “Killing For Profit” couldn’t be written about enough.
Theres a complete “Lockdown” in Medical, Pharmaceutical, Governmental swindling. The Pharmaceutical Industry practically controls even elected Governments.
“….But here is the uncomfortable conundrum. Wherever you find mental health services to have expanded with more people receiving what is considered to be mental health treatments (whether these are psychological or drugs) you find a parallel increase in the numbers who have been classed as disabled due to a mental health disorder…”
DISABLED
My psychiatrists main problem with me, when I was a young man, was my inability to work. He told me that if I could hold down a job for 3 months he would take me off all “medications”.
When I challenged him on the side effects of the “medication”(involuntary movements), and he tried to do something about this, but was unable – he offered to take me off the Modecate injection completely.
When I came off the modecate depot injection, I had several hospitalizations, a suicide attempt, and a near suicide attempt.
I then put myself on a Longterm Drug Taper with Oral “medication” (and discovered how to manage the psychological withdrawal problems).
…And I was no longer Disabled.
Thanks Peter,
When the Richest People in the world want to stop drinking they go to Anonymous Peer Fellowships.
The reason they do this is because the Peer Fellowships are the most successful.
The Fellowships are successful, because they contain people with longterm successful experience of substance withdrawal.
Also, peers can back a person up (24 hrs) when medical people are not available.
I don’t believe in Mental Illness.
“…There is no other medical specialty like psychiatry where its theoretical underpinnings result in patients dying over 20 years earlier than the national average, for “disorders” like schizophrenia, bipolar, and ADHD that themselves present no fatal biological disease! ….”
“…..A good case can be made that many of the difficulties he had in the 1980s stemmed from the medication he was put on for a possible schizophrenia or schizoaffective disorder. ..”
From one of the last Doctors to see me in the 1980s.
Thank you Dr Timimi,
“…Diagnoses in psychiatry are not diagnoses..”
After 65 years of Neuroleptics (and “Longterm Schizophrenia”) researchers like Professor Robin Murray are now “promoting an idea” that it’s possible to carefully withdraw from Neuroleptics and improve as a result.
Professor Robin Murray also “promotes an idea” that when a person comes off drugs quickly and goes mad – it’s the original presence of the drugs, that is more than likely causing the madness.
Even though It took me 6 years to go from 25mg of Modecate per month to 25mg of Mellaril per day. Anxiety was still a big thing with me. But thankfully I was able to find ways of dealing with it.
Twelve step fellowship supports an idea of “acceptance being the key” – “acceptance in terms of Equanamity” for me is definitely the key.
I was at a 12 step meeting last night and some people present related their experience of being raised on disadvantaged London council estates. They said their neighbour’s might be Drug Dealers or Bank Robbers – but the “Nutters” were the ones everyone was really frightened of.
But since most “Nutters” come off their drugs abruptly without the advice they should be given, then they cannot be held responsible for going mad. I went mad several times when I attempted to stop taking drugs abruptly, with medical support. I had to completely abandon the medical approach to recover.
Trick or Treat
“…A coalition of health bodies wrote to the Government urging it to update legislation to ensure medical workers do not feel ‘vulnerable to the risk of prosecution for unlawful killing’ when treating coronavirus patients ‘in circumstances beyond their control…”. Todays Daily Mail
Health Minister Matt Hancock says:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9160967/Covid-UK-Hancock-says-law-change-protect-GPs-legal-action-not-necessary.html
https://www.inverness-courier.co.uk/news/national/law-change-to-protect-medics-from-legal-action-not-necessary-hancock-11203/
POTENTIAL NEOLIBERALISM
EMAIL FROM ME TO SITE MANAGER
11 January 2021 13:09
Subject: Possibility of Exposure to Asbestos
Please find attached:
Photo 1 of Ceiling taken on November 30, 2020
Photo 2 of Ceiling taken on January 5, 2021
I talked to you this morning about my concerns regarding the possibility that I had been exposed to asbestos while working on ceilings before and after Christmas at XXX.
This morning at your office you provided me with a large folder from which I had difficulty finding information. I was then provided with an emailed Asbestos Survey which you suggested might be more helpful.
