This question is not a joke. It has come up repeatedly when I discuss how absurdly harmful mainstream psychiatry is with like-minded colleagues, e.g. critical psychiatrists or psychologists.
Madness is characterised by delusions. An Oxford dictionary defined delusion as an idiosyncratic belief or impression maintained despite being contradicted by reality or rational argument.
According to the WHO’s International Classification of Diseases, a delusion is a belief that is demonstrably untrue, is firmly held with conviction, and is not susceptible to modification by experience or evidence that contradicts it. Similarly, in the DSM-5, delusions are fixed beliefs that are not amenable to change in light of conflicting evidence.1
One type of delusion is grandiosity, which is a sense of superiority, uniqueness, or invulnerability that is unrealistic and not based on personal capability. Many psychiatrists behave in a grandiose way, believing in their infallibility and omnipotence and that they have a special insight no one else has. If you are a patient and disagree, you are called ignorant or in need of psychoeducation, even when your relatives share your views.2 Or you are told you have a lack of insight into your disease, which is a symptom of your mental illness, a catch-22 situation from which there is no escape.
Joseph Biederman was an example of grandiosity. During his testimony in a court case in 2009, when an attorney asked him about his rank at Harvard Medical School, Biederman replied: “Full professor.” “What’s above that?” the attorney asked. “God,” he replied.3
Psychiatrists regard religion as a special case.1 A religious delusion may concern a special relationship with God or gods or involve claims such as being Jesus but “these kinds of delusions are notoriously difficult to distinguish from nonpathological religious beliefs.” Indeed. It would be more logically consistent to say that a belief in one or more gods is a delusion.
Faith plays a big role in psychiatry. It is a great trust or confidence in something for which there is no proof, or an unshakeable belief in something even if there is proof against it. A large survey of 2,031 people from 1995 illustrates this.4,5 People thought that antidepressants, antipsychotics, electroshock and admission to a psychiatric ward are more often harmful than beneficial. This view concurs with the best evidence we have,3,6-12 but the social psychiatrists who had done the survey were dissatisfied with the answers and argued that people should be trained to arrive at the “right opinion.”
In what way exactly? How do you train people to go directly against the science? Usually, we call this indoctrination.
As psychiatrists’ beliefs in what they are doing are in contrast with the science, this makes psychiatry a pseudoscience, a kind of religion. If you want more evidence that most psychiatric leaders are delusional, just read their guidelines and textbooks, which I have done.
My Critical Psychiatry Textbook is freely available.9 I read the five most used textbooks in Denmark and uncovered a litany of misleading and erroneous statements about the causes of mental health disorders, if they are genetic, if they can be detected in a brain scan, if they are caused by a chemical imbalance, if psychiatric diagnoses are reliable, and what the benefits and harms are of psychiatric drugs and electroshocks. Much of what is claimed amounts to scientific dishonesty. I also describe fraud and serious manipulations with the data in often cited research. I conclude that biological psychiatry has not led to anything of use, and that psychiatry as a medical specialty does more harm than good.
It is noteworthy that the psychiatrists’ predominant idiosyncratic beliefs are not shared by people considered sane—the general public. And the great majority of psychiatric patients do not have delusions whereas most psychiatrists have. I therefore believe I have proven that psychiatrists are more mad than their patients.
Forced treatment is a particularly dark chapter in psychiatry. I have argued why I consider forced treatment a crime against humanity.11,12 The psychiatrists believe they do it for the patients’ own good, but the patients see it very differently,13,14 and the evidence shows it does far more harm than good, mainly because it virtually always involves treatment with antipsychotics.8,9,11-14 In 2019, a Norwegian study found that 52 of 100 consecutively admitted patients to a psychiatric hospital would have wanted a drug-free alternative if it had existed.15 Why can’t people get that then?
A delusion can by persecutory, where people believe they are at risk of being harmed because of the malevolent intentions of others.1 Leading psychiatrists commonly suffer from this type of delusion. They may call people who criticise psychiatry conspiracy theorists or “anti-psychiatry,” like people who deny or oppose Christ are called “anti-Christ.” This curious phenomenon does not exist in any other medical specialty. If you criticise the overuse of statins, you are not called “anti-cardiology” or a conspiracy theorist.
A popular saying is that madness is doing the same thing again and again expecting a different result. Psychiatrists are not the only doctors who do this but they are by far the “best” in this futile discipline.
When a drug doesn’t seem to work, psychiatrists increase the dose, change to another drug from the same class, add another drug from the same class, or add a drug from another class. The science tells us that these manoeuvres do not benefit the patients.8,9,16-18
Increasing the dose or the number of drugs increases the occurrence of serious harms, including irreversible brain damage, suicides and other deaths,8,9,19-21 but psychiatrists often lie to their patients telling them that their disease might harm their brains, or they might die, if they don’t take their drugs.8,9,11 This is perverse.
The madness is increasing
Unfortunately, the madness is getting worse. In office-based psychiatry in the USA, visits with three or more drugs doubled, from 17% to 33%, in just nine years, and prescriptions for two or more drugs from the same class also increased.22 In Australia, the use of psychiatric drugs and polypharmacy for children and adolescents were twice as high in 2021 as in 2013,23 and the use of neuroleptics increased by 45% in just six years.24 In the UK, psychosis pill prescriptions increased by 5% per year on average and depression pills by 10%, from 1998 to 2010.25 In Denmark, the sales of SSRIs increased from a low level in 1992 almost linearly by a factor of 18, closely related to the number of products on the market that increased by a factor of 16 (r = 0.97, almost perfect correlation).26
These data suggest that drug usage is determined by marketing and the widespread corruption of leading psychiatrists.8,27
Another indicator that the madness is increasing is that the mortality for patients with schizophrenia has increased markedly; the median standardised mortality ratio for the 1970s, 1980s and 1990s were 1.84, 2.98 and 3.20, respectively.28
Two Danish textbooks mention that several psychosis pills may be needed simultaneously, and one notes it can be appropriate to increase the dosage above the approved interval.
In 2006, a report from the Danish Board of Health showed that half of the patients were in treatment with more than one psychosis pill simultaneously,29 although both national and international guidelines recommend against it.
In 2014, the Danish Ministry of Health issued a licence to kill. It allowed psychiatrists to use extraordinarily large doses of psychosis drugs for forced treatment, especially when patients have been in prolonged treatment and where smaller doses have been tried without success.30
This is as mad as it gets. These drugs are highly deadly, e.g. kill 2 of 100 demented people in just 10 weeks,31 and the risk of death is of course dose related.32-36 The psychiatrists say that the patient is “treatment resistant,” which is an insulting term as it suggests that the patient is at fault and not the drug. They don’t realise that they should not increase the dose or add another drug but taper off the first drug slowly, which will have the best outcome.
I have witnessed the madness directly. I was once invited to follow the chief psychiatrist during one day at a closed ward at my hospital, Rigshospitalet. One of the patients appeared totally normal and reasonable to me, but the psychiatrist considered him delusional. As I couldn’t see why, he explained that the patient was delusional because he had been on the internet and had found out that psychosis pills are dangerous! I was so stunned that I didn’t comment.
On another occasion, I phoned Psychiatric Centre Amager, which has a particularly bad reputation because the psychiatrists have killed several of their patients with psychosis pills.37 A patient in great distress had contacted me, but I couldn’t get a psychiatrist on the phone, even though I explained I was a colleague, and it was within normal working hours. When I insisted, I was transferred to a head nurse. She told me not to get involved because the patient was delusional. When I asked in what way, she said he had found out that psychosis pills are dangerous! I asked if she knew who I was. Oh yes, she did, but that didn’t stop her from exposing psychiatry’s insanity.
In 2023, the whole Board of the Norwegian Psychiatric Association felt so threatened by colleagues who wanted a radically different psychiatry that they published an opinion piece to defend the status quo in a newspaper.38 I explained what the worst falsehoods were:39
Claim: The drugs do not change the personality. Fact: This is the reason for using them and many patients experience this, e.g. 43% in one survey.2
Claim: The drugs do not have greater side effects than other drugs. Fact: They are the third leading cause of death, after heart disease and cancer.40
Claim: “Conspiracy theories abound that the pharmaceutical industry only wants to profit on making people as dependent as possible.” Fact: It is not a conspiracy theory that the drug industry doesn’t care about withdrawal effects from psychiatric drugs but only about its profits and that the business model of Big Pharma is organised crime.41
Claim: “Drug treated patients return to work more quickly, and disability can be prevented.” Fact: The more drugs that are used, the more patients come on disability pension.3
Claim: “The prognosis and risk of relapse are improved significantly when patients take antipsychotics.” Fact: All trials that provide the basis for this misconception are deeply flawed. They have introduced withdrawal symptoms in the discontinuation group, which psychiatrists have falsely interpreted as relapse.8,11
Claim: “Patients with ADHD often have reduced quality of life, more frequent depression and more drug problems and criminal behaviour if they are not treated.” Fact: In the long run, the opposite is true.11
Claim: “Drug treatment makes patients more accessible to psychotherapy.” Fact: Psychotherapy is superior to drug therapy, particularly in the long run where it has an enduring effect, in contrast to drugs.11,42
Claim: “There is no biological basis for saying that commonly used psychiatric drugs such as antidepressants, mood stabilizers and antipsychotics cause dependence.” Fact: The drugs up- or downregulate neurotransmitters in the brain, which is why abrupt withdrawal can cause terrible and dangerous withdrawal symptoms.43,44
Claim: “So far, most studies indicate that drug treatment is absolutely necessary to achieve recovery and increase quality of life and prevent relapse for most patients with severe psychiatric disorders.” Fact: These statements are also blatantly false. The drugs decrease quality of life and do not prevent relapse.9,11,45
Conclusions
The misconceptions among psychiatric leaders are so much at variance with the scientific evidence, and with what the patients and their relatives and others experience, that it seems justified to say that they suffer from a serious, collective delusion.
So, here is a thought experiment. Using the psychiatrists’ own diagnostic systems and practice, it can be argued that psychiatric leaders such as the Norwegian psychiatric leaders should be forcefully treated with psychosis pills. If they tasted their own medicines, which some doctors have done to see what it was like,46 few of them would sustain their delusions about how good they are, which would benefit mankind.
The doctors experienced a marked slowing of thinking and movement, profound inner restlessness, a paralysis of volition and a lack of physical and psychic energy, being unable to read or work.46 Psychiatrist David Healy found the same in 20 staff from his hospital who received droperidol.47 Everyone felt anxious, restless, disengaged and demotivated to do anything; a psychologist volunteer found it too complicated just to obtain a sandwich from a sandwich machine. Some felt irritable and belligerent and many were unable to recognise the altered mental state they were in and to judge their own behaviour.
As a specialty, psychiatry is more mad than its patients. To keep the patients on pills they don’t like, three quarters of popular websites attributed depression to a “chemical imbalance” or claimed they could fix an imbalance.48 This is like threatening with the Loch Ness Monster. Such an imbalance being the cause of depression (or any other psychiatric disorder) does not exist.49
Psychiatry should be demolished and built up from the ground, focusing on psychosocial interventions, as recently recommend ed by the United Nations and the WHO.50 And all treatment needs to be voluntary.11,12
References
1 Collin S, Rowse G, Martinez AP, et al. Delusions and the dilemmas of life: A systematic review and metaanalyses of the global literature on the prevalence of delusional themes in clinical groups. Clin Psychol Rev 2023;104:102303.
2 Kessing L, Hansen HV, Demyttenaere K, et al. Depressive and bipolar disorders: patients’ attitudes and beliefs towards depression and antidepressants. Psychological Medicine 2005;35:1205-13.
3 Whitaker R. Anatomy of an epidemic. New York: Broadway Paperbacks; 2015.
4 Jorm AF, Korten AE, Jacomb PA, et al. ”Mental health literacy”: a survey of the public’s ability to recognise mental disorders and their beliefs about the effectiveness of treatment. Med J Aus 1997;166:182-6.
5 Raven M. Depression and antidepressants in Australia and beyond: a critical public health analysis (PhD thesis). University of Wollongong, Australia; 2012.
6 Read J, Bentall R. The effectiveness of electroconvulsive therapy: a literature review. Epidemiol Psichiatr Soc 2010 Oct-Dec;19:333-47.
7 Whitaker R. Mad in America: bad science, bad medicine, and the enduring mistreatment of the mentally ill. Cambridge: Perseus Books Group; 2002.
8 Gøtzsche PC. Deadly psychiatry and organised denial. Copenhagen: People’s Press; 2015.
9 Gøtzsche PC. Critical psychiatry textbook. Copenhagen: Institute for Scientific Freedom; 2022 (freely available).
10 Read J. Major adverse cardiac events and mortality associated with electroconvulsive therapy: correcting and updating a 2019 meta-analysis. Ethical Human Psychology and Psychiatry 2024 Sept: DOI: 10.1891/EHPP-2024-0003.
11 Gøtzsche PC. Is psychiatry a crime against humanity? Copenhagen: Institute for Scientific Freedom; 2024 (freely available).
12 Gøtzsche PC. Forced treatment in psychiatry is a crime against humanity. J Acad Publ Health 2025;Jan 30.
13 Gøtzsche PC, Sørensen A. Systematic violations of patients’ rights and safety: Forced medication of a cohort of 30 patients. Ind J Med Ethics 2020;Oct-Dec;5(4) NS:312-8.
14 Tasch G, Gøtzsche PC. Systematic violations of patients’ rights and safety: forced medication of a cohort of 30 patients in Alaska. Psychosis 2023;15:145-54.
15 Heskestad S, Kalhovde AM, Jakobsen ES. Medikamentfri psykiatrisk behandling – hva mener pasientene? Tidsskr Nor Legeforen 2019;Oct 2. doi: 10.4045/tidsskr.18.0912.
16 Santaguida P, MacQueen G, Keshavarz H, et al. Treatment for depression after unsatisfactory response to SSRIs. Comparative effectiveness review No. 62. (Prepared by McMaster University Evidence-based Practice Center under Contract No. HHSA 290 2007 10060 I.) AHRQ Publication No.12-EHC050-EF. Rockville, MD: Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality; 2012:April.
