Sunday, July 12, 2020

Comments by spinoff

Showing 7 of 7 comments.

  • madmon and sa,
    I think that the abuse of medicating in children has other implications, besides the issue of influencing negatively brain plasticity or general development: a “few little drops” at 4 years of age, became a substantial dose at 12/14, and tolerance and cumulative effects are hence for life. Somebody should do a naturalistic study on this
    I also think that the issue of leverage with the enormous impact that it has on informed consent is much greater on children particularly if they are learning disabled: either he takes the medication or he will be excluded, not just said but acted in many ways to obtain a result which leads sooner or later to stigma, and reprisals like exclusion..
    And the issue of off-label prescribing is a red herring. In fact antipsychotics which are prescribed in autism, where the evidence that there are some brain abnormalities is strong, do not stop causing a lowering of epileptic thresholds, or dysphagias, o diabetes etc because they are prescribed on-label, on the contrary.
    On the question of ceasing to call anti-psychotics by that name, I strongly disagree: They called them that name and they should respond for their use when there is not psychosis and for the doubtful effectiveness when there is. Calling them neuroleptics is hiding the felony-

  • First thank you very much for your information. I do not think I am allowed to give you here the contact for you to get information about the sentence, but I think you can get my e-mail address from MiA, and I will give it to you.
    As for your comments Tina I beg to disagree on a couple of them.
    1- My son is not a survivor of psychiatric oppression but it is a survivor of medical technology without which he would have been dead as a baby. He is a survivor too of an educational system who tried to “normalize” him, a dogma to be obeyed by means of insensitive techniques of behaviour modification. As regards the first it meant he spent the first 18 months of his life fighting for it with more than twenty episodes of resuscitation and numerous incidents of all kinds that affected his body and brain in various forms, As regards the second it meant that I had finally to take him out bleeding from the school, that we were accused of being irresponsible parents, and him of having wounded a teacher, which of course was a lie, and that he was excluded, stigmatized etc. I say all of this because one takes the abuses of psychiatry as if it was the work of psychiatrists alone, and I believe that, certainly in the case of intellectual disability, this is rarely the case. One certainly knows of dangerous operators motivated on domination and greed, and many more who simply are not interested on the subject of autism, but also some professionals with whom one can dialogue. In our case we were able to avoid the former but not the teachers, `psychologists, managers and politicians, (who in Spain are often the same) for whom domination and rejection was the objective. In America where reinboursement for certain defined medical acts seems the norm it might be different but in Europe the oppression, at least in the area of intellectual disability, (intrinsic, learning, not-ensued) has many more protagonists than psychiatrists and some will wash their hands and have the “doctors” taking the blame, which doctors often do happily .
    2-I do not agree in practice with your vision of a capacity for expression of subjectivity and rights although all my life I have taken those rights and subjectivity seriously both in my work and with my son. But he does not speak and spends most of his time with ritual activities, which start at six o´clock each morning and imply that at nine I have to spend nearly an hour clearing the mess. And various other problematic behaviours; in sum we live in a world of plastic, wood and metal, guess why. I could easily seek co-morbid diagnostics and drug him, but here I am forced to identify with him and put to his service what I know about drugs, no only in my work but what I have seen in a few youngsters who are autistic in the “autistic world” of associations. The question is: how would he like to have akathisia?, what would happen if he got a metabolic syndrome? He eats fast, he gulps, could he die of neuroleptic dysphagia? . Hence subjective rights exist because the other (us parents) want them to be applied and we have read the Convention, and those rights need objective referents, the studies that talk about those drugs and their effects. Left to his own without our patria potestatis he would have been tortured and dead long time ago,
    Sorry Tina for complicating things too much, paraphrasing Darwin, “there are facts that continuously complicate elegant theories”. But I am also aware that with the concept of “co-morbidity”, that instrument of professional cruelty and barbarism, and in Action T4, a piece of history grossly undervalued, we were and are together, mentally “ill” and intellectually disabled. We did not survive in nazi Germany and the consequences were infernal. This should be of great interest to the normals and a great reason for us to be united.

    Un cordial saludo.