I’ve since looked through the (emailed) Asbestos Survey and I don’t see any relevant samples taken from ceilings in rooms XX (XXX Room) and XX (XXX Room) (as you call them). But I do see photos towards the end of the Survey of ceilings with textured covering all identified as containing Asbestos.
I’m still concerned, as this Survey does not reassure me.
Please return to me on this.
Yours Sincerely
ME
Sent: 12 January 2021 08:22
REPLY FROM SITE MANAGER
Subject: RE: Possibility of Exposure to Asbestos
The survey is carried out by professional company, and they only take sample of material they suspect to contain ACM. So the 2 rooms in question did not have any material which required testing, so would not be logged to have samples taken and analysed.
KIND REGARDS, SITE MANAGER
12 Jan at 09:37
EMAIL TO ME FROM PROJECT MANAGER
Subject: RE: Possibility of Exposure to Asbestos
We also had the XXX surveyor on site yesterday as he is preparing the final report of the removal of all asbestos for information for the O&M manual for the XXX.
I showed him the two rooms and the ‘suspect’ materials you showed in your photos. He had no concerns that these were ACMs. He is a very experienced surveyor, and he carried out the initial survey – they only test or sample substances they deem necessary. The R&D survey was full and complete and all asbestos containing materials present were removed apart from in some underground duct areas, the basement and the 12 main xxxxrooms which have been encapsulated by over-boarding.
You really have no need to be concerned.
REGARDS, PROJECT MANAGER
SURVEY DISCLAIMER
XXX completed this survey on the basis of a specified program of work and terms and conditions agreed with the Client. All reasonable skill and care, bearing in mind the project objectives and the agreed scope of work, have been exercised during the preparation of this survey report.
Following the issue of this survey report, responsibility to any parties for any matters arising, which may be considered outside of the agreed scope of work, will not be accepted by XXX.
This survey report is confidential. XXX will accept liability to no parties with the exception of the Client. Without the written agreement of XXX, no one with the exception of the Client, may rely upon or have the benefit of this survey report.
XXX asserts and retains all copyright, and other intellectual property rights, in and over the survey report and its contents unless these rights were specifically assigned or transferred within the terms of the agreement.
Any questions or matters arising from this survey report should be addressed to XXX.
Thank you Dr Timimi
“…Anything that offers success in our unjust society without trying to change it is not revolutionary..”
“Mindfulness”
Most people I know are at the same economic or social level as I am, some of them work for a living and some of them don’t. If I can be at peace with my “internal situations” I can be happy and focus on my external situations.
Some people might be externally harassed all the time and anyone could end up like this; but a lot of other people aren’t, and can improve the quality of their lives from inside themselves.
The most successful psychotherapy I know of, comes from the completely free 12 Step Movement; which has a lot of internal change attached to it.
I think, this late but eventual acknowledgement from ‘Horowitz, Murray, and Taylor’ is also extremely important
https://www.madinamerica.com/2020/09/slow-taper-best-antipsychotic-discontinuation/
That it is possible to come off “antipsychotics” (and make recovery as a result) – but that coming off them abruptly can drive a person MAD.
It’s difficult to rely on people if everything is subterfuge! But it’s always been like this!
MISSD
Dr Wayne W Dyer said ‘Alcoholics Anonymous is where Jesus walks on Earth’. In my opinion Akathisia is where Hell exists on Earth.
The experience of Akathisia cannot be described.
‘Depression Delusion’ by Dr Terry Lynch was one of the best books I ever read. It was available on Amazon at a very reasonable price, and was ‘electric’ all the way through.
IMO the 1 percent of people at the top need good looking servants to look after them and other professionals to do their bidding and thats about it!
85 percent of the work people do, could be reorganised and automated – this work is preserved to keep people occupied.
It sounds like they want to have their cake and eat it!
Thank you for writing this credible account about your experience. I’m very sorry for your suffering, it was dreadful.
I used to think “Psychiatrists” were doctors that could be trusted.
I notice when children are out and about with their parents they often appear happy and good natured, but when they’re mixing with other children in a school setting they often appear small and weak.