17 Rink L, Braun C, Bschor T, et al. Dose increase versus unchanged continuation of antidepressants after initial antidepressant treatment failure in patients with major depressive disorder: a systematic review and meta-analysis of randomized, double-blind trials. J Clin Psychiatry 2018;79;17r11693.
18 Samara MT, Klupp E, Helfer B, et al. Increasing antipsychotic dose for non response in schizophrenia. Cochrane Database Syst Rev 2018;5:CD011883.
19 Miller M, Swanson SA, Azrael D, et al. Antidepressant dose, age, and the risk of deliberate self-harm. JAMA Intern Med 2014;174:899-909.
20 Ho BC, Andreasen NC, Ziebell S, et al. Long-term antipsychotic treatment and brain volumes: a longitudinal study of first-episode schizophrenia. Arch Gen Psychiatry 2011;68:128-37.
21 Zipursky RB, Reilly TJ, Murray RM. The myth of schizophrenia as a progressive brain disease. Schizophr Bull 2013;39:1363-72.
22 Mojtabai R, Olfson M. National trends in psychotropic medication polypharmacy in office-based psychiatry. Arch Gen Psychiatry 2010;67:26-36.
23 Wood SJ, Ilomäki J, Gould J, et al. Dispensing of psychotropic medications to Australian children and adolescents before and during the COVID-19 pandemic, 2013-2021: a retrospective cohort study. Med J Aust 2023;219:18-25.
24 Klau J, Gonzalez-Chica D, Raven M, et al. Antipsychotic prescribing patterns in children and adolescents attending Australian general practice in 2011 and 2017. JCPP Adv 2023;4:e12208.
25 Ilyas S, Moncrieff J. Trends in prescriptions and costs of drugs for mental disorders in England, 1998-2010. Br J Psychiatry 2012;200:393-8.
26 Nielsen M, Gøtzsche P. An analysis of psychotropic drug sales. Increasing sales of selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors are closely related to number of products. Int J Risk Saf Med 2011;23:125-32.
27 Whitaker R, Gøtzsche PC. The pervasive financial and scientific corruption of psychiatric drug trials. Copenhagen: Institute for Scientific Freedom 2022; March 23.
28 Saha S, Chant D, McGrath J. A systematic review of mortality in schizophrenia: is the differential mortality gap worsening over time? Arch Gen Psychiatry 2007;64:1123-31.
29 Forbruget af antipsykotika blandt 18-64 årige patienter, med skizofreni, mani eller bipolar affektiv sindslidelse. København: Sundhedsstyrelsen; 2006.
30 Notat om dosering af lægemidler i psykiatrien. Ministeriet for Sundhed og Forebyggelse 2014;Oct 30.
31 FDA package insert for Risperdal.
32 Joukamaa M, Heliövaara M, Knekt P. Schizophrenia, neuroleptic medication and mortality. Br J Psychiatry 2006;188:122-7.
33 Tenback D, Pijl B, Smeets H. All-cause mortality and medication risk factors in schizophrenia. J Clin Psychopharmacol 2012;32:31-5.
33 Waddington JL, Youssef HA, Kinsella A. Mortality in schizophrenia. Antipsychotic polypharmacy and absence of adjunctive anticholinergics over the course of a 10-year prospective study. Br J Psychiatry 1998;173:325-9.
35 Ray WA, Meredith S, Thapa PB, et al. Antipsychotics and the risk of sudden cardiac death. Arch Gen Psychiatry 2001;58:1161-7.
36 Ray WA, Chung CP, Murray KT, et al. Atypical antipsychotic drugs and the risk of sudden cardiac death. N Engl J Med 2009;360:225-35.
37 Christensen DC. Dear Luise: a story of power and powerlessness in Denmark’s psychiatric care system. Portland: Jorvik Press; 2012.
38 Lien L, Reitan SK, Halvorsen NJN, et al. ”Pilleskam” i psykiatrien er et alvorlig samfunnsproblem. Aftenposten 2023;Aug 10.
39 Gøtzsche PC. The media’s false narrative about depression pills, suicides, and saving lives. Mad in America 2023;Aug 23.
40 Gøtzsche PC. Prescription drugs are the leading cause of death. And psychiatric drugs are the third leading cause of death. Mad in America 2024;April 16.
41 Gøtzsche PC. Deadly medicines and organised crime: How big pharma has corrupted health care. London: Radcliffe Publishing; 2013.
42 Gøtzsche PC. Psychotherapy has an enduring effect on depression—in contrast to depression pills. Mad in America 2021; Nov 23.
43 Davies J, Read J. A systematic review into the incidence, severity and duration of antidepressant withdrawal effects: Are guidelines evidence-based? Addict Behav 2019;97:111-21.
44 Moncrieff J, Read J, Horowitz MA. The nature and impact of antidepressant withdrawal symptoms and proposal of the Discriminatory Antidepressant Withdrawal Symptoms Scale (DAWSS). J Affect Disord Rep 2024;16:100765.
45 Paludan-Müller AS, Sharma T, Rasmussen K, et al. Extensive selective reporting of quality of life in clinical study reports and publications of placebo-controlled trials of antidepressants. Int J Risk Saf Med 2021;32:87-99.
46 Belmaker RH, Wald D. Haloperidol in normals. Br J Psychiatry 1977;131:222-3.
47 Moncrieff J. The bitterest pills. Basingstoke: Palgrave Macmillan; 2013.
48 Demasi M, Gøtzsche PC. Presentation of benefits and harms of antidepressants on websites: cross sectional study. Int J Risk Saf Med 2020;31:53-65.
49 Moncrieff J, Cooper RE, Stockmann T, et al. The serotonin theory of depression: a systematic umbrella review of the evidence. Mol Psychiatry 2023;28:3243-56.
50 Shifting the balance towards social interventions: a call for an overhaul of the mental health system. Beyond Pills All-Party Parliamentary Group 2024;May.
Here is an interesting quote:
“Psychiatry is carrying out the greatest ‘hidden genocide’ of the 21st century. As I mentioned above.. Psychiatry is probably responsible for the deaths and injuries of millions of people (worldwide) every year.”
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Doctors are quite aware that talk therapy is safer than pharmaceutical therapy. The failure to proactively tell patients this fact is one of the more damning aspects of the whole charade.
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Not at all sure talk therapy is safer than pharmaceutical therapy. Too often it’s just trading one black hole for another, and getting both often turns out to be one double whammy of hell.
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Are psychiatrists more mad than their patients? That’s the reasonable conclusion most sane people would arrive at—if they happened to know what the real facts are.
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Thank you for speaking the truth. I have personally been harmed by drugs that I thought were “safe and effective.” I am now stuck on two antidepressants and am having severe withdrawal symptoms with trying to slowly taper just one of them. These drugs don’t fix an ‘imbalance,’ they create imbalances in the brain.
I have seen more arrogance and gaslighting from psychiatrists than from any other medical professionals. Hopefully one day psychiatric treatment will focus more on diet, vitamin/mineral deficiencies, lifestyle changes, and non-drug ways to manage emotional pain.
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“Medscape’s “Doctors’ Burden: Psychiatrist Suicide Report 2023,” published March 15, polled 9,175 physicians in more than 29 specialties about their own suicidal thoughts and tendencies.
Here are five statistics from the report to know:
1. Twelve percent of psychiatrists reported having experienced suicidal thoughts, which is among the highest of any specialty other than otolaryngology (13 percent).
2. One percent of psychiatrists reported that they have attempted suicide.
3. Among psychiatrists, 11 percent of men and 12 percent of women reported having contemplated but not attempted suicide.
4. Twenty-five percent of psychiatrists reported they may not seek professional help for suicidal thoughts due to fear of their condition being reported to a medical board. Other reasons psychiatrists cited for not seeking mental health treatment included fear of their colleagues finding out (16 percent), insurance concerns (15 percent) and a lack of trust in mental health professionals (10 percent). Respondents could vote for more than one option on this topic.
5. Forty-one percent of psychiatrists indicated they do not believe a medical school or healthcare organization should be held responsible in the event of a student or provider suicide. Of the remaining respondents, 41 percent reported feeling unsure and 18 percent said organizations should be held accountable.”
You’ve got to be pretty crazy to be a psychiatrist…
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I acknowledge the assertion that “psychiatry should be demolished.” However, instead of reconstructing it, we should let it die. A memorial in every state and country should be established that honours the countless individuals who have been adversely affected by barbaric and criminal psychiatric practices. This grave marker would serve as a poignant reminder of the billions of victims who have suffered harm, offering a dedicated space for the living to reflect on and grieve the damage inflicted upon their or their loved ones’ cognitive and physical well-being by haphazard quasi-scientists.
The distinction between “mainstream” psychiatry and “critical” psychiatry is analogous to categorising rapists into ‘bad’ and ‘good’ factions. A genuine critique of one’s professional practices would necessitate a psychiatrist’s departure from the field.
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I do like your idea of memorials for those harmed and killed by the psych industries, Cat. May I put my hat in the ring to make the memorials, if funding is ever raised for Cat’s good idea?
I need to design a memorial for my father’s grave. And have come up with an idea, and it – or something similar – might also be a cool design for such memorials to the many harmed and killed by the psychiatrists.
I’ve been doing research into sacred geometry, which is basically the mathematics behind everything in God’s universe. And sacred geometry designs are supposed to have healing properties, and are visually appealing to humans.
I’ve concluded that to make my dad’s memorial, I should probably take a class in 3-D printing, and I have found a local university that teaches it. Because I need to come up with a 3-D model of my design, in order to have it caste in bronze.
In essence what I have in mind is a 3-D image of a flower of life, that has a rising sun, worked into the design, the location of which is based upon the fibonacci spiral. If you don’t know anything about sacred geometry (since it’s not taught in the US schools), this may be difficult to envision, but you can google it. And I think it’s a cool idea for a memorial.
I plan to also put a stylized image of an olive tree (roots, slightly gnarly trunk, and branches) in my dad’s memorial, since his hobby was genealogy. Then I thought I’d mount it on some granite, probably. The size of the bronze part could be 21″ x 21″ or 42″ x 42″ or 21″ x 34″, or possibly larger, so there’s lots of options.
At least I’d like to throw my hat into the ring for consideration, as an artist and designer, if Cat’s idea ever found funding.
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Or, duckduckgo, research it. I haven’t googled it lately.
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Go for it! Sounds wonderful. I also have been talking of creating a memorial. I hope we see them spread throughout the country.
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Count me in for this, too!
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“…haphazard quasi-scientists.”
“A genuine critique of one’s professional practices would necessitate a psychiatrist’s departure from the field.”
LOVE!!!!
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Thank you, Dr. Peter Gøtzsche for your consistent truth telling.
“Psychiatry should be demolished and built up from the ground, focusing on psychosocial interventions, as recently recommended by the United Nations and the WHO.50”
Personally, I believe that psychiatry should focus on learning to wean people off the psych neurotoxins (in essence to minimize the mess they’ve created). Then psychiatry, as a medical profession, should gradually be weaned out of existence.
As to psychology, the non-medically trained psychologists should not be diagnosing anyone with anything. And, as one who believes the Jungians are the closest to the truth, they could research into things like the collective unconscious, etc. (in other words, no clinical work).
Or, maybe since they are already “partnered” with the religions, I suppose that as long as everyone is made aware of this relationship (in other words, the churches could pay the psychologists, but they should never ever charge a client, fraudulently implying they work for the client, then run off to get lies and gossip from a pastor about the client, as happened to me). But since I already know this is a faustian partnership, it’s probably better that “partnership” is ended.
But if the psychologists actually want to help people, they should become helpers, largely unrelated, to the medical field, in places like Soteria Houses or healing farms, and the like.
“And all treatment needs to be voluntary.11,12” I agree, forced and coerced treatment should eventually be made illegal. But this gets tricky, when it comes to someone who is psychotic.
So who will help a person who is experiencing psychosis, you may ask? Based on experience with a loved one, I know families do need help in such cases. A short course of benzos? That didn’t work for my loved one, but it may be a good place to start. A short course (like one or two days) of neuroleptics might at least calm the person down, allow them to sleep, but then you do run the risk of a drug withdrawal induced super sensitivity manic psychosis. But if you follow the antipsychotic up, in a healing space, for a week or two, with a low dose of lithium. And then reduce the lithium within a month to six weeks. Well, just an antidotal case, but that is what helped my loved one.
I guess the “healing space” should begin in the hospital. But once the person is stabilized on the lithium, if they do need a safe space until they get weaned off the lithium. I do believe we should move towards alternatives like Soteria houses, healing farms, maybe open dialogue, and give me more ideas, ladies and gentlemen. If a person is actually violent, then the police likely should deal with them. But the paramedics and police are not very good about assessing whether a psychotic person is dangerous, unless they are told the person is not dangerous. (There’s been too much psychiatric brainwashing of the public.)
As to what are the causes of psychosis?
street drugs
alcohol encephalitis
the ADHD drugs
the anticholinergic drugs (antidepressants, antipsychotics, etc.)
drug interactions
psych drug withdrawal
trauma
sleep deprivation
None of which are “genetic” etiologies. But do add to the list, if you can. And please make other suggestions for alternatives, or disagree with me, and explain why we should not move in this direction, please … I’m still just thinking through it.
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I don’t know of any academic psychologist (certainly not psychiatrist) who is fully versed in all the worthwhile research that has been done into the mind and ways to heal it.
Of the various “causes” of psychosis, only one comes close to a basic insight, and that is “trauma.” Yet in the context of what most understand as a “mind” and as “human life,” even that line of thinking dead ends.
It is not a problem one can think one’s way out of. You either need to do some research yourself, or read the reports of others who have done some research.
Where reincarnation and related phenomena aren’t even mentioned in this context, I know that a person’s study of the subject is incomplete.
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Low Folate
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36816414/
MTHFR mutations because they lower Folate
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While I was locked up in a psych ward:
Me: how islocking me up supposed to help?