    Mariano Almudevar

  • Thank you Tina.
    More mixes in your bag. I would be grateful for any guidance you can give me on the subject of learning disability and autism.
    Being the father of a young man with severe disability on those counts, I was faced with a “sugestion” of seeking a psychiatric garantee that the problems he had were not going to happen again. No examination of why or how those problems had appeared. Living in a small place, being a retired psychiatrist , and being aware of several serious recent adverse reactions to anti psychotic treatment including one death, I refused to seek an evaluation by a psychiatrist who did those sort of jobs and insisted that the one by my son’s regular psychiatrist was good enough, and demand that the facts were analyzed. My son, then, was excluded from services. We won a sentence in Court which was appealed by the administration in Spain’s Supreme Court. They lost the appeal and after 4 years my son exclusion could be starting to be solved, although reprisals, stigma and administrative silence are, I fear, still weapons at hand.
    We the parents miss support and guidance in these cases of severe disability where antipsychotics are used as a condition to access services and where the disabled person cannot exercise his rights not to be damaged and tortured. He is not, he will not be, a “survivor”, his illness is for ever.
    The use of antipsychotics in the disabled is I suspect generalized in Europe, and supported by KOLs, educators and the administrations. The Convention althoug morally sustaining, is generally ignored and in any case few parents are interested in it for the system is a clientelist one. They are hostages of it in the best of cases as I fear that in some situations they themselves use medication as a tool of control and even punishment. Fighting the system is a very lonely, expensive and at the end sentences are not particularly followed.
    The CRPD shoul be aware of this. Any ideas?

  • One aspect of benzos which is no talked about much is its role in impulsive actions including violence and suicide as well as its role in road accidents due to it and to a slowing down of reaction time to external cues. I have known an accidente of an adict to alprazolan which caused the death of three women, two of them in the incoming car. He survived, an is supposed to have quit the drugs,

  • I did not mean to be critical of this site, sorry. The example that irritates me in this respect is Götzsche, not MiA,
    I meant that in general the capacity to exercize informed consent is much greater in populations that are the object of ADs than in the ones that concern me. I took ADs for a while, after a bereavement and was cautious enough not to use big dosis and stop after a year; it was much easier than giving up smoking. And the dynamics of the abuses than I am referring to, are far more complicated than “those stupid psychiatrists” . Perhaps in Europe where reimboursements are not a key feature, things are different. And I aggree thta it does not have to be an either or situation.

  • Thank you Steven.

    Here in Spain I have a strikingly similar story to yours and Meili. My 24 y.o. son is autistic, very tall (which adds to the fantasies about his supposed extreme violence) excluded from school in his last year and excluded socially now. I am a retired psychiatrist, 73 y.o. , and cannot get him in a day centre for I am against de use of drugs. Sometimes I get angry with all the critics of psychiatry for they focus in matters that I think fancyful (antidepressants and all that) and neglect issues of informed consent in populations like our childern that are being tortured and further disabled by the thousands in our supposed civilized world.under presures like you describe. Even the parents of an asociation which I formed have turned against me because my critical position to do with medication. A practice which itself is a complex bio-psycho social equivalent of religion: salvation through biologism.
    Like you I used once medication, he likes to undress himself, and had the allergy “bubles” problem; like you I had drugs as a condition for admission to day centres etc. I took the issue of my son’s exclusion to Law, ( Convention on Rights of Persons with Disabilities 2006) won the case and the administration appealed on the Supreme Court (!!! my son has a disability estimated at 88%). They lost the apeal but nothing happened, perhaps that would be different in the USA, you have attorneys there, but here what the hell he is just a retarded boy, he is got to have something. Or silence and reppraisals
    I was a psychiatrist before I was his father (I had other three, normal and away) and with a very eclectic training in the U.K. hence I used drugs very rarely, never with children or the disabled. And prior to my son exclusión I knew ( I live in a small town with hardly a dozen autistic youngsters which I know) of five acute intoxications from neuroleptic medication: one dead from neuroleptic asphyxia, one nearly with Neuroleptic Malignant Syndrome, two severe and lasting dystonias, one “Tower of Pisa”, the other a sort of big torticolis accompanied by acathisia (can you imagine the torture !), one grand mal in a very obese boy. And parents continued with their complicities. Things are so similar to Action T4 the nazi program except that now they do not kill them, they make them economically profitable for the various professions.
    Like you I have a big satisfaction when I compare my son Ramiro, with other boys with autism: he is healthy which is doubly important for us for he was born a grand premature and struggled for his life for more than a year and he is happy. When we cannot continue I hope they finish with him soon.

    To try drugs, behaviour modification, o any therapy in autism is as relevant as in paraplegia o blindness. Autism is a disability and our children need enabling, adecuate environments, and supports from people who understand the condition. Those things are denied to them in favour of faulse hopes, sickening cures, and at the end control and punishments. The professionals who engage in this are not stupid they are above all cowards.
    Any way to unite and empower us?

    A big big hug Steven
    Mariano Almudevar,
    Huesca Spain