Even in the aftermath of the “Haiti disaster” (years ago) the ‘poor’ Haiti child on television looked healthier (to me) than the average ‘European’ school child.
The basic needs in education are the 3 rs: Reading, Writing, and Arithmetic. After this anything else that’s needed can be self acquired.
Dr Timimi, this chapter is brilliant and very true.
I don’t personally believe that most people become rich through hard work, I believe that most people become rich through being connected.
When I was at school in the1970s in Ireland the French teacher (in her twenties) encouraged a very boisterous class. There was one particular boy who was extremely boisterous and I wouldn’t repeat (even now) some of the jokes he made in the class (and got away with).
I bumped into him again years ago, in a bar in Ireland. He was drinking beer and he was a lot bigger. He was very friendly and he told me he was living in New York and working in the Bronx as a teacher.
People also seem to be able to come off drugs like cannabis without too much difficulty. But attempting to come off psychiatric drugs can lead to all types of disasters.
If you look at all the people that Genuinely Recover from “terrible Psychiatric Illnesses” on this website – they all
Recover through abandoning Psychiatry.
“Schizophrenia”
Major Tranquillisers are very disabling. How does a person come off them?
Through very careful drug taper and the application of effective psychological techniques to deal with the High Anxiety the process causes.
Where can effective anti anxiety techniques be found?
From Books. From the Internet.
From Buddhist Temples
From Personal Stories
From personal observation.
From Self Help Groups.
From Psychologists
What works for Normal Anxiety – works for Extreme Anxiety.
Straightforward Psychotherapy:-
Most people can identify with “Emotional Reasoning” or “Catastrophisation” – getting stuck on a problem inside in the head, and not being able to work it out, or to put it down.
On withdrawal from strong psychiatric drugs “Emotional Reasoning” can take over.
Straightforward Psychotherapy would be about learning how to put a problem down, until the head levels off, and the problem becomes manageable.
What More Do You Want:-
“Schizophrenia” (which I don’t believe in) is the Big Psychiatric Diagnosis.
I was treated in the Famous Maudsley Hospital 1980, Kings College, London and the Ground Breaking Research NUIG (Regional)
Hospital Ireland 1980/1.
I recovered as a result of responsibly stopping treatment and straightforward Psychotherapy (and have remained well for the past 36 years).
Heavy alcohol use and heavy cocaine use can be linked to “funny thinking” as well as can too much McDonalds.
Heavy Cannabis use might be linked to Cannabis “funny thinking”. But this is NOT “Schizophrenia” its Cannabis “funny thinking”.
The vast majority of “doctors” in “Mental Health” (from what I can see) are doing more harm than good (through ignorance); with most “doctors” in other medicines supporting them.
Major Tranquillisers AKA “Antipsychotics” don’t show any efficacy either. “Antipsychotics” disable people and disable everything else belonging to them.
“Captured Regulators”
https://www.survivingantidepressants.org/topic/6383-dr-yolande-lucire-adverse-reactions-to-psychiatric-drugs/page/3/
“…The origins of the dominant mental health care paradigm of the antidepressant era were identified in multiple forms: fraudulent promotion, biased education by drug companies, captured regulators, institutional ideologies, ghost-written clinical practice guidelines, poor quality product information and drug approval procedures that ensured neither safety nor efficacy….”
A Semantic Quibble? He’s telling lies!
I would imagine, what you have in Toronto is a large anonymous city and “patients in the community” with diagnoses like “Schizophrenia”.
I don’t think Ireland has any law forcing people to take medication outside of hospital; and I’ve often remarked on how in the 1980s it was very uncommon for anyone in crisis to meet police. But at that time everyone (to a certain extent) knew everyone and staff were very diplomatic.
All my hospitalizations bar the first at Ireland, were voluntary – and I made recovery as a result of carefully reducing medication and eventually stopping.
But I also noticed the very high dependency in Ireland (among young men) – on long term injections that eventually turn everyone who takes them into psychiatric patients.
I’m 60 now and most of the “young male patients” I knew in the 1980s have been dead for a long time.