Psychiatrist: you’re not locked up, you’re accomodated.
Yep, delusional.
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Wow, seriously? Talk about a euphemism!
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Psychiatric gaslighting on show beokay.
I was taking two euphemisms morning and night, but after the withdrawals I found natural facts to be so much better for my health.
I’ll never forget the time I heard a ‘patient’ tell a group that her psychiatrist was changing the “product” she was taking. No longer speaking about drugs or medicines, best we call it a product.
And “unintended negative outcomes” instead of State sanctioned convenience killings? Our Chief Psychiatrist sure has a sense of humor, and is truly “grandiose” given he believes he can remove protections from our laws without Parliamentary approval.
And he is considered a “competent authority” when he wouldn’t pass a first year law class? Criminal negligence is such an effective weapon when the power imbalance allows a person to be fuking destroyed by the State.
Still, one does need to recognise that psychiatrists are fighting ‘the enemy within’ and that support from the State for the human rights abuses that occur (and the corruption that comes with those abuses) require support. It’s just that the community/public don’t realise that our politicians and public servants see them as the enemy. It should be obvious to anyone who has seen a ‘mental patients’ head stomped by the police at the request of a mental health nurse.
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Yep. Continued with:
Me: so I’m free to go?
Him: no
Me: so I AM locked up?
Him:
Me: are you an idiot?
Him:
Me: this talk is over.
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Absurd. Shows the true authoritarian nature of psychiatry, not really interested in or able to have a real conversation about what’s going on for the client/patient. Very dangerous attitude!
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Hey I was thinking about designing a device for mental health complaints department……. it’s called the Gaslighting Chamber.
I must admit it was in the ED where a total disregard of the sanctity of human life was on display though. I guess they must get desensitized to the killings (unintended negative outcomes if you must) when they are doing it to free up beds.
It must go from ‘this one isn’t going to make it’ TO ”This one will make me enough to buy a Porsche Macan’.
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It truely was absurd.
The psychiatrists had a warped perception of their own authoritarianism.
I repeatedly asked for the diagnosis justifying the deprivation of my liberty. Never got a straight answer until I saw the court documents.
One of the evading answers was: “we aren’t interested in putting people in boxes.”
While physically locking me up…
Completely unaware of their own actions.
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We write these little anecdotes about these Psychiatry graduates but it is not practical. I wish we had a database of the names of these people so we could pre-emptively know “avoid these human beings in your life”. Surviving Antidepressants has created a list of doctors like that who do not respect the wishes of their clientele. They write them down and strike them off one by one.
Psychiatry is not some sentient AI or like the Force. These are people with names and backgrounds. They have databases on clientele, we have no databases on them.
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This article is right on target.. Moreover, there are also source markers. I would like to say that I have the same opinion. Also, it is worth mentioning this.
Unfortunately.. The majority of psychiatrists are not ‘normal people’ in my observation. The word ‘mad’ is ‘a drop in the ocean’ when compared to psychiatrists. The majority of psychiatrists have even gone beyond being ‘mad’.
In my opinion, psychiatrists as a profession are ‘licensed charlatans and psychopaths’. (Except for honest psychiatrists.)
What is the term ‘honest psychiatrist’? Honest psychiatrists are those who do not administer, recommend and oppose ‘psychiatric treatments’ that clearly harm, disable (injure) and kill people, such as psychiatric drugs, ECT, etc and who direct their patients to ‘drug-free treatment methods’ and/or administer them themselves.
There are reasons why mainstream psychiatrists, except honest psychiatrists, are ‘licensed charlatans and psychopaths’.
Mainstream psychiatrists…
1) They know that mental illnesses are not in the brain, but in the person’s own soul.
2) They know that psychiatric medications and psychiatric treatments like ECT do not cure ‘mental illness’. They know that they do not cure mental illness, and that they make ‘existing symptoms’ worse and cause ‘new symptoms of mental illness’.
3) They know that psychiatric drugs and psychiatric treatments such as ECT (especially psychiatric drugs) harm (disable, ‘injure’ and kill) people.
4) They also know that psychiatric drugs, in particular, only numb the brain and do nothing else. (In fact, ECT does the same thing. The difference with ECT is that it cooks the brain (like boiling a fried fish/chicken)).
And many other harms and negativities that we cannot even think of or count right now. Psychiatrists know these things.. If psychiatrists who know these things can knowingly prescribe psychiatric drugs to their patients, for example… then you can understand that those psychiatrists have a serious problem with their ‘mind’.
Additionally…
A) They know that psychiatric drugs (and other psychiatric treatments, such as ECT) do not work (i.e., do not treat mental illness). …despite knowing this, they are quacks for they prescribe psychiatric drugs to their patients. (This includes other ancillary psychiatric treatments such as ECT.)
B) They know that psychiatric drugs harm (i.e., disable (injure) and kill) people, both physically and mentally. …despite knowing this, they are psychopaths for they prescribe psychiatric drugs. (This includes other ancillary psychiatric treatments such as ECT.)
C) And because they do these things with the LEGAL rights (medical licenses) given to them by the state, they (psychiatrists) are licensed charlatans and psychopaths. (This is the most dangerous thing. Since psychiatrists do this ‘harming’ act LEGALLY (with a license), they become even more dangerous than the psychopaths out there. Unfortunately, this is the truth.)
If we go even further… Think of a psychopath on the street, outside. This psychopath can’t even begin to compare himself to the psychopathy of psychiatrists.
Think about the genocidal Adolf Hitler.. If you put together Adolf Hitler and all the other genocides in the world… they would not even come close to the ‘hidden genocides’ committed by psychiatry that have not yet been named. If Adolf Hitler had lived and seen these days, he would have declared psychiatry as his ‘right arm’. (Although… Hitler used psychiatry in those days, but the situation is very different today.)
Let’s put it this way… Psychiatry is carrying out the greatest ‘hidden genocide’ of the 21st century, which has not yet been named. And LEGALLY too.. (Although… in the last half of the 20th century (1950-1999), these ‘secret genocides’ continued LEGALLY.
(since the date psychiatric drugs were introduced to the market..) Moreover, when psychiatry carried out these genocides, it did so together with the ‘real medical community’. At least the real medical community did not even speak out against these genocides.)
——
As a final note, I would like to point out that… There are students who go to medical school (/want to go) and choose ‘psychiatry’. I feel sorry for the students who choose psychiatry. I don’t feel good about them at all. If they choose psychiatry knowingly, even though they know about the hidden genocides of psychiatry, that’s even worse. When I asked why psychiatrists are ‘licensed charlatans and psychopaths’, I actually wanted to say this.
“Students who choose psychiatry in medical schools enter psychiatry as pure and innocent people… (and when they graduate) they graduate as ‘licensed charlatan and psychopath psychiatrists’ in the truest sense of the word.”
Unfortunately… This is the reality in psychiatry. I suspect that very few people are aware of the sad state that psychiatrists have fallen into.
As a last word…
“Psychiatry should be demolished and built up from the ground, focusing on psychosocial interventions, as recently recommend ed by the United Nations and the WHO.50 And all treatment needs to be voluntary.”
Yes, that can happen too.. But first, psychiatric drugs must be banned. Otherwise, these hidden genocides will continue. This must be stopped. Psychiatry should be removed from medical schools. Mind (Mental) health systems should be revised with drug-free treatment methods. etc. etc. Best regards.
With my sincerest wishes.. 🙂 Y.E. (Researcher blog writer (Blogger))
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Hi.. I may have spoken a bit harshly here. I apologize for that. But I only apologize to honest psychiatrists (who do not conform to the mainstream psychiatry I mentioned above) (and MIA and other sensitive citizens). Actually, my words are not to ‘honest psychiatrists’. I’m sure they know that too.
As a final word, if you allow me, I would like to complete a topic that was left unfinished above.
“Students who choose psychiatry in medical schools enter psychiatry as pure and innocent people… (and when they graduate) they graduate as ‘licensed charlatan and psychopath psychiatrists’ in the truest sense of the word.”
Unfortunately, the psychiatry department in medical schools seems to be under the control of ‘mainstream medicine and mainstream psychiatry’. The ‘acts of harming people’ we mentioned above are carried out in the psychiatry departments of medical schools, under the name of ‘treatment of mental health’, with ‘scientific course methods’ filled with completely absurd content.
How do we understand this?
1) We understand it from the ‘serious lethal harm’ they cause to people. Probably… Worldwide, at least 1 million people die and are disabled (injured) each year from psychiatric drugs and other harmful psychiatric treatments such as ECT. (This number may be even higher because of the inaccurate medical records of deaths and injuries of patients receiving psychiatric treatment (causes of death are not accurately recorded in patient and death certificates).)
And again, probably… Every day, tens/hundreds of millions of people around the world are subjected to ‘chemical lobotomies’ (especially due to psychiatric drugs). (Taking one or more psychiatric medications every day means that the person is subjected to a chemical lobotomy (which may cause chemical brain damage in the future) every day.) Possibly… when the time comes (every year), at least more than 1 million of these tens/hundreds of millions of people who are subjected to chemical lobotomy every day may be suffering from ‘permanent chemically induced brain damage’.
Not just chemical brain damage, of course. Psychiatric drugs can also cause serious (physically) fatal damage to the human body. (Cancer, diabetes, heart diseases, sudden cardiac deaths, etc.) Probably… The rate of suffering from almost every imaginable variety of permanent physical illnesses due to psychiatric drugs… We can say that it is even higher than the number of people injured in the 1st and 2nd World Wars and the wars at the end of the wars to this day.
(Isn’t that right? Then let them prove it. Let’s go ahead. The WHO should also announce the total number of people ‘using psychiatric drugs’ in the world and the number of people ‘injured and killed’ due to psychiatric drugs. Which it will not be able to do correctly. Because it probably doesn’t seem to have much serious data on these issues. In other words, I don’t think there is any alternative other than revising the mental health system from scratch.Of course, it needs to be investigated. Since medical records are not recorded correctly (not recorded), this investigation seems a bit difficult. Even if it is done, we can think that the probability of it being an accurate investigation may be very low.)
2) And also… We also understand from the ‘harmful psychiatric treatments and psychiatric realities’ revealed by those who see the serious harm they cause to people and expose them (by honest psychiatrists, other medical doctors, journalists and other researchers).
In my opinion.. In psychiatry departments, what is taught to psychiatry students is clearly ‘acts of harming people’. It is not an ‘action of health treatment’. It is not ‘methods of treating mental health’.
It is very difficult to say that courses in Psychiatry have the quality to enable psychiatry students to become ‘real doctors’. Psychiatry departments in medical schools do not offer students ‘real mental health treatments’ but rather a ‘culture of obedience and control peoples’ that includes ‘medicated treatments’ from mainstream psychiatry (probably in conjunction with pharmaceutical companies).
In other words.. Psychiatry departments primarily teach students who choose psychiatry the ‘culture of obedience to mainstream psychiatry’. The image of ‘if you don’t obey mainstream psychiatry, you can’t stay here’ is instilled in students.
Probably… Psychiatry students accept the ‘culture of obedience’ to mainstream psychiatry, as they enter a department that is not accepted by society, such as ‘psychiatry’, with the sole hope of becoming a ‘doctor’ (and not being deprived of these ‘doctor’ titles).
(In fact, this shows us that they (psychiatry students) stay in the psychiatry department partly out of necessity. Because they don’t have the luxury of opposing psychiatry. You either obey mainstream psychiatry and become a ‘doctor’ or you get fired. Your hopes are dashed. You keep crawling. We can say that this is a kind of threat from mainstream psychiatry to its students.)
(In fact, this shows us that they (psychiatry students) stay in the psychiatry department out of necessity. Because they do not have the luxury of opposing psychiatry. You either obey mainstream psychiatry and become a ‘doctor’ or you get fired. Your hopes are dashed.
You keep crawling. We can say that this is a kind of threat from mainstream psychiatry to its students.)
In fact, when we look at it from this perspective, you can also understand that mainstream psychiatry trains psychiatry students to ‘stay in psychiatry and be a shield against mainstream psychiatry’. And it really is.. Students, just because of their dreams of becoming a ‘doctor’, are able to ignore how mainstream psychiatry harms humanity and become a shield for mainstream psychiatry. (Of course, not all.)
As we mentioned above… students who choose psychiatry departments in medical schools… (when they graduate) graduate as licensed charlatans and psychopaths due to the psychopathic training they received from mainstream psychiatry.
(However, not all of them. There are also students who choose ‘honest psychiatry’. These students are brave-hearted students who know how much harm mainstream psychiatry has done to humanity (but unfortunately their numbers are almost few enough to be counted on the fingers) and therefore oppose it. They have decided to get away from mainstream psychiatry and become real honest psychiatrists. But at least after years, after being cooked in hospitals (having their knees bruised, in other words, having experienced a lot).. Never mind, this is a good meaning. The important thing is for students and psychiatrists to know the facts and to start a struggle against mainstream psychiatry.)
I hope, the number of these honest psychiatrists will increase. And it should. “The brains of students who choose psychiatry in medical schools should no longer be poisoned by the ‘toxic content’ of mainstream psychiatry that is clearly harmful to humanity.” Unfortunately, students’ brains are being filled with toxic content in psychiatry departments. This must end now..
That’s why we say… Students who graduate from psychiatry departments in medical schools graduate as licensed charlatans and psychopaths. (Although there are a few brave students who turn their backs on mainstream psychiatry..)
Psychiatry should be removed from medical schools immediately. Mental health systems should be revised, especially with ‘non-drug treatment methods’. etc. etc.
——–
As a final note, let me share some information.
“….in 2012, Tufts University psychiatry professor Seyyed Nassir Ghaemi, M.D., M.P.H., said this in his “Letter to a Young Psychiatrist”: ” I teach ignorance. Four years of medical school; and 4 more years of residency. … I teach we don’t know … (…)”
“…in his book Antipsychiatry: Quackery Squared, Syracuse University Press 2009, p. ix), psychiatry professor Thomas Szasz, M.D., says “psychiatry—an imitation of medicine—is a form of quackery.”
This quote by psychologist Bruce E. Levine, Ph.D. is actually very interesting:
“…..in a lecture on “Can Psychiatry Be Reorganized as an Institution, or Should It Be Abolished?”, psychologist Bruce E. Levine, Ph.D., who has advocated for the abolition of psychiatry as a medical specialty… conclusion is that while “in the 1970s psychiatry could have been reformed”, today “psychiatry has become psychotic” because of psychiatrists’ loss of touch with reality, that psychiatrists have become a “threat to others”, and that psychiatry as a profession “needs to be abolished.” (National Association for Rights Protection and Advocacy conference, Cincinnati, Ohio, September 8, 2012).”
Levine says psychiatry has become psychotic. I think he’s absolutely right. What do you call psychiatrists who perpetuate mainstream psychiatry that has become psychotic? 🙂
FOOTNOTE: You may have read this research. I recommend you read this article.
“Why Psychiatry Should Be Abolished as a Medical Specialty”
Wayne Ramsay, J.D.
http://www.wayneramsay.com/abolish.htm
Best regards… 🙂 Y.E.
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Thank you for shedding light on a worldwide issue Peter Gøtzsche. You are giving voice to the voiceless.
I can totally relate to how antipsychotics make you feel. The paralysis of volition is astonishing! I still remember how my assigned psychiatrist while I was locked up in the psychiatric ward told me, as if she could convinced me, that that particular antipsychotic had no side-effects whatsoever, and if it did have it, I would notice it within the next few days. Months onward, I still uncovering new ways of being under “this threat”. Another story is how I got coerced into taking the “threat”. It was the only choice I was given if I wanted to get out of jail.
My challenge now is how will I eventually taper off this med. But it is up to me to figure it out given that my doctor is not specially collaborative.
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The thing is, paralysis of volition isn’t a side effect. It IS the intended effect of so-called “antipsychotic” drugs. If you can’t imagine anything, you can’t hallucinate. That’s exactly the whole point, not an accidental adverse impact!
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Nathalie, you might consider looking into the Inner Compass Initiative run by Laura Delano and her husband Cooper Davis, Both have first hand experience tapering off psych drugs. Or maybe look at some videos on YouTube from Dr. Josef Witt-Doerring who runs The Taper Clinic.
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Nathalie, there are resources to assist you with tapering off antipsychotics. The best resource I’ve found is Dr Josef Witt-Doerring’s YouTube channel. Dr Josef is a psychiatrist who is critical of mainstream psychiatry and its reliance on psychopharmacology. He runs a Taper Clinic for getting people safely off psychiatric meds, & his site contains many informative videos.
Here’s a link to one video on Dr Josefs site that should help you:
https://youtu.be/QxfPvrRQj4g?feature=shared
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I read this a few days ago, and already had the same thoughts that I’m sharing now. Even though Gotzsche says the question is not a joke.
You know when someone usurps a condition by giving it an incorrect name, whatever they call it, this doesn’t mean that……and whatever they call it, this doesn’t change what it really is. Nor does it mean that everyone is going to believe them, and when a person is crazy or mad that they have defined what’s going on. I think there’s more flexibility there in conception, experience, perspective, understanding and insight.
Delusional, non reality based, brainwashed, etc. yes that applies, but “mad”!? Or “psychotic”!?
Years ago on Facebook some people started a group called psychotic psychiatry, but I didn’t want to go for it, also because the people to me tended to be one-sided about other things, but: I just don’t think psychiatrists have every shown much the sensitivity to be psychotic or mad. And if they ever would have they wouldn’t be acting like they are sane, and reality based, and the opposite of delusional when they make out they know what’s going on, and know how to “heal” it and don’t see the result in statistics, science, and social constructs that become extremely discriminatory etc.
A psychotic person or a mad person breaks away from statistical based norms, from consensual reality deportment, from the status quo, they have experienced and encountered things that the norm just doesn’t want to know exist, and if they do know it exists they don’t want to hear what’s really going on because it’s too disturbing to their conventional compromises, their idea of safety, their superficiality.
They to me aren’t mad or psychotic, or any of the other variations of madness, they seem to lack it.
You go to any insular setting, and you will find a community that thinks they have people akin to the great artists whose simple human expressions have passed the test of time. Simple human beings, not holy ikons, but those that allowed what gives legroom and leeway to emotions and thoughts that come out of nowhere and have no need to compromise themselves to fit in. And so nature spoke through them. But the same people in such a community heralding they have such among them, having exploited this idea of greatness, will then maybe also try to make out there was something wrong with said artists, and delve in with psychiatric diagnosis, which most of such simple humans beings have been assaulted with posthumously as if this has any meaning to begin with. So we can go back to delusional, etc. Or you might find them handing out instructions as to what kind of “discipline” one needs to become such an artist, maybe even along WITH that they could have been fixed up with: some magic psychiatric treatment. And thus they beat down any living human being interested in art, in where emotions can grow like the plants do, when allowed to, when what allows them to grow isn’t obstructed: batter them down with methods while finding any mental analyses that sounds like something more important than actual understanding of the art, and then harangue anyone who wanted to just do something naturally with such pretenses of how it’s supposed to be that any real meaning or understanding has long been anesthetized out of what would be going on would they be so lead astray. So and so is great because of fill-in-the-blank-and-make-it-sound-like-something-for-someone-that-is-that-scared-of-being-human-because-they-want-to-be-great.
If they start waking up dope them up with brain disabling magic drugs, because we just can’t have such going on, and just like magic say it’s to treat a chemical imbalance, although in reality it’s making one to disable the brain: such sterility being made out to be healing. If I would go on about it, it’s just unbelievable in ways how off these people are, what I’ve encountered. No understanding of imagination, no understanding of thought because it’s thought rather than indoctrinated produce called thought that will get approval as being reality based. It’s like the whole ground work of art through the ages wouldn’t exist. One silly brainwashed attendant I had conversation with, and said I liked to write poetry, mentioned how these “medications” would help. Yeah, we all need Handel’s Messiah on lithium, or neuroleptics, who knows what everyone else is supposed to be on (Michelangelo on antidepressants to improve the Sistine Chapel!? Mozart on ADHD medications because he could always wander away from the form, find something knew, an unsolicited theme, and get it to fit so the composition gelled!?? What was Emily Dickinson supposed to be on, and Shakespeare!???).
I used the word insular to describe what otherwise would be called provincial, but in the provinces away from the big city, that’s where one might find more of nature, and less of produced, manufactured glorification, as if a pill is more important than an herb. Out in the country also is where the Amish started the asylums that actually healed people. So that’s another word. The psychiatrists can use the word asylum, but that’s another thing they have yet to know regarding what it is.
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Very interesting comments so far on this incredibly intricate and seeming insoluble problem and I admire people like Peter Gøtzsche who is continuing to shed light on psychiatric incompetence and Big Pharma. However, I would like to see more research coming from outside the sciences since the study of “madness” has mainly been within the purview of the sciences, beginning two centuries ago. I suggest that to begin to solve the enormous errors of our time, we must first look at the root causes that involve the philosophy of mind. Here we are forced to confront the complexities of: the nature of consciousness; dualism; the history of materialism; traditional metaphysics versus natural psychology; empiricism versus nativism and other attendant issues. This would begin to shift our perceptions about the nature of “mental illness” and why society accepts the concept implicitly.
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Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance is a great volume on this very topic! Spoiler: it’s all Aristotle’s fault!
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Thank you!
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It’s also a fantastically engaging story between the philosophy. Written by a guy whose personality was erased by ECT, and talks about how he recovers himself on a long motorcycle trip with his son. One of the best books I ever read!
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Lynne, are you aware that research has been done “outside the sciences?”
Though most of these researchers would like their work to be accepted as “scientific,” popular wisdom seems to think otherwise.
Hubbard first reported his findings in 1950 after working with many people using a technique vaguely similar to psychoanalysis. After he got a meter that could detect “charge” on past incidents, things got more interesting, as his patients started recalling past lives.
Many researchers have used various forms of hypnotism to study the mind, and most of these have likewise discovered past life memories in the people they worked with. However, Ian Stevenson’s group, working at the University of Virginia School of Medicine, investigated past life memories in children without the use of hypnotism. They validated the past lives of many of these children.
Remote viewing (developed at SRI in the 1970s) has also been used to explore human consciousness. Courtney Brown has been the most persistent researcher in this regard. His viewers have looked at the past lives of many people, along with their most recent lives.
The problem, then, is not the lack of good research. It is the refusal of academic medicine (Psychiatry in particular) to acknowledge, discuss, test and use any of this research. This “incredibly intricate” problem is only so because the powers that be in the field of mental health are telling us this. It is, in fact, largely solved, is not really that complex after all, and those findings are in use by many practitioners around the world.
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Lynne, your suggestions bring up some interesting perspectives. However, I see things from a slightly different angle: meaningful change to how people view “mental health” won’t come from engaging in lengthy philosophical discussions. It will happen the way real change has always happened: over time from a quiet groundswell of ordinary people who simply decide that life’s too short to keep pandering to the mental health industrial complex’s self-serving status quo.
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Hi Birdsong,
How do you not “pander” to a biomedical based mental health system. They can, with the aid of a police escort, force their way into your home and bending the law almost to breaking point, declare you to be a danger to yourself and society based on some completely fictitious story about what you were supposed to have done to attract this attention. Then, no matter what you say or how rationally you act, they can forcefully drug you with long term depot antipsychotic injections and justify their actions by subjecting you to a tribunal hearing where they apply for a community treatment order (CTO) where they apply for the right, through rolling tribunal hearings every 6 months, to continue this drugging indefinitely.
These mental health tribunal hearings are the ultimate kangaroo court. They are a disgusting parody of the law that is about on par with a medieval witch trial in fact witch trials were probably fairer. The tribunal always finds in favour of the doctor(s) who initiated the hearing, no matter what the evidence. Even if you manage to engage an independent psychiatrist who declares you perfectly sane, the tribunal is still almost certain to rule against you.
When you eventually lodge a formal complaint about all this treatment, the Mental Health Complaint Commissioner (MHCC Victoria Australia) tells you that this is a systemic problem, which it is because similar things are happening to thousands of other people. The MHCC (Vic) tells you that you need to take your complaint to the Office of the Chief Psychiatrist (OCP). The OCP then tells you that they don’t deal with this sort of problem and refers you back to the MHCC.
Along the way you discover that an academic group studying this problem who obtained data through freedom of information have found that not one single complaint out of about 17,000 that was lodged with the MHCC over a period of time was properly investigated. A staff member at the MHCC tells you “off the record” that this is entirely true. Their job is solely to fob off complaints.
A Royal Commission into the Victorian mental health system results in a scathing report that says the system is “Not fit for purpose”. As a result of the Royal Commission there are some minor changes to the state laws including one which makes it illegal to judge a person’s mental health on the basis of their religion or spiritual beliefs. The good doctors involved in the tribunal system know better however. They ignore this law claiming that anyone who has religious or spiritual beliefs is obviously delusional no matter what the law says.
Anyone who tries to appeal a tribunal decision is threatened with increased drugging, ECT, isolation and restraint etc. This scares most people witless. Few appeal. In any case the appeal only results in another hearing in the same kangaroo court tribunal with the same inevitable outcome plus the possibility of an increase in the dosage of antipsychotic medication and/or an order for ECT treatment.
If you manage to survive all this as I somehow miraculously did, you can never find out who initiated the original complaint against you that triggered this intervention. All the likely suspects deny any knowledge of it.
You suspect but can never prove that someone you had a disagreement with and knew you had a history of mental illness simply picked up the phone and rang the state mental health system.
It is not just some psychiatrists that are “mad”. It is the entire biomedical based mental health system driven by greedy, power hungry narcissistic individuals who appear to have infiltrated society at many levels including the bureaucracy and government. These people believe they have the right and duty to treat those of us who succumb to mental health problems as subhuman. Some at the top earn substantial incomes treating people this way.
Adding to that, the media, driven by vested interests and the need for a good story have terrified the public with stories of psychotic axe wielding murders hiding behind every corner or under their bed.
Australia is considered by many to have one of the most abusive mental health systems in the world. They even expelled inspectors from the United Nations who came to check up on then. The state of Victoria is considered to be the most abusive state in Australia.
If anyone can figure out a way to change this atrocious systemic mess I would love to hear their ideas.
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Tim, I don’t think there’s much hope for a system as sick as the one we’ve got. But I also believe that eventually it’ll collapse of its own weight.
In the meantime, the best thing to do is steer clear of it as much as possible, (imho).
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Interesting comment Tim Wilson.
And yes, Victoria does seem to have a pretty bad record when it comes to Australia, though like the National Socilaist programs in Germany, it does tend to move around a little. The euthanising of complainants in Western Australia by State actors a gauge of how badly these people want to control the narrative. Why did our Treasurer flee the State rather than end up being ‘referred’ by Police to mental health services? He know something we don’t?
I had a conversation last week with someone who supports the execution of prisoners in Afghanistan (and having a bit of fun with the prosthetic leg, or killing children for fun) The claim being ‘we’ don’t understand what it’s like …… etc. But my point is that these executions done out of boredom are not only war crimes (which are covered up in the same manner as mental health services abuses, and thus will no doubt be subject to a whistleblower at some point if they aren’t killed in an ED) but they put other Australian soldiers at risk.
Should the video of a man laying on his back holding his prayer beads being shot in the face (after a request of “you want me to drop this c*&^t?”) be viewed by the enemy, they are more likely to fight harder and to the death knowing that the Australians are executing prisoners. There was much wisdom imparted by Mohammed over these types of matters, even feeding his prisoners more than his own army.
And keep in mind these were the ‘dirty jobs’ (executions) that other Nations refused to do (Danes, Brits)….. So it’s hardly surprising that such a Nation would have a system for ‘internal’ abuses.
The barbarism of mental health services is becoming more known in our communities (most of it much more visual when police stomp on heads or slam people to the ground and crack their skulls). I’m sure that eventually the Jewish population of towns became aware when the Einsattsgruppen was active in their area and made themselves as scarce as they could.