Actually, a lot of the work can now be done by IT and robots. The only reason we need to work is to keep us busy!
“Medication” didn’t work for me.
I remember being amazed when this famous “Psychiatrist”
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Clare
died prematurely in 2007.
In this recent Biography…
Brendan Kelly & Muiris Houston
“Psychiatrist in the Chair The Official Biography of Anthony Clare”
4.0 out of 5 stars (13)
…its claimed Dr Anthony Clare (towards the end) had suffered from “Depression”. I wonder if “medications” might have caused his heart attack at 64 years of age.
(As I got older myself I had to stop taking even minuscule “medication”, because of the heart rhythm problems the “medication” was causing).
The “Antipsychotics” have nearly killed me a few times.
https://insights.ovid.com/clinical-psychopharmacology/jcps/1983/08/000/suicide-associated-akathisia-depot-fluphenazine/6/00004714
I’d imagine in the UK that the emergency services cannot deal with the amount of people in distress begging for help; and I wonder why, at the same time, doctors put so much emphasis on minor indisgressions of “well” people. It’s a conundrum.
Beautiful article Karin,
These labels are too much trouble (I think)!
Aberfan
https://youtu.be/CPjD4QHYCuA
11.35 minutes into this clip a man speaks in a straightforward tone of his daughter being safe, but his son being still trapped in the rubble (while bodies are being removed).
Politicians today, talking about other peoples tragedies often wipe a tear from their eyes.
I agree completely.
Thank You Dana for your Informative Article, I’m very interested in the airing of this subject.
James, Is the Council of Evidence based Psychiatry limited to ‘Professionals’?
Dr Timimi (correction of Above)
Tranquillisers will always fail over time:-
“…Seeman, in his studies of drug-induced dopamine supersensitivity, concluded in 2007 that this was why antipsychotics fail over time….”
I know a chap in London who gets a decent rate for being “mentally ill”, he’s prescribed medication which he can take or not take – and the doctor is happy as well!
James,
As someone thats successfully withdrawn from Neuroleptic Depot Injections and made Longterm Recovery as a result (and can substantiate this), can I become active in the Council and attend your Meetings?
For me Recovery from “Schizophrenia” involved coming off the strong psychiatric drugs very carefully; and learning how to deal with the “High Anxiety”, the exposure to these drugs had caused!
That’s my experience!
When I came back to London in 1986 the ‘Irish Social Worker’ I had seen in 1980 asked me if I still took drugs, and I told him I did take a little prescribed medication; he shook his head and said “no, I mean street drugs”.
He was 100% convinced I had been under the influence of illicit substance when I visited him in 1980. “Schizophrenia” had not at all been on his Radar.
We all know that attacking “witches” in the “middle ages” was ignorant and wrong, but it seems the same thing is going on today and “everyone” accepts it, and its “legally” promoted.
(In the Middle Ages the Witchfinders even had a Special Book they could refer to to prove that the person really was a Witch).
If there’s ‘no such thing’ as Autism then where do the Doctors promoting Autism go? They have no ‘skills’ in any other area.
I wouldn’t (myself) argue with the term Dual Diagnosis, but I would argue with Psychologists mixing themselves up with peer groups.
The Hearing Voices “peer” groups in London are all run by “officials” and are mostly only open during normal working hours. In whose benefit is this?
SpellBinding
One thing that people that take “medication” often recognize is – that when they try to stop taking the “medication” they immediately run into trouble. But this phenomenon can now be scientifically explained :-
https://www.madinamerica.com/2020/09/slow-taper-best-antipsychotic-discontinuation/
The only requirement for membership to the AA (as far as I know) – is a desire to stop drinking.
Thank you Dr Timimi,
What I noticed in the Maudsley Hospital in London in 1980 was that it was full of young people who looked like they had nothing wrong with them, describing themselves as “Schizophrenic” and “Manic Depressive”.
I could do without medication in 1980. But when I tried to come off medication in 1983, I found myself running into serious trouble:-
https://www.madinamerica.com/2020/09/slow-taper-best-antipsychotic-discontinuation/
Up to $7,000 per month equalling (up to) $84,000 per year – Who Pays??