As long as they are being given State sanction to torture, kidnap and murder people and disguise it as ‘medical care’ that is probably the best policy. The key is the criminal negligence of Police. their referral of victims back to the criminals not dissimilar to the way they handed children being raped by priests back to be ‘disciplined’ (see the Royal Commission)
In Western Australia Police are being used to arbitrarily detain citizens, the Community Nurse simply tells police that anyone he wishes to snatch from their beds is his “outpatient” and the documents will be “edited” post hoc to ensure that the law has been complied with. It’s all about the illusion, and the boldness with which they are deliberately destroying peoples lives is no longer hidden………..with 17,000 complaints all with a ‘nothing to see here’ result? Our Chief Psychiatrist actually utters with the known fraud being produced by hospital FOI Officers. Fact, I have the documented proof.
Bit of a problem dealing with me I think because I play golf with the Consul General of a large Asian Nation. I get it that they might find it easy to snuff most people who dare to complain about being tortured….. different matter when there are people watching (and police aren’t sure “who else has seen the documents?”)
The Private Clinic ‘Counsellor’ selling the information as to how to get mental health services to do ‘swattings’ to arbitrarily detain still loose and a ‘danger to self or other’…… and no doubt still having to arrange woopsies in the ED when she might be exposed to criminal charges. And lots of others now aware of how to dismantle a persons life should they happen to believe that there are legal mechanisms available to deal with torture, kidnappings and attempts to murder (disguised as ‘medical care’)
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Thank you for writing this Tim Wilson. Because I live in India, which is still a developing country and is not as systematised as higher income group countries (but obviously has its own problems), there are still some degrees of freedom that allow some degree of safety from all this. But I wish more people knew about stuff like this before it becomes all pervasive like it is in North America, Australia, Europe etc.
I keep mentioning “India” in my posts because it might appear in internet searches and someone at some point reads it and is armed with info to protect themselves or others.
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Mange af de ansatte i psykiatrien nyder i deres stilling godt af altid at være de klogeste, men når de så skal korrigere mig i samtalen, som de har kaldt det, fremstår deres motivation forstyrret. Der er derfor ingen grænser for beskyldninger mod mig, når de vil tvangsmedicinere.
Many of the psychiatric staff benefit from always being the smartest in their positions, but when they have to correct me in the conversation, as they have called it, their motivation appears disturbed. Therefore, there are no limits to accusations against me when they want to force me to medicate. (Google translate)
(You know forced drugging)
There are lots of reasons, we feel hurt about this in abstract, that we need to claim opinions and discuss opinions. If all madness is about delusions, the rest follows as a chaos, and the drugs don’t work.
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How much ‘mental illness’ is just stress. Our modern ways are not-so-good, especially with TV bills and a smartphone and city noise. We weren’t built for it.
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You’d be surprised what some of us were built for.
But if people who are just stressed out are being diagnosed and treated as “mentally ill,” then there is something wrong with the system (and they are).
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Thank you for this which I find so clear. As a retired doctor who had a spectacular adverse drug reaction on a SSRI and met the mental harm system, I have been left with a brain injury as I was not believed at all and there was a totally illogical way of managing it (including ignoring what I was saying, doing nothing and doing harmful things). I am deeply grateful for your intelligent work. Even when I was deeply unwell, I could see how the delusional system is. I’m only sorry I didn’t realise earlier. I hope to add a drop in the bucket of what everyone is already doing for change. Thank you for your integrity and drive to do what is right and speak the truth.
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Wonderful content as always from Dr. Peter C. Gotzsche. Some who have their hope fixed on the abolition of psychiatry can put all their time, energy, and loyalty into that because their emotional and intellectual reserves are not taxed beyond their resilience by the ongoing horror of their child’s destruction by the psychiatric machine in context of medical neglect, reckless disregard for human life, and cruelty. Others hope that their psychiatrized child who has treatable medical conditions, which are known to contribute to psychiatric symptoms, could simply access the right kind of help, but they are blocked by the corporate, allopathic conflicts of interests. More fortunate parents may have found a functional-holistic doctor early and become apprised of their family’s unique risk factors for metabolic and stress-related vulnerabilities that have been known to contribute to “mental health emergencies”, and they were able to avoid falling into the psychiatric abyss. Many of us have children trapped under some level of allopathic psychiatric tyranny; we want IMMEDIATE relief from allopathic tyranny as much as anyone wants immediate abolition of psychiatry. WE would like the KNOWN evidence-based-non-toxic therapies of Functional-Holistic medicine to be MANDATED in the psychiatric wards NOW. I certainly hope we are not invisible, nor expected to remain silent.
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We often attack only the psychiatry graduates. But not the clientele. The clientele is what gives them the power they have.
The people who wear psych categorisations as badges of honor. The ones who log on with names like “bpdbaby” and “bipolardude”. The ones who don’t fight it at all. They weaken themselves and others around them.
The caretakers of patients who become likely to get more people into psychiatry graduates’ offices and hospitals because it worked for them in controlling their own family.
The ones who behave like unofficial kapos for mental health workers.
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This does present a problem.
Similar to the street drug problem. How much of it is created by the pushers, and how much by the users?
But I think it has been demonstrated that the pushers / for us psychiatrists / have more influence in keeping the whole mess going than many might imagine. We can safely consider most mental health system clients as victims in this game, as we can consider most drug addicts in their game.
An honest mental health professional would reject people from the system who were just there for superficial reasons. And an honest drug pusher would get out of the business. As is true with many modern businesses, the providers of the product are driving demand.
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Why is it always only the pills? Pills don’t take themselves. There’s nothing wrong if a person wants to voluntarily use pills or TMS or whatever. Of course, the fact that corporate interests might work to keep all the dirt alive is one part of it.
The ideology of psychiatry, the “MRIs and fMRIs show this and that” that they tell people when they don’t practically do any of it, the fact that they sell descriptions and categorisations as diagnoses, the fact that the very language of psychiatry is weaponised by people and used as an instrument of gaslighting, the fact that it gets used as a tool of blackmail and threats by individuals and so many other things.
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The thing is: Weaponized language, lies about scientific studies, deceptive marketing, accusations used for blackmail and for wrecking reputations have been used by criminals in many fields and will not stop even if psychiatry vanishes from this earth (which it is not likely to do).
And it is quite possible that the people who are currently victimized by psychiatry would find themselves victimized by some other group if psychiatry vanished.
But for psychiatry to use drugs to “treat the mind” goes totally beyond the boundaries of ordinary deception and completely depends on a general public ignorance concerning what the mind really is.
There are all sorts of people and businesses out there promoting that their product or service will “make you feel better.” If someone wants to take that bait, OK. But you CAN’T use drugs to treat the mind; that’s logically impossible.
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People use alcohol to “treat the mind”. They use nicotine to “treat the mind”. People use them because they find them relaxing or pleasurable. Some do it moderately while some do it to an unhealthy extent that destroys them. It’s not logically impossible at all. These kinds of arguments weaken anything that’s said against Psychiatry graduates.
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But the fact is that those drugs don’t in fact “treat” anything. They create an effect on the body that the mind attempts to compensate for. The mind is not part of the body and CANNOT be treated by any drug. Therefore psychiatry CANNOT be a legitimate branch of Medicine. Neurology is, but not psychiatry.
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At one level, what you are saying can appear to be true. Some people, particularly young people often do wear psychiatric labels like a badge of honour in what appears to be an attempt to define themselves in a society which for many has lost its purpose and meaning.
Many mental health clients are also very often demotivated, particularly when they are forced or induced into using heavy long term doses of medication. There can be little doubt that the long term use of medication often dramatically worsens the problems that it is supposed to help.
Irrespective of the cause, low motivation and loss of direction in life is often part of the mental health problem. Again it often has a lot to do with society’s values which can all too often induce a sense of meaninglessness and lack of purpose. It can take a long time, maybe even a whole life time for some of us to work through this very real issue.
I am therefore suggesting that a significant part of mental health is a problem within society itself. I am certainly not the first person to suggest that idea. Rather than face the reality of what is going on in this world and in particular our western culture, society often tries to deny the mental suffering that results from it. We then scramble around looking for ways to “fix” the person concerned rather than face the underlying social issues created and maintained by all of us.
Irrespective of anyone’s views on the significance of social conditions in mental health, you don’t have to be a psychiatrist or psychologist to realize that providing an already badly traumatized, confused or just lost person with a safe, supportive, kind and understanding environment has to have a better long term outcome than physical restraint, violence, and involuntary drugging.
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On 25-Apr-25, I got banned out of a mental health chatroom for saying that psych labels are not explanations of problems (they are just categorisations). The “you are not a medical professional” card was used and I’m allegedly a danger to the chatters with my views. Also had the false allegation of “you are attempting to talk people out of seeing their doctors” put.
There was a woman raving about how she’s borderline and that makes her meet narcissists and psychopaths. I found it sad how people view their lives through the prism of such terms. I mentioned that going through problems is bad enough without seeing your life through the prism of such labels.
Here is a transcript (usernames have been changed to Mod and me):
Mod (18:39:16)
Hello, me, I’m a mod for this chat and I need a moment of your time, plz.
Please respond here.
me (18:39:23)
yes
Mod (18:39:58)
I am sorry, but as you are not a medical professional, and are attempting to talk people out of seeing their doctors, you are being removed.
me (18:40:05)
huh?
Mod (18:40:10)
TY for your time, please DO NOT return in 48 hours.
me (18:40:14)
i did not attempt to talk people out of seeing doctors
that’s not true at all
Mod (18:40:33)
You are saying psychology is not a valid medical field.
me (18:40:43)
how does having a conversation about psychiatric categorisations have anything to do with not seeing doctors?
i said no such thing
Mod (18:40:52)
You are mistaken, and because such views are dangerous to our chatters, you’re being removed.
me (18:41:01)
please show me where i said “psychology is not a valid medical field”
Mod (18:41:21)
[08:07:37] i don’t care how many times they call psych categorisations as diagnoses. they aren’t. we’ve been forced to believe they are, but they aren’t
me (18:41:44)
yes, and i stand by that
https://www.madinamerica.com/2015/04/psychiatric-diagnoses-labels-not-explanations/
Mod (18:41:46)
categorisations which are often applied against a person’s will is different
me (18:41:53)
there are articles published on it
by licensed psychologists
since that’s something that is valid for you
Mod (18:42:08)
as I said, you are not a medical professional, and your views are dangerous for our chatters, so you’re being banned.
Please do not return in 48 hours, ty.
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Society is insane, a system based on abuse and trauma, exploitation and oppression. What can be said of psychiatrists refers to professional classes in general, trained and tasked with maintaining and managing the madness at large, rewarded with relative privilege for their noblesse oblige. Holistic human health requires social revolution, not forever false promises of the system reforming itself.
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If all of society is insane, wouldn’t the social revolutionaries also be insane?
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People don’t need to become like the institutions ruling over us. Revolution enables this at a social scale.
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But institutions are created and operated by people. Do you really think that an institution has a life or will of its own separate from the people who are part of it?
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“Do you really think that an institution has a life or will of its own separate from the people who are part of it?”
The whole is more than the sum of the parts. Consider your church?
Thought about you on Tuesday Larry. I play golf with a guy who met and had a lengthy conversation with LRH in London many years ago.
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Boans, my church is totally held together by the people in it, and has been threatened with extinction several times by other more powerful organizations – sometimes by sending in disruptive people. Of course my church has policies and rules, but they don’t get followed unless they are known and understood by members of the group.
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“The traditions of dead generations weigh like a nightmare upon the brains of the living.” (Marx) We are born free and everywhere are in chains, as Rousseau said, because ruling institutions control us from the get-go, as with the medical industrial complex laying claim to life from birth to death with ‘health care’ for profit and the pharamfia. Or industrial schooling laying siege to us from earliest age to socialize us into command-obey relations and thought and behavior control, in preparation for being docile adults just doing our jobs. Then there’s the massive mind control and propaganda of mass media. And more.
Of course institutions have a life of their own if that’s the way their power over us is to be described. That most modern institution of capitalism, the corporation, has even acquired the legal status of personhood, albeit an immortal kind of person or god without conscience, so as to impose its will to profit upon passing generations, while systemically protecting the actual persons behind this fictional front getting away with murder and laughing all the way to the bank.
We never engage the world as a blank slate on which we’re free to inscribe our life story without having to deal with the inheritance of history and its coercive influences and accumulated injustices, as if we’re all members of one big abusive household, or prison. Yet unlike ruling institutions, we are not without conscience, and compassion, moral beings in an immoral social system, and we can choose to free ourselves from the abuse.
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“Of course my church has policies and rules, but they don’t get followed unless they are known and understood by members of the group.”
We have laws in my State, but the Police can simply say that we don’t, and any problems for their organized criminal friends working in ‘mental health’ can be ‘disappeared’. Still, with a Premier (Governor) whose father was a psychiatrist what would you expect? (That’d be DOCTOR Radovan Karadzich.)
The failure to hold people to account according to the rules is like a cancer which will eventually destroy what we have. Unfortunately there are those who see a short term gain from that destruction. And their greed seems to show no limits.
The ‘agent provocateurs’ can be easily identified and dealt with in some rather creative manners if you are so inclined. I am reminded of that psychiatrist Hannibal Lecter when he said “Quid pro quo Clarice” lol (see the Chapter entitled “Agents” in Sun Tzu Art of War)
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I just saw a documentary about how Sears, a giant retail institution, died because it failed to adapt and serve new generations of customers.
The people can “kill” an institution by refusing to support it or cooperate with it. The USSR fell partly because of this.
But they cannot “kill” a psychopath. And so those live on – seemingly forever – using whatever system or institution they see as useful at the time. And the people then think that system or institution is the problem; it isn’t. It the batshit crazy people who have infiltrated it and are using it for their own sick purposes.