I thought it was common knowledge that ‘antipsychotics’ often ‘masked’ the symptoms of Tardive Dyskinesia until the drug was withdrawn. Do the new “TD drugs” operate in the same way?
I notice a lot of focus on loneliness these days and it’s a bit like when famous people claim to be BiPolar. The famous people are lovable for having it but an ordinary person might be inferior.
“…While social isolation is a physical and social reality, it does not necessitate that the experience of loneliness ensues….” This is true.
“…The state of agitation that sudden or too-fast withdrawal of the stimulant can induce will look like the “ADHD” coming back with a vengeance, convincing all, including the doctors—few of whom seem to understand the above process—that the child really does need the amphetamine for more “normal” functioning…”
https://www.madinamerica.com/2020/09/slow-taper-best-antipsychotic-discontinuation/
“…Neurobiology
The researchers explain that “relapse” of psychotic experiences after discontinuing antipsychotics, especially very soon after stopping the drug, is likely due to withdrawal effects. One strong piece of evidence for this is that people who don’t have psychotic experiences but who are given antipsychotics for other, unrelated conditions (like nausea or lactation problems) sometimes end up experiencing psychosis after stopping the drugs…”
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapsychiatry/article-abstract/2769191
Most people “relapse” when they “stop” taking “their medication”.
Are these drugs likely to cause Tardive Dyskinesia, or make Tardive Dyskinesia worse in the long run?
Great comment, registeredforthissite.
Baby Deaths Tragedy
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/11/12/cheshire-hospital-baby-deaths-nurse-appear-court-charged-eight/
Is it possible that ‘legitimate’ medical practice has been the problem here.
Thank you Dr Tamimi,
You explain things very well.
Thank you for this Article,
“…Throughout these writings, she has challenged many assertions of mainstream psychiatry, often to the annoyance of leading figures in the field…”
I can identify!
Thanks,
This is very good information!
It would mean that Black People were NOT 10 times more likely to be diagnosed “Schizophrenic” as white people.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2418996/
“….In 2006, ÆSOP reported a ninefold increase in the risk of developing schizophrenia in black Caribbeans when compared with the white British population:….”
But “Mental Health Care” (IMO) is a load of Bo**ocks, anyway!
“…..indeed probably most of modern medicine is manufactured and shaped and spun by experts….”
If you factor for, infant mortality infectious disease, and accidents you would probably find life expectancy to be better among basic people, 100 years ago, than it is now.
Brilliant Altostrata,
Using the Internet to provide what people need!
Thank you Dr Emaline, I hope I’m not too far off topic.
When I came off Drugs “suitable for Schizophrenia” I still had to learn how to cope with the Disabling Anxiety the exposure to the drugs had caused*.
I learned to cope with the Disabling Anxiety in the same way as someone might learn to cope with Normal Anxiety. So I think “Schizophrenia” might be considered a condition of “Disabling Anxiety” – that easily falls within the scope of human assistance.
When Psychologist Rufus May Phd ..
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rufus_May
..advises “Schizophrenics” in distress – his advice is often very simple and straightforward (but maybe not obvious to the distressed person at the time).
When medical doctor and Psychotherapist, Dr Terry Lynch brings a terminal “Schizophrenic” “back to life”, he cheerfully helps the person to gradually build themselves up with tasks, to demonstrate their real ability to them.
*I initially refused strong Psychiatric Drugs (and remained non functional for the years I consumed them, costing the Irish taxpayer a Lot of Money).
“…Walden who lost a son to opioids . . “. They killed lots and lots of people; but if they go to prison – who else might eventually go to prison?
Medically Psychopathic Behaviour
“….An inquest in 2018 ruled that the use of olanzapine was appropriate …”
What the Inquest says is “..if necessary a doctor can kill a patient in MH..”
This is a case that Doctors have been ‘found out’ in, but the reality could be – that they regularly Kill within ‘Mental Health’, and consider it to be their right to do so.
I have presented my own experience previously on Mad In America.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1vYO9r1FkdJSv8Bi8Q3c3u9WXNZXkmxvO/view?usp=drivesdk
Insanity or Akathisia
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/criminal-court/deirdre-morley-expected-to-plead-not-guilty-due-to-insanity-of-murdering-her-children-1.4384982?mode=amp
Yes “Compliance”
Someone Else,
The treatments cause “Schizophrenia”:-
I was okay not taking ‘medication’ in 1980, but by 1983 when I tried to come off ‘medication’, I couldn’t survive (inside my head) without it.
This phenomenon has been acknowledged recently by “Experts in the Field”:-
https://www.madinamerica.com/2020/09/slow-taper-best-antipsychotic-discontinuation/
The ‘Elephant in the Living Room’ here, has got to be that most “Schizophrenics” that “Act Out” in the Community have recently come off “medication” (and are not suffering from “Insanity” but from “Drug Induced Withdrawal Syndrome” i.e. They Are Innocent).
There are no vitamins in the supermarket!
Thanks Karen,
The whole thing about this “form of medicine”, is to gain “co operation” from the patient.
Schizophrenia is treatable isnt it? So if the person gets treatment they get on with their lives don’t they?
Thank You Dr Timimi,
I’ll need to read this article carefully.
Macdonaldisation:- about 2 million people are in jail in America, 1% percent of people in America are estimated ‘Schizophrenic’ , 1% estimated Autistic, up to 10% with ADHD, several per cent estimated Bipolar, and several per cent Depressed and Anxious. So theres lots of ‘unreliable’ people in the Country.
This is the correct LINK
https://www.madinamerica.com/2020/09/slow-taper-best-antipsychotic-discontinuation/
Once a person processed as a Psychiatric Patient tries to come off their “antipsychotics” they will more than likely go MAD.
When a “Schizophrenic” stops taking his “medication” he generally “relapses” – as does a person misdiagnosed with “Schizophrenia” (and put on “medication”).
https://www.madinamerica.com/2020/09/slow-taper-best-antipsychotic-discontinuation/
“…Neurobiology
The researchers explain that “relapse” of psychotic experiences after discontinuing antipsychotics, especially very soon after stopping the drug, is likely due to withdrawal effects. One strong piece of evidence for this is that people who don’t have psychotic experiences but who are given antipsychotics for other, unrelated conditions (like nausea or lactation problems) sometimes end up experiencing psychosis after stopping the drugs…”
Apologies if I’m slightly off topic above.
I never really got to sample the “new wonder drugs” because by the time these drugs came to the market I had cut mysdlf down to miniscule non intrusive doses of the really old drugs, and that was good enough for me.
Then the old drugs were removed and I did try miniscule doses of the new drugs.
Ultimately my GPs tried to make out I must be severely unwell mentally because I was prepared to consume very small doses of these new drugs, so I stopped taking the new drugs, but when I did I also discovered that they had no psychiatric effect whatsoever, at the level I had consumed them.
I wondered why my UK GP s were so keen to attempt to discredit me – but as it happens I can see issues in my history that would provide reasons for their behaviour.
Thank you Alex,
CTO’S
A recent Article in Jama Psychiatry from Mark Howoritz, (Sir) Robin Murray, and David Taylor, Scientifically contradicts in my opinion – the use of CTOs.
VERY SLOW AS OPPOSED TO ABRUPT TAPER
The article recommends a Slow Neuroleptic Tapering approach. And “Neuroleptic Withdrawal Induced Psychosis” is acknowledged as a problem / as opposed to “Abrupt Medication Discontinuation Relapse”.
CTO ABRUPT NEUROLEPTIC TAPER
Since most attempted Neuroleptic Withdrawals fall into an Abrupt Category, then these failed Withdrawals do not indicate “Relapse or Return of Illness” but “Problems with Drug Withdrawal”.
THE ARTICLE
https://www.madinamerica.com/2016/12/withdrawal-from-antipsychotics/#
Horowitz, Murray, and Taylor write,
“…As there is some evidence that not all patients need lifelong antipsychotic treatment and some may have improved social functioning when taking less or no antipsychotic, cautious deprescribing should be a component of high-quality prescribing practice….”