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The corporation as an immortal kind of person relates to the lifting of early legal practice granting state charter for projects of a limited time and purpose. Forming more interlocking interests with the post-Civil War industrial capitalist revolution, a corporate class developed and set out to ensure enduring institutions for wealth to be intergenerationally monopolized and weaponized for class war to control markets, including intraclass competition to conquer rivals (like former department stores giving way to online shopping). The corporate form abides as the essential logic of class rule.
I don’t draw a sharp divide between individuals and the society in which they live. Critical awareness of ruling institutions is crucial to waking up to just how history has been made by victors and imposed on victims, especially if we ourselves are to break free of their hold upon our lives, as in the institutions of law which legitimate organized crime against humanity. Otherwise, we’re more or less doing our jobs in these institutions and consenting to their continued encroachment upon what little life we have left outside their tyranny.
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Niko, what you are talking about does not require Critical Theory or “waking up.” It has been discussed and exposed for the entirety of the previous century, at least.
We are writing here on a website questioning the basic assumptions of our mental health system, as it has been formed by its “leaders,” psychiatrists. I believe that what we need to “wake up” to is what these “professionals” have been trying to hide from us since the West started becoming aware of it in the mid-1800s: That we are spiritual beings and that spiritual phenomena are real and are an important part of life. Even most people who oppose psychiatry, the “mental health” system, or modern corporate structures are unaware of this very vital and basic fact of life.
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I said nothing about theory, especially capitalized like some course in institutions of education, or indoctrination. Critical awareness, or common class consciousness of human society under ruling powers, will do.
For instance, (systemic) corruption in medicine, including psychiatry, has indeed been exposed for a long time. But because ruling class interests, like the Rockefeller crime family and the pharmafia, have come to monopolize a medical industrial complex (particularly intersecting with the military industrial complex), dissent has been marginalized and repressed, such that each generation forbidden knowledge must be rediscovered rather than being passed on as common sense, instead molded according to models of medicine imposed by institutuions serving profit and power rather than (real) science for human welfare.
Short of social revolution to overturn class rule, those who control the material means of (re)production in society will generally control the collective consciousness by which we beleive we know ourselves and the world. Institutionalized religion, arguably the original ideology of ruling classes in the early history of ‘civilization’ under class rule, demonstrates as much when it comes to our self-realization as spiritual beings.
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Well, I think you are confusing criminals with elites. Members of the elite class don’t have to be criminals, and criminals do not necessarily belong to the elite class.
Any human group will have some sort of structure, and that includes some sort of elite class. Criminals aspire to join this class because they see it as a path to power without barriers. The elites have historically been very bad at keeping criminals out of their ranks, and for this they can be condemned. But they cannot be eliminated.
Whether you call it “class consciousness” or Critical Theory, I find it an unworkable perspective based on false assumptions.
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Elites launch wars based on lies in pathological pursuit of wealth and power for which their subjects suffer mass murder. They conduct bizzness as usual condemning whole populations to poverty and starvation with far greater destruction and death than any act of genocide. So much more attests to crimes against humanity that have been normalized in the madhouse of a world where the few lord it over the many. I call that unworkable.
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They also design your roads and bridges, your transportation systems, your houses and offices, you water treatment plants and energy conversion plants, your computers and cell phones. They run your schools, churches, government agencies, charitable institutions, judicial systems, libraries, museums, amusement parks and so much more. It couldn’t be as bad as you say or we’d all still be cave men.
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“It couldn’t be as bad as you say or we’d all still be cave men.”
Thank you for saying that Larry Cox. If not for the wonders of modern (industrialized) medicine, millions of ordinary people would be legally blind from cataracts, countless women and babies would’ve lost their lives in childbirth, and I wouldn’t be here today without the availability of emergency medical procedures and life-saving medications like inhaled cortico-steroids.
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They do none of that. We do.* But because we work for them, as in ruling class institutions, they take the value of our labor for their greater wealth (the secret to wealth is not to work hard but to have others working hard for you). None of the benefits we produce for them to steal and then sell back to us (double whammy) would exist did they not prove profitable within an economic system predicated on class war and the so-called virtue of competition to gain at others’ expense. They care nothing about our welfare, which they always use as an alibi for tyranny, as Camus said. Which for one is why, keeping to tradition as with the ‘mentally ill’, they’re still at work with eugenicist science to depopulate ‘useless eaters’.
*Questions from a Worker Who Reads, by Bertolt Brecht:
Who built Thebes of the seven gates?
In the books you will find the names of kings.
Did the kings haul up the lumps of rock?
And Babylon, many times demolished
Who raised it up so many times? In what houses
of gold-glittering Lima did the builders live?
Where, the evening that the Wall of China was finished
Did the masons go? Great Rome
Is full of triumphal arches. Who erected them? Over whom
Did the Caesars triumph? Had Byzantium, much praised in song
Only palaces for its inhabitans? Even in fabled Atlantis
The night the ocean engulfed it
The drowning still bawled for their slaves.
The young Alexander conquered India.
Was he alone?
Caesar beat the Gauls.
Did he not have even a cook with him?
Philip of Spain wept when his armada
Went down. Was he the only one to weep?
Frederick the Second won the Seven Year’s War. Who
Else won it?
Every page a victory.
Who cooked the feast for the victors?
Every ten years a great man?
Who paid the bill?
So many reports.
So many questions.
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Excellent article by Doctor Gøtzsche. He pulls no punches, speaks the brutal truth and goes straight for the jugular of Psychiatry.
Doctor Gøtzsche’s articles and Bruce E Levine’s articles are the only reason I read this website. Sometimes Robert Whitaker’s articles are interesting but all other authors are lackluster.
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A large chunk of psychiatry graduates in my country (India) are utterly orthodox. There are no Thomas Szasz like figures here that I know of. I know of no Peter Gotszche type of non-psychiatry doctors who write against Psychiatry either. Even someone I thought who might be close to that just ended up being a disease-mongerer at the end.
Poor English fluency in many people who become doctors (they have enough knowledge to read their books, solve objective bits in question papers, memorise procedures and stuff; but not enough to play with the language and understand its intricacies) is one more factor due to which many of them will never be able to engage properly with the Mad in America sort of crowd (professionals or clientele).
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Thank you for your dedication there are so few people who truly care and see the truth.
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When I was on Invega and seeing the doctor once a month, I told her she was a liar about the given diagnosis and that she was gaslighting me. I went to Chicago to get the opinion of a second doctor and he said there was no way I was Schizophrenic because I was in the National Guard for six years, but that he was not going to take me off the drugs. Oh, and I had Bipolar he said. However, he did not point to two brain scans he did and tell me by looking at them what made me Bipolar. Well, when I went home from Chicago I had a report telling my Doctor I was not Schizophrenic and after two months of her delay she looked at it, told me I was Schizophrenic, and strongly suggested a significant increase in the monthly mg of Invega. Oh, and her response about me being Bipolar or not? “No! Of course you are not Bipolar! You do not walk around naked during the day, Karen.” Why did she say something so off the wall you may ask? Well, she was a little upset with the Doctor in Chicago for pulling a strike against the Schizophrenia thing so that was her little cat claw strike at him and at me as well for agreeing with him.
I had had enough when she said she would up the dose even when I was calling her a liar and a beaurocratic bullshitter (which means a liar on the paperwork basically). I also had had enough because for six years I had side effects that cost me the loss of four jobs and my car. The doctor never told me these losses were a result of side effects and I was too drugged to ask and too preoccupied with the shame of the diagnosis, but really more ashamed of my mental retardation, or extreme slowness. Really, it was a fog, a mix of shame and an unknowing of how I REALLY was mentally. I was physically retarded basically, not tired like she claimed, but retarded. She always dismissed my claim that I was drugged because her unscientific checklist designed to make her more money by keeping me on the schedule said I was either tired or not tired. I concluded this by observation rather than crawling across the table and grabbing their checklists from them (“Them” meaning who I referred to as the Doctor’s minions). One time I started for their checklists and they got very, very scared because they know when I mean to do something I do it.
Anyway, I had more reasons I had had enough. They drove me twice a month to get my blood drawn for six years for the purpose of routine, not for my health like they claimed. And I know this is true because my medical records said that my white blood cells count was low despite all that checking of my blood for all those years.
I had had enough they came into my place twice a week for six years to see if I was symptomatic. They came with their placid faces and pink sheet checklists and asked “Are you suicidal? Do you hear voices? Do you see things that are not there?” No, No, No, No, No. Never have, never will. For SIX YEARS I said the same dang thing. Everything I did in life for those six years is forgotten because the drugs erased those years. I was in a mental fog. But one thing I do remember is saying No, No, No, No, No over and over and over and over again to all there questions. It was a bogus diagnosis from the very beginning. Less than 30 minutes with the Doctor who diagnosed me, without him asking if I was hallucinating or hearing voices, no blood draws, no brain scans, a checklist, and no direct eye contact. Can you hear the word FRAUDULENT ringing in your ears at this moment? Because I certainly can!
I also had had enough because the 200mg/day dosage of Clozaril, unbeknownst to me at the time, was the cause of five hospitalizations in those six years. Karen was mentally ill. It was her health problem. Her brain was diseased like the diagnosing doctor told her. And I was too slow mentally to verbally “win” if you will, but I wasn’t completely aware of this medication induced disability, and I thought if there was slowness if was strangely part of Schizophrenia. They charted the slowness in the paperwork, but always said I was smart and that I wasn’t defined by my diagnosis. In response to the latter statement I said, “Then you are telling me I HAVE a diagnosis and I DO NOT! I have never hallucinated in my life!” I got more vocal at the end of the six years when I wasn’t on 200mg of Clozaril a day and wasn’t so negatively affected by the drugs.
Because I had had enough, I blocked my Doctor’s office phone number and every one of her minion’s phone numbers. Two months later, after a strange silence in my life, I found out from a neighbor that the police were banging on my door! I freaked out. I found out a week later that the police were there to escort me to the emergency room to have me pay for the $2,500 injection of Invega (my work wages had just changed and Medicaid dropped me), or if I was unwilling to sign my name to consent to that then the police were to send me to the hospital and force me to pay for a hospital stay and force me to get injected in the hospital. How could they do this to me you may ask? Well, by blocking their numbers I was violating my signature to consent to the doctor’s minions treatment, which is more accurately called management/control, as you can likely see from what you’ve read so far. I think blocking their numbers was illegal because signatures hold a lot of weight. Word of advice: NEVER SIGN ANYTHING REGARDING YOU MENTAL HEALTH!! Walk home from the hospital if you have to. I wish I had.
Anyway, a week after the police scare I went and received a forced injection. Otherwise they told me that the police would never stop coming to my house. Their numbers were still blocked on my phone – making their managed life control extremely difficult for them. I refused going to a pill form of risperdol because I’d have to get my blood drawn again. Relations were tense. I argued for at least two straight hours twice a week before finally blocking their numbers. They wanted to tangle me up in the courts for a reason they could and wouldn’t clearly explain to me! No way! Are you kidding me! I ain’t going to court! No way, no how! I socked it to ’em man! I socked them HARD, and they knew it! When I mean business, I mean business, and you better believe it!
About one week after that forced injection, they came to my place outside. No longer would I allow them into my place. I told them I needed boundaries with them and they had crossed boundaries with me too many times. They told me they would not inject me any longer if I didn’t want it. Tears ran down my face, but I was so happy I could literally feel the endorphins flooding my brain. I knew when they told me this great news that it was all about their paychecks. I don’t know exactly how the government money all fits in to who pays who and all that, but I DO know that a $2,500 injection is A LOT of money, and they knew I couldn’t afford it. They argued with me a lot about getting healthcare, but I told them it would take me years and years to save up for the deductible alone, and I’d STILL have to pay for my meds on top of that so NO! They definitely wanted to have job security minimum. I can’t say they are greedy because I’m not their Accountant, but I CAN say they lied to, harassed, and manipulated me for six years. It is a travesty. The GOOD NEWS is that the Lord promises to restore sevenfold what is stolen from you. He will repay me for what the locusts have eaten as the Prophet Joel says in the Bible. And BOY OH BOY! Am I having the time of my life! I can grocery shop WITH MY CAR and get food! Yay! I can visit friends, go hiking, go to the beach, go camping, go blueberry picking, go biking, have coffee out somewhere, go to my wonderful job without fear of side effects! Drive my car to my wonderful job! And the list goes on and on and on! Thank you Jesus!
In conclusion: always, always, always trust and believe in yourself over your doctor. Just like the article says, doctors most certainly cannot be trusted. Your body tells you exactly what it needs and wants. Listen to Dr. Peter Gotzsche and his associates. This article tells me and you exactly how we can so easily be deceived into believing it’s our mental illness, our disease, our problem. It says we are deceived by addressing what is the true threat to our health: the medication and the drivers behind it all – the doctors. Do not be deceived! The truth helps give you a backbone. It is the greatest insight into your false diagnosis of all! Go put those liars in their place y’all! Booyah!!
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Wow, what a horror story!!! So much for “informed consent!” Glad you escaped them! You showed a LOT of courage!
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Thank you Steve! That is the best compliment I have ever received since I escaped them six months ago! In fact, nobody has told me I was courageous! I was courageous! Very courageous! You are 100 percent right. I believe informed consent involves consent to the dangers of the drugs, but that is never informed to clients. The absence of information is a half truth, which is a whole lie. And a whole lie on the dangers lead to premature death and all the other horrors, like you say, that I went through. This explaination of informed consent, just like I have said, is sorely missing from the discussion between new mental health patients and their doctors.
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Because they know that if they were totally honest about their drugs and their “diagnoses,” they’d lose a LOT of clients!