ABRUPT TAPER VERSUS VERY SLOW TAPER
My own MH Records reflect:- 4 Hospitalizations a Suicide Attempt and “A Near Miss” in 5 Months, following the Permission to withdraw Abruptly from a Fluphenazine Depot Injection ; and 36 Years of Continual Wellness following my own decision to Taper Very Carefully.
ALSO NEEDED…
In my own case a Very Careful Neuroleptic Taper wasn’t enough, I still need to gain an understanding of how my “Neuroleptic Withdrawal High Anxiety” “Worked” and “What I could do about it”.
The Heading says it!
(I consider “mental health” to be a law into itself -)…
Steve, I notice that I have more or less disappeared from the Discussion section. Is there any reason for this?
…Rain without thunder and lightning.
https://www.madinamerica.com/2020/09/slow-taper-best-antipsychotic-discontinuation/
Everything useful presented in this Research, by the World Experts on the Subject, has already been presented on Mad in America (by the “independently recovered”) – but the professional acknowledgement (IMO) is also very worthwhile.
(I consider “Mental Health” to be a law unto itself .
When I complained at a GP Surgery some years ago about genuine misuse of information:- a “doctor” by way of comment recorded to my notes: “…mildly agitated but no sign of thought disorder..”. Which would be like me saying: “..I have full confidence that Dr xxx has not engaged in shoplifting in the past six months..” )
Hi Ted, Scary Stuff.
Singer Bob Geldoff confided that after his wife’s tragic death some years ago he seriously considered suicide as an option – but he wasn’t incarcerated for this.
UK Comedian Russell Brand supposedly has a diagnosis of “Bipolar” and Singer Elton John’s behaviour was supposedly erratic at one time – but neither of these stars were conferred with a (UK type) “Conservativeship”.
Sponging off the Welfare State
Since the Psychiatric system has little success anyway, I believe the genuine “Experts” are the people that reject the Psychiatric system.
I was diagnosed as a relapsing “Schizophrenic” in Western Ireland, until I made Recovery 30 plus years ago as a result of stopping Psychiatric treatment.
At this time 30 plus years ago: My Psychiatrist (a University Researcher) was on the examining board of the Royal College of Psychiatrists; and the Professor of Pharmacology (at the local University), was President of the British Association of Psychopharmacologists.
Psychiatry today is still useless
Another 1st Class exposure, Lawrence.
It’s even possible to develop withdrawal syndrome while consuming drugs like Xanax.
I’d imagine most normal people experience positive and negative social thoughts inside their heads, as people are social beings and life is socially competitive.
In my experience very few qualified doctors are capable of distinguishing between a social thought inside a person’s head and the hearing of Voices outside a person’s head.
Bob
In this recent paper from prominent individuals..
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/343467517_Tapering_Antipsychotic_Treatment
…It is possible for people diagnosed with “Schizophrenia” to survive successfully without “medication” but it would be recommended they withdraw very carefully from neuroleptics, as these drugs can cause weaknesses in the brains systems.
As far as I know the authors don’t recommend any methods for dealing with the “Neuroleptic Exposure High Anxiety”
– this is what’s missing from the paper.
The solutions can be found in Straightforward Psychology.
Sam,
Its amazing how successful the ‘information block’ (in these times) can be. People that ‘rock the boat’ can find themselves permanently unemployable.
“Peer” has got to be mutual support from others with similar experience. The Hearing Voices Network in London is only open during normal working hours, and I believe mostly supervised by non voice hearers. Can this be “peer” support?
Steve
Your account reminds me of my “Rehabilitation” many years ago, when a nurse explained to me that the way to get into work, was to start with half days and extend to full days.
I remember visiting a friend of mind (a shrewd psychiatric survivor) at the time, who advised me to go back to my Specialist and get my restlesness sorted out.
Once the restlessness was sorted out, I didn’t need rehabilitation .
Akithisia is “Stereotypical” – All Psychiatric staff should be able to identify it; and should be prepared to approach doctors neglecting their professional duties.
The main expressed problem my Consultant Psychiatrist had with me (many years ago) was my “inability to maintain routine” – but it was him that was sponging off the Welfare State – NOT me.