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Exactly!! I am so glad you see clearly! Everyone but one of my friends do not see clearly into this unfortunate situation for so many people – including myself. Many of them spiritualize suicide by blaming the devil. They have kept silent in responding to me about the medication being the blame and the vicious cycle the medication and doctors kept me in for their own profit gains. I felt very dismissed and unimportant when a Pastor I know said, “Talk to your doctor.” How do you reason the truth of a false diagnosis with a doctor who didn’t care enough to tell you that the side effects caused the loss of four jobs and the use of your car? And this Pastor, my Pastor, and a third Therapist in the making Pastor all told me “Thank you, Lord, for Doctors.” After all I’ve been through! I’d say it’s unbelievable that they stay so ignorant, and yet their ignorance is exactly the reality I have to come to terms with. I think it’s more than ignorance too. I think they truly love and support doctors. It’s maddening to me because they were good friends of mine and through it all and after it all they just didn’t care for me at all. Even when I got my personality back they never once took notice or rejoiced with me. I was either dismissed, told I still needed healing (also dismissive), told “Don’t be against Doctors”, or prayed over because of continued “sickness” and said I was still in need of a doctor. I say, “I am healed and set free!” These pastors, however, are always praying for healing and never receiving it. There is always spiritual warfare, sickness to overcome, and deliverance to be received time after time after time again. I am thoroughly, 100 percent OVER that ridiculous pursuit. It’s a chasing after the wind. I am healed! Isaiah 53:5 tells me so.
I wish there was a way to help patients that were like me. At the time I was too confused mentally to be so adamant as I am now about me being healed. It was not my fault for being slow mentally and verbally. Maybe pastors could help by at least vocalizing this. I can’t suggest this to my Pastor or the other two because they chose to dismiss my feelings.
I believe their dismissal is also an invitation for their own agreement with intimidation, manipulation, greed, lies, and also even my own start down a path toward premature death. All of that is part of witchcraft, which they preach people need deliverance from. Never will they admit that Doctors themselves need deliverance from witchcraft. Maybe because they are the “so called” professional experts on our health? They all kept very silent with me. I find their silence quite deafening to my heart. Silence in the presence of evil is never a good thing. It’s consent, and I truly believe these three pastors consented voluntarily to the abuse of my doctor. What do you think of this?
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Hi Karen,
I too can only say well done for overcoming your ordeal with the mental health authorities.
You said “I wish there was a way to help patients that were like me”.
What I can tell you is that it is an enormous, world wide, problem. In the USA it is estimated that approximately 1 person in 1000 of the total population is undergoing forced or coercive treatment like you did at any given time. In Canada and Australia it is a lot more. Approximately 2.5 people per 1000.
Mental health is a huge international industry and their relentless propaganda and powerful lobby groups have been very effective at widely spreading lies and misinformation that have influenced and continue to influence many people. Mental health is also a huge problem. There is no simple one size fits all solution. Many people however suffer horribly and often unnecessarily because of this ignorance and false information.
There is plenty of good information available about this problem including many books. Two books written by Robert Whitaker, the founder of this web site are worth reading to gain more insight about what happened to you and has been happening to many others for a very long time. They are “Anatomy of an Epidemic” (2010) and “Psychiatry Under The Influence” (2015). A more recent worthwhile book is “Your Consent is Not Required: The Rise in Psychiatric Detentions, Forced Treatment and Abusive Guardianships” by Rob Wipond (2023).
If you want to help people like yourself I would suggest reading at least one of these books to increase your own knowledge of the problems and the situation. You may well be horrified at what you find. Then quietly, gently, share that knowledge with anyone who might be interested but please be very careful. When you challenge people’s deep seated beliefs about mental health (or anything else), it can provoke a very hostile reaction. Some may even call the local mental health authorities and report you as “mad”. Then you could very quickly and easily find yourself back in the situation that you have just escaped from or worse.
Your pastor, like most people caught up in this mess is probably not evil, just ignorant. Changing this deep seated ignorance in the face of a massive and relentless campaign by those I call Conservative Vested Interests (CVI’s) is no easy task. I can assure you that there are plenty of people trying.
One last thing. Spirituality, in one form or another, is often a way for some people to heal even very serious mental health problems. There are people around who know about and understand all this. These sorts of people may be able to help but they can be difficult to find. They too have to be careful what they say or they can finish up in a lot of trouble for challenging “the system”.
Once again I caution you to be very careful who you talk to and what you say.
Good luck, stay safe and please be careful.
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Thank you so much for the book recommendations! I will be sure to read them, and not share anything I learn. Also, thank you for warning me to stay quiet. I have taken that very seriously ever since liberation day, largely because my family was extremely hostile to me during the abuse. Thankfully, I do have one very good older friend who has my back 100 percent. She is the only person I have told about liberation day. I am enjoying life for the first time, and I am 38 years old. I seize the day, every day praise God!!
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“No one will smear your name more viciously than the person terrified you’ll expose the truth about them” Elizabeth Shaw.
I’d suggest caution too, if you have anything left to lose. Midazolam and morphine (harvested from another patient so the books balance) in the E.D. is one solution available to these people should you start speaking truth. Though I did find that God was watching whilst those with a duty turned their faces away.
Conspiracy to stupefy and commit an indictable offence, conspiracy to pervert the course of justice, conspiracy to unintentionally negatively outcome…….. all disguised as being an “emergency”. Fascinating that plotting to exploit an “emergency” can be concealed by disguising the plot. But with zero accountability we should not be surprised at the mess this area of ‘healthcare’ is in. Police don’t want a Dept of Moral Turpitude, so ‘medicine’ it is.
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What is the E.D.? What is your suggestion concerning it? Elizabeth Shaw was so right! Maybe she spoke from experience, I don’t know. I haven’t heard of her name before. But yeah, calling a doctor a lying, greedy manipulator doesn’t go over very well. I thought I’d think about visiting them if they want prayer and asking the Lord to fill my mouth. He is wisdom (Isaiah 11), and he lives within me so I do trust that he’d help me speak words that do not bring a vicious attack back on myself. I do not like me vs. them mindset at all! Hopefully, with time, God can help me speak the truth in love to some doctors. I know my older friend agreed to go with me and pray for a specific doctor in the future. But we don’t know yet if he’ll agree to prayer. I just thought of doing this two days ago.
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What is the E.D.?
The Emergency Dept. A place where the ’emergency’ provisions can be exploited. I note that when it comes to acts of torture though, that it can not be justified by claiming “it was an emergency” or that “my superior ordered me to do it”. Most people are ignorant of what can be done once an emergency has been declared.
What is your suggestion concerning it?
Avoid at all costs. This is the place where doctors find it easiest to conceal criminal conduct as police will not even bother looking at crimes (unless it is something that was done to a doctor). So it is a great place to torture and kill citizens with impunity….. and you can call it medicine if you like but I think that plotting to stop someone’s heartbeat with a cocktail of drugs you know will kill them is not actually medicine. I have offered to take police through the events of that night and even told them that it was all caught on camera but ……. the Police officer who also refused to take the documents demonstrating the motive for the attempt to kill, said “It might be best I don’t know about that”.
It’s actually quite clever in it’s simplicity, and I have little doubt that after the “Targeted Review of E.D. Admissions” the ‘authorities’ are quite aware of how many they have been putting through without raising any eyebrows. Not that it bothers me, I understand that should a doctor have someone insisting they be held to account, they need a means to dispose of their problems. What next, a need to apply to ethics committees to do experiments on cardiac patients?
I doubt that prayer would work with the people I was ‘involved’ with, they think the ARE god, and have found loopholes in the law (and a few friends prepared to look the other way while they do the deed) that give them the power of a god to take life for convenience.
The good news is that I came across some people who actually believe, and in their book it says:
O you who have believed, if there comes to you a disobedient one with information, investigate, lest you harm a people out of ignorance and become, over what you have done, regretful.
I feel sure they regret the people who died as a direct result of their negligence to ensure that nothing was done about someone they KNEW was doing deliberate harm to people in the community. Or were their concerns more to do with their jobs and pensions?
Unlike the Police and other ‘authorities’ here who ignore any information that doesn’t suit their delusional reality. Police happy with me speaking to these people until they realised I still had the documented proof and then they needed to know “who else has seen the documents”. They should have been a little more thorough with their cover up really….. because their evil was clear for all to see. We know who they are, and it is not the people who follow the word of God when He said “Do not conceal truth with falsehood” ….. because that’s their ‘business plan’
i find it amazing that the differrence between torture and treatment is the status of the citizen. Make them a “patient” and torture becomes healthcare. Which is extremely convenient when, as in my State, that can be done after the fact with document “editing” (commonly called fraud unless done by FOI Officer at a hospital) In much the same way that the drugs I was ‘spiked’ with is a criminal offence* (listed a s being a “stupefying drug”), unless there is a prescription for it, then it becomes medicine? A doctor telling me to consume copious amounts of alcohol doesn’t make that medicine, so why the stupefying drugs?
* in much the same way it is an offence for the Community Nurse to forge a Form titled “Outpatient Case Notes” to deceive police into believing that I was his “outpatient” and forcing me into an interrogation at the point of a weapon. I accept they were not aware I had been ‘spiked’ with date rape drugs (The Community Nurse was, it’s in his own handwritting) and were also not aware they had been lied to. Simply used a s a tool by the Community Nurse to torture me and then forge the documents to make the kidnapping appear lawful.
And my ‘crime’? I had a disagreement with my in laws. What a waste of resources, and the lengths they went to in order to cover it all up. No wonder they are failing most of the people who seek their ‘help’.
Imagine an environment where they simply assume it will be okay to kill the complainant because he has the proof and is going to police for help. How insane do you have to be…… oh wait, police helped them, not me. I forgot.
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Sorry, but I do not understand anything in your comment. I know you put a lot of thought into it, but it does not make sense.
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One of the most frustrating things for those of us who experience so called psychosis is to be told we don’t make sense.
The next step is for the police, often with mental health authorities in tow, to drag us off and lock us up for a while and then forcefully medicate us. This is not because we are violent or criminals but because someone else can’t understand what we are talking about and feels uncomfortable about that.
These people deal with their own discomfort by claiming we are mad and then insist we be treated for our madness according to their view of reality. This consensual reality which they then claim is the only reality results from large groups of people clustering together and collectively agreeing on what they believe is the only real reality. That to me also doesn’t make much sense.
We live in a world where a lot of really crazy things seem to be happening. Things that for at least a few of us don’t make much sense either
This includes murdering and torturing thousand and sometimes millions of people including children and babies because of some crazy belief that they are somehow different to us and are therefore sub human and need to be annihilated.
Boans, who often posts on MIA, makes perfect sense to me with what he is saying. He tells a story similar to many of the stories from those of us who identify as mad and live with deep seated unresolved trauma and inner conflict and confusion as well as what we see and experience all around us.
Probably one of the biggest complaints that mad people have is that nobody listens to us. It is much easier and more comfortable for them to just dismiss our very real experiences as not making sense instead of listening… really listening.
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The problem of communication stretches way beyond the merely “mad.”
Not only do we have hundreds of different languages on Earth (though many are related), but most of us lack the skill to communicate in any other way (telepathically) which cuts down our ability to understand each other even more.
Many “autistic” people have been found to be telepathic and thus have rich exchanges of ideas with others who share their gift.
For better or worse, though, if one cannot make oneself understood using language, one is looked down on or ostracized. What else can the rest of us do?
However, difficulty in using language should not by itself qualify as a “mental illness.” Such difficulties can be remedied. But the person who insists on being misunderstood will suffer; I don’t see any way around that.
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The problem with the ‘mental health professionals’ is that they call a spade a shovel. Point out their error and you will be treated until your prepared to call it an electric drill should they demand that level of delusion from you. Now you’re starting to ‘heal’.
Our Premier who doesn’t like the truth I speak prefers to call someone being ‘spiked’ with date rape drugs and who then has police put a weapon to their head to make them talk to someone who lied about them to procure police ….. “a referral”. The National Socialists used similar euphemisms….. “editing” for acts of fraud, “unintended negative outcomes” for killings which you can’t prove the intent of (as a result of the “editing” quite possibly)
I do think the eagle will come home to roost for those who are twisting the meaning of words beyond recognition. They’re not hanging gay people in Iran, they’re chiropractically stretching them with unintended negative outcomes …… dickheads
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Hi Larry,
You said
“the person who insists on being misunderstood will suffer; I don’t see any way around that”
I would suggest that the person who says “I don’t understand you or what you say” will inevitably try and make that other person suffer in one way or another, even if it is just about distancing themselves from the person they claim to not understand.
Also this alienation is mostly not about language. It is about something called connection and empathy. Many people, including most psychiatrists that I have known appear to have very low empathy and little or no capacity for connecting deeply with others.
How otherwise could they do the things they do to people and live with themselves?
A former psychologist now film maker and mental health commenter, Daniel Mackler said on one of his videos, “The system [including the medical/psychiatric/psychological training that mental health practitioners go through] burns the common sense out of them”.
I couldn’t agree more.
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So, if you don’t understand someone speaking to you, you’re supposed to pretend that you do?
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Interesting points you make Tim Wilson.
I guess the first thing I would try to deal with is; Do I identify as being ‘mad’?
I have just sent an email with a brief discussion of the possibility that I am mad, AND that I am also speaking the truth. The two are not mutually exclusive.
I do believe you’re right in suggesting that it is more comfortable for people to believe I am mad, than it is to deal with the fact the State is sanctioning the torture, kidnapping and murder of anyone they believe is a threat to their ‘mental health system’ by exposing how they are violating human rights agreements ratified by the Federal Government.
If I recall correctly you are in this vile place called Australia? I have said for nearly 15 years now that all I require is the return of what was mine and I will leave and they can continue with their ‘program’ without the issue of me speaking the truth (something they obviously find it difficult to silence me for).
So am I mad, and what is the truth. Well, as I suggested to a Prof who examined the ‘redacted’ documents I obtained via FOI (‘spiking’ with date rape drugs exposed, use of police to obtain interrogation [swatting] and enable the forging of statutory declarations concealed. Clearly criminal hence the need to conceal the actions of the Community Nurse in deceiving police) I’m more than happy for people to slander me all they like……. and when they are done can we then examine the documents and the offending?
See. whilst we may say that in the opinion of others I am mad, that does not mean I am anyone’s “patient”. Which was the issue the day I was tortured and kidnapped. There is in law a need for the person who the Community Nurse procures police to detain to prove that the person has a “treating psychiatrist”. Police can of course request that someone they have detained on criminal matters be assessed under a separate section of the Mental Health Act (Police Powers) but the documents I have clearly show this was not the case. The Community Nurse forged a document titled “Outpatient Case Notes” and then called police and requested assistance with his “outpatient” to have them use weapons to make me talk to him (knowing I would, as I did, tell him to get the fuk out of my home), a serious criminal offence.
Problem for the Community Nurse is that he has no right to do an ‘assessment’ without a referral source…… and he had no valid source. He simply used police to force me to talk to him by deceiving them, and then ‘verballed’ the statutory declaration, and had police then deliver me to the cage creating the impression for his colleagues that I was a Police referral. Kidnapping now complete after I was tortured to enable the ‘verballing’. If I were a “patient” by definition of the MHA no problem. Minus that status, crimes.
Okay so in that regard I believe I have established “probable cause” to ask maybe a few more questions. Now lets maybe move to the fact I was ‘spiked’ with date rape drugs and the Community Nurse KNEW that fact. It’s in his own handwriting on the document he forged titled “Outpatient Case Notes”. Police informed? Nope. Doctors who I was ‘referred’ to informed? Nope…… maybe a conspiracy with the person who spiked me to pervert the course of justice? Yup. Forged documents, creating a false belief, conspire to pervert, ….this is starting to look ugly. And it gets worse the more you look.
So what’s the hospital going to do about this? Especially given the psychiatrist who examined me that day said ‘nothing wrong with this one, throw it back’ (thinking Police had requested I be ‘assessed’).
Me knocking on the door asking for my medical records. Okay so they started a vicious campaign to gaslight me, and deny me access to my medical records. Something they can not do to my legal representatives.
Events became long and complicated, not because of anything I had done, but because that’s what criminals do, they try and conceal with further offending. Wife conspires with FOI Officer (she claimed she was threatened by hospital staff to follow their instructions and provide them with information about my discussions with lawyers. And when I started presenting the “probable cause” to Police? They became extremely desperate.
Now, which part of that means I’m mad? Is there a particular diagnosis that comes with what I have written? I mean I understand the viciousness of the gaslighting and psychological torture I was subjected to (interesting that the person doing that enlisted the assistance of a psychiatrist). I understand the trauma which still haunts me to this day, they did after all try and kill me and conceal that as ‘medicine’ too. They seem well versed in the use of “emergency provisions” to overcome the protections afforded the community by law. I can go through the method used to euthanise people in the E.D. should anyone wish to know the method…… police officer tells me “it might be best I don’t know about that” once he had seen the motive for the attempt. Sounds insane right, and I agree. I really struggled to understand how this could happen.
So I don’t have the proof of the attempt to murder me (but know it’s there AND the people who interrupted proceedings are aware, though silent), but it follows that the people concerned about being exposed over the conspiring to stupefy and commit an indictable offence namely kidnapping might call in some favors? So back a step to the way I was ‘detained’ (and I use that word reluctantly)
I watched an interview with Historian David Irving earlier today. Found his discussion of the methods of torture and the differences between the US (waterboarding, pulling fingernails to get the answers they want) and the European methods (covert though providing truth which may not be preferred by those obtaining the information) Australia seems to be caught between the two. The coercive methods of mock executions and threats of pack rape (of family members) and the more covert methods of listening to conversations between ‘friends’ (and threats to psychologists (and lawyers) to ask certain questions and provide the answers to ‘authorities’. The Eve to Adam method iykwim. Exploit their trust in situations they think are confidential but aren’t. Nicola Gobbo style)
And hey, after hearing D Irving saying this;
Himmler to SS Generals Oct 6 1943 in a speech about Police Operation (Posnan, Poland) he said “A lot of you don’t understand why we didn’t just kill the Jewish men, we also eventually started killing the Jewish women and children too.” He says “It’s obvious I had to do that. It stands to reason. Because otherwise they’re going to come back in two generations time and take revenge on us. So we had to do the job. If the job is to be done, it has to be done properly”.
Himmler by Historian David Irving 59.00 – 59.28
and looking at the situation in Gaza, I’d be happy to just have my property returned and I can leave this place that makes me feel like vomiting every time I have to go out in public.
So am I mad? You bet your life I am….. but that was done to me, it is not a product of who I was before this vicious attack and assault on me by the State of Western Australia.
يَٰٓأَيُّهَا ٱلَّذِينَ ءَامَنُوٓا۟ إِن جَآءَكُمْ فَاسِقٌۢ بِنَبَإٍ فَتَبَيَّنُوٓا۟ أَن تُصِيبُوا۟ قَوْمًۢا بِجَهَٰلَةٍ فَتُصْبِحُوا۟ عَلَىٰ مَا فَعَلْتُمْ نَٰدِمِينَ
The translation is roughly; “O you who have believed, if there comes to you a disobedient one with information, investigate, lest you harm a people out of ignorance and become, over what you have done, regretful.”
These people don’t care about the truth, and if forced to look they simply “edit” reality and deliberately fuking destroy peoples lives whose truth doesn’t suit their delusion that they are ‘healthcare professionals’. Some honor, integrity and accountability might be a start…….. and I’m mad?
Also, it has become patently apparent to me why these people are failing so miserably. Disguising acts of torture as ‘treatment’ by calling someone a patient is hardly doing much to ‘help’ them. Though it does explain the failure. And that, my friends is all that is being done. My ‘case’ proves how such vileness can be concealed simply by changing someone’s status on documents. It’s that simple.
Anyway, waiting for the Sonderbehandlung (unintended negative outcome, don’t you love the euphemisms? “editing” of legal narratives when they mean fraud? They have ‘history’ al right) because they are hardly going to allow me to have what is rightfully mine returned….. that was used to pay off the person who ‘spiked’ me and then gaslight me to the point where I walked in front of a truck. Nice work, I must admit a level of admiration for the people doing these killings in this manner…. bloodless for them. Much better than the beatings they used to do in the cells which traumatised public officers who “didn’t have the stomach for it”.
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Hi Boans,
I declare myself “Mad” because nowadays is seems to me to be the easiest way to function is this world, and find some degree of acceptance in the so called normal world that many consider themselves to be members of.
As a very young child I obviously had some “social problems” but in those days, the late 1940’s to early 1950’s, I was just considered a “bad little person” who just needed to be disciplined. This inevitably meant frequent floggings.
I do recall feeling very unhappy and uncomfortable a lot of the time and that I didn’t really belong in this world. I can’t imagine why I ever got to feel like that.
These days I would undoubtedly be labelled with some DSM-5 diagnosis and medicated with a collection of designer drugs intended to make others around me comfortable and me probably even more miserable and alienated but that didn’t happen back in those days. Even back then, those who did take some interest in my bad behaviour seemed to think I had some sort of a brain disease.
By my early 20’s I was hearing “God” voices. I still do to this day and I must say in passing that we have some very interesting and informative conversations. That inevitably got me hospitalised and diagnosed with schizophrenia.
Up until a few years ago I was incredibly ashamed and embarrassed about my mad label and tried to pretend to the world that I was normal. As people got to know me they inevitably saw through this ruse and realised that I was somehow “different” or “unusual”. They then inevitably acted as they believed was appropriate towards anyone they regarded as different.
Sometimes this was with a condescending kindness but other times it was with angry vilification.
I didn’t start referring to myself as Mad until a few years ago when the local mental health authorities decided that I was not only mad but also very dangerous because I refused injections of long term antipsychotics.
To protect society from a dangerous person like me they decided to permanently lock me up in a geriatric asylum for the insane known as the Peter James Centre in Melbourne, Australia. It is also known informally as the Melbourne Euthanasia Centre where death by overdosing with anti-psychotic medication is routinely carried out. Death of course is always due to natural causes. It is quite natural for an elderly person to die quite quickly when forcibly injected with excessively high doses of antipsychotics.
I didn’t like that idea too much so deciding it was either them or me, I took matters into my own hands.
I have learnt a few little tricks in my life for navigating the mental health system and managing some of the very insecure and often unstable people, including many psychiatrists who work there.
Some people sometimes refer to me as a psychiatric survivor.
But whenever there is a knock on the front door my heart jumps. It could be another encounter with the “Thought Police”.
I am forever aware that next time I might not be so lucky.
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Whenever I read a story like this one, something infuses me with the grit I feel I am missing at the moment to keep fighting. Thank you for sharing Tim!
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In many ways Karen, I’m really pleased to hear that.
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Boans, do you currently identify as mad, like insane? If you are a patient, I have to say you are very confused and probably on prescription drugs that cause your mental confusion. It is dangerous to your brain and your health. Being concerned for yourself is a better thing right now than being proud of insanity.
Your Doctor is likely more mad than you, but not mentally. Mad, as in crazy for causing you to go crazy. My encouragement to you is to set healthy boundaries with your Doctor. I can’t tell you what I did to set boundaries with them. But I can say that by setting boundaries with my crazy doctor, I have been drug free for six months and I am in the present, in reality, have clarity of thought and have my old happy personality back. It is smart to not take pride in insanity as a way of life, but rather to have a sound mind. I wish you the best with your health!!
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Hi Karen
It is interesting that you are having a go at Boans but not at me. I also publicly declare myself mad. These days I have no desire whatsoever to be normal. I regard so called insanity as a great blessing because I have come to understand its immense value and the limitations of so called normality. I usually do try to be nice to “norms”, particularly psychiatrists and most psychologists because I pity them but there is no way I aspire to their horrifically limited life.
“God grant me the wisdom and insight that only the truly insane can experience and the ability and good fortune to keep out of the way of norms, particularly those who work in the mainstream mental health system or otherwise support it.”
I’m not the first or only person to think this way.
You’ve got to be crazy. It’s too late to be sane. Too late. You’ve got to go full-tilt bozo. ‘Cause you’re only given a little spark of madness, and if you lose that, you’re nothing. Note, from me to you… Don’t ever lose that cause it keeps you alive. – Robin Williams
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But the actual game of biological life has never been to “be normal.” It has been to survive, and leave behind progeny who have a good chance of surviving. Beyond that, it is to enjoy life and gain friends by being helpful.
There are those out there trying to sell us on “be normal.” But if it’s what passes for “normal” here on Earth, I don’t want to live that way, and most people don’t.
If someone is trying to be “normal” they may be convinced that this is the best way to survive. But most of us know that isn’t true.
Many people who have been looked up to in the past and who we look up to today shunned “being normal” for good reason.
Beyond that, there are at least two kinds of “crazy” people: 1) The people who are labelled crazy or driven crazy by one or more really crazy people (psychopaths). 2) The psychopaths and those heading in that direction. These people are truly dangerous and most should be monitored or locked up. Their game, of course, is to convince us that they are harmless and that WE are the ones who are dangerous and should be locked up.
Some victims of psychopaths can recover if properly cared for. Others remain damaged for their entire lives. Because there are many psychopaths involved in the “mental health” system, as well as quite a few well-meaning folk, it is a very messed up system that most wise people would advise to stay away from. We know there’s something wrong but often end up shouting at each other because there is so much false or harmful data about the subject being pushed on us by the people who are really crazy.
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In any field where there is no clear-cut standard of “success,” there will likely be a lot of chaos. And psychopathic types LOVE chaos!
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I don’t identify with that at all. Quite the opposite in fact.
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Didn’t say you did. Just saying that studying physics is not contrary to believing in spiritual realities.
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Boans, do you currently identify as mad, like insane?
Afraid not Karen. No doctor, no drugs (or ‘medicines’ for that matter), don’t drink, don’t smoke……and what you seem to call “confusion” may be from the levels of anxiety I go through as a direct result of being subjected to long periods of State sanctioned psychological torture.
I note you didn’t answer my question as to what diagnosis comes with being drugged without your knowledge and having a Police weapon put to your head to make you talk?
Your not alone in trying to convince me that I am mad though…… anyone who is involved with the State mechanism here seems to do the same thing with their negligence (see for example the ‘poison pen letter from our Chief Psychiatrist, or the slandering by Police instead of performing their duty).
I started getting used to that vileness until I started playing golf with a Consul General of a large Asian Nation…… he called me “Sir” and treats me with dignity and respect. And I guess that given the fact his Nation sends a lot of students to Australia it would be a matter of ensuring the safety of wealthy peoples children. Wouldn’t want them being ‘spiked’ and having police put weapons to their heads to garnish information about their parents or some such thing right?
There’s also my friend who is Dato Hajji…… who has an interest in human rights…… he finds me a little rude because I don’t let him win, but confused? Not really. Still, it is only 5 hours of golf once a week and perhaps he doesn’t have the benefit of being able to travel through time and space and read minds like the doctor who diagnoses’ people with three serious mental illnesses after 5 minutes?
Maybe the President of the Australian Islamic Council and the Imams can give you the ‘diagnosis’, though they seem more interested in facts as well, rather than my ‘confusion’?
See, I think Tim Wilson is on to something when he says people tend to chose the reality they prefer (hope I’m not misrepresenting your position there Tim) Australians don’t tend to see the War Crimes their servicemen committed for the US in Afghanistan despite the Federal Court openly declaring the crimes. They prefer to believe the “edited” legal narratives where an unarmed ten year old boy are turned into a whole Taliban militia and medals are presented for killing him…. mental health services use the same method of “editing” documents to make themselves out to be the heroes of human rights abuses (at least in my instance they did)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8kz6pCizi4&t=604s
There’s the “editing” being done by Australia from the ‘horses mouth’. It’s what he did for a job.
Anyway, the difference is probably that they have seen these documents I have, and you haven’t. Maybe they’re interested because they have a few they want ‘done’ themselves? Mmmmmm funny but unlike the public officers and others I have dealt with (and I exclude the politician who is a lawyer and who explained to me about the ICC), these seem to be good people who actually care about their communities. So if your ever done with questioning my mental state, and might be interested in how the State uses the mental health system to torture, kidnap and ‘unintentionally negatively outcome’ citizens, feel free to ask.
I guess I’ll wish you well with your ‘recovery’, and pray that you remain ‘drug free’ and perhaps your ability to focus will return at some point.